NBA / NCAA Basketball

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Adam Silver said the quality of basketball in the bubble is actually better than it was before, which he attributes to players not having to travel. The NBA season is well known to wear down players, to the point where sometimes coaches basically give up on certain road games and rest their starters, because they know they don't have enough left in the tank to play that well. In the bubble, everyone gets plenty of rest, no long hours on planes, time differences, etc.

Speaking of basketball and the pandemic, I didn't know Fauci was a star player in HS. I wouldn't have guessed it, as he's only 5'7" tall.
 
Celtics got the sweep and Kemba has come good in the play-offs. Raptors are a much tougher proposition than the Sixers, probably tougher than Milwaukee at the moment, and the loss of Hayward is going to hurt. Kyle Lowry might be injured, have to wait and see. They're two teams which don't currently have one or two stand out all-stars (although arguably Tatum, Brown and Kemba are playing like it at the moment) but have lots of guys who can get points if needed. That Raptors bench is scary good when it comes to scoring (Powell and Ibaka have to be the best second unit in the NBA at the moment, surely?), but the Celtics bench has been great at shutting down offences and Wannamaker is about a clutch as you can get on the break. I reckon it's going to be a really interesting series, that'll probably go to 7 games, and hopefully the Celtics take it. I think that 22-point game on the 8th was just an anomaly (although I'd like to believe it wasn't).
 
Loved how the NBA managed the bubble and the whole COVID-19 situations.
But loved even more their clear stance on racism and players boycotting yesterday's games.

Lakers and Clippers apparently ready to boycott the remainder of the playoffs.
Agreed. On both counts but especially the bold.

It's a strike, rather than a boycott. Discussing the difference and why it's important is likely going to run into breaking the rules, so I won't.
 
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The postseason goes on. The players learned that if it were cancelled, they would lose a lot of money. Same as they would have if they had been honest about what China is doing to Hong Kong. Very few people are willing to give up anything actually important to them--including money they don't even need to live a decent life--to make a statement about others. NBA players are no different.

Players’ association executives Chris Paul and Andre Iguodala explained the financial ramifications of bailing on the season, detailing how the CBA could get torn up by the owners and place them in a position of decreased salaries moving forward, sources said.
https://sports.yahoo.com/after-a-night-of-rest-players-vote-to-resume-nba-playoffs-164227334.html
 
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The postseason goes on. The players learned that if it were cancelled, they would lose a lot of money. Same as they would have if they had been honest about what China is doing to Hong Kong. Very few people are willing to give up anything actually important to them--including money they don't even need to live a decent life--to make a statement about others. NBA players are no different.



https://sports.yahoo.com/after-a-night-of-rest-players-vote-to-resume-nba-playoffs-164227334.html
Yes I heard that the players voted to complete the playoffs. No surprise. The surprise would be the opposite. With players coming off contract and whatever it could be a career changer for them if they didn't keep playing especially players lower down the ladder.
 
Utah and Denver go to a game 7. I thought the Jazz had it wrapped up after a few convincing wins but good comeback by Denver in the previous two games. Wouldn't have picked the Celtics to beat Toronto either. Some people think Miami might trouble the Bucks. Be surprised if they won the series.
 
Utah and Denver go to a game 7. I thought the Jazz had it wrapped up after a few convincing wins but good comeback by Denver in the previous two games. Wouldn't have picked the Celtics to beat Toronto either. Some people think Miami might trouble the Bucks. Be surprised if they won the series.
I picked the Celtics, but not with a performance like that. Never behind, literally never in the whole game, +50% on 3's from Marcus and Kemba, Jayson shooting 50% from the field, Kemba 55% and Marcus 60%! Jaylen's shooting was a little off, however the way the Celtics are set up that doesn't matter. Someone isn't quite on the rhythm so other people spread the load. They're absolutely firing at the moment and the defence is too. I think I'm right in saying that all 5 starters for Toronto were still in single digit points into the 3rd. I don't expect it to continue, but getting the first win in a series is always great.


Lots of people are down on the Bucks when it comes to the play-offs. They haven't won a conference since 1974 but they've had 11 attempts. They then look at the success Miami have had, but I think they forget that Miami's success was down to have 3 of the best players to grace a basketball court. I'd also be surprised in Miami won the series, but I think they could take the Bucks to 6 or 7 games.
 
I agree that some/most of the decision to continue probably came down to money/future money, but they also had to consider what ending the season would do for their voice at this time.
I think it's an incredibly simplistic way to look at it, especially considering it was essentially a wildcat strike by the Bucks with no defined goals. Usually strikes are about better circumstances for those striking but that's not really the case here (arguably a bit for many of them but not in the way strikes usually are). This wasn't a lockout due to players wanting more money etc. Money will no doubt play a part, but the disparity in NBA wages is high and breaking the CBA leaves players open to legal action and would likely invalidate all their contracts, so the guaranteed money is out the window. Sure, the likes of LeBron, Giannis and Kawhi will be fine, but there's plenty of players who are not multi-millionaires and are on rookie or short term contracts or coming out of contract. It also would affect non-playing staff if the CBA had to be re-negotiated and could easily lead to a lockout, which affects service staff working at venues. The players wouldn't just be sacrificing their money, they could well be sacrificing the livelihoods of many other people.

Now we've had chance to hear what has actually come out of the action, rather than take a single quote out of context, I think the players were extremely successful when they had no goals that drove the initial strike:

Franchise owned venues are to be used for voting if possible or other services such as voter registration etc.

A social justice coalition will be formed between the NBA, players, coaches etc. to advocate for their goals and promote civic engagement.

Advertising space is going to be set aside during every play-off game to promote civic engagement, raise awareness on voter registration etc.



Lets also not forget that NBA players are also well known for their civic engagement and charity. LeBron built a school and provides scholarships to graduates, Jayson Tatum has a program providing diapers for low income families in Boston, Zion Williamson paid the wages of the venue staff for, I think, a week when the league first shut down. Unsurprisingly a lot of their charity is aimed at the underprivileged, in which BIPOC people are over-represented. Losing money means less to charity, less people helping and setting up charities and could ultimately cause much more harm to the people they want to help.
 
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Ending the season or not even starting the playoffs would have had much more impact but with falling ratings and many of the lower tier players looking for new contracts etc it was never going to happen even if the elite players were willing to do it. That would have been a huge hit for the league and they would have risked losing even more of their audience.

The NFL starts in two weeks, it will be interesting to see how that goes with the ratings but also with Covid...............
 
Nightmare scenario again for the Rockets. OKC forcing a game 7. That game plus the Denver/Jazz game will be tough. Utah will b desperate not to go out in round one again after leading the series 3-1. Good win for Miami over the Bucks.
 
I think it's an incredibly simplistic way to look at it, especially considering it was essentially a wildcat strike by the Bucks with no defined goals. Usually strikes are about better circumstances for those striking but that's not really the case here (arguably a bit for many of them but not in the way strikes usually are). This wasn't a lockout due to players wanting more money etc. Money will no doubt play a part, but the disparity in NBA wages is high and breaking the CBA leaves players open to legal action and would likely invalidate all their contracts, so the guaranteed money is out the window. Sure, the likes of LeBron, Giannis and Kawhi will be fine, but there's plenty of players who are not multi-millionaires and are on rookie or short term contracts or coming out of contract. It also would affect non-playing staff if the CBA had to be re-negotiated and could easily lead to a lockout, which affects service staff working at venues. The players wouldn't just be sacrificing their money, they could well be sacrificing the livelihoods of many other people.

Now we've had chance to hear what has actually come out of the action, rather than take a single quote out of context, I think the players were extremely successful when they had no goals that drove the initial strike:

Franchise owned venues are to be used for voting if possible or other services such as voter registration etc.

A social justice coalition will be formed between the NBA, players, coaches etc. to advocate for their goals and promote civic engagement.

Advertising space is going to be set aside during every play-off game to promote civic engagement, raise awareness on voter registration etc.



Lets also not forget that NBA players are also well known for their civic engagement and charity. LeBron built a school and provides scholarships to graduates, Jayson Tatum has a program providing diapers for low income families in Boston, Zion Williamson paid the wages of the venue staff for, I think, a week when the league first shut down. Unsurprisingly a lot of their charity is aimed at the underprivileged, in which BIPOC people are over-represented. Losing money means less to charity, less people helping and setting up charities and could ultimately cause much more harm to the people they want to help.
Of course it was simplistic, it was only one sentence. My point was in response to those who posted before me talking about the money/future money/ CBA, that they would also lose some of their voice if they ended the season, plus they run the risk of some people never listening to them again.

That being said, I agree with your point about not stating their specific goals*, but IMO, it was at least effective in getting a few more people to pay attention. I said that about Kaep: OK, kneeling has made the initial point now move the conversation forward.

*The overall goal is obvious at this point I hope.

Not to play semantics, but I'm not sure that strike is the correct word either. I would probably lean toward protest, but...
 
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Of course it was simplistic, it was only one sentence. My point was in response to those who posted before me talking about the money/future money/ CBA, that they would also lose some of their voice if they ended the season, plus they run the risk of some people never listening to them again.

That being said, I agree with your point about not stating their specific goals*, but IMO, it was at least effective in getting a few more people to pay attention. I said that about Kaep: OK, kneeling has made the initial point now move the conversation forward.

*The overall goal is obvious at this point I hope.

Not to play semantics, but I'm not sure that strike is the correct word either. I would probably lean toward protest, but...
Sorry, the simplistic part wasn't really aimed at your post, more the general assessment people have been making that it was all about money. Essentially I was agreeing with you and the rest was an expansion on that.

Yes, the overall goal is obvious, but the specific aims of the strike were never defined (it clearly wasn't going to achieve the overall goal on its own), probably because there weren't any. My point there was more that they have managed to affect change, rather than just make a statement, which is impressive.

They withheld labour, it was definitely a strike, even if they didn't call it that. A protest would have been turning up but refusing to play, or not putting in effort. It is important too as the CBA does not allow them to strike. Unfotunately a discussion of that will probably fall foul of the GRAPES rule.
 
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Sorry, the simplistic part wasn't really aimed at your post, more the general assessment people have been making that it was all about money. Essentially I was agreeing with you and the rest was an expansion on that.

Yes, the overall goal is obvious, but the specific aims of the strike were never defined (it clearly wasn't going to achieve the overall goal on its own), probably because there weren't any. My point there was more that they have managed to affect change, rather than just make a statement, which is impressive.

They withheld labour, it was definitely a strike, even if they didn't call it that. A protest would have been turning up but refusing to play, or not putting in effort. It is important too as the CBA does not allow them to strike. Unfotunately a discussion of that will probably fall foul of the GRAPES rule.
Avoiding GRAPES, they aren't taking action on their own behalf or on the behalf of others in their industry, they are taking action on the behalf of people who have less (little to no) voice of their own that's why its not really a strike IMO.

Put another way, they didn't withhold labor to make their NBA employment better.
 
Avoiding GRAPES, they aren't taking action on their own behalf or on the behalf of others in their industry, they are taking action on the behalf of people who have less (little to no) voice of their own that's why its not really a strike IMO.

Put another way, they didn't withhold labor to make their NBA employment better.
No, but they still withheld labour. In the UK we would refer to a similar situation (although not the same) as a sympathy/solidarity strike, where one group holds a strike in support of another group (who are also striking, that's where the difference is). It's a wildcat strike because there was no approval from the overall group (players union). Their intentions may have been very different to what people usually strike about (which is the point I was making in my previous post), but it's still a strike and that's what opens them up to much worse consequences than just losing the pro-rated money for the games they would have not played.
 
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Utah go out in a close one. needless to say, Utah missed Bogdanovich. Celtics go 2-0 against the Raptors which surprises me a little. The Bucks need to get back on track against the Heat and Houston will be desperate to finish off OKC after their previous disappointments in the playoffs. A Lakers/Houston series could be an interesting one.
 
Bucks are turning the ball over (getting it stolen) far too often and they don't look good without Giannis.

Toronto look in trouble. Siakam, VanVleet and Lowry need to step up in the next game. Smart was incredible in that 4thQ and Tatum is just getting better and better. Also very glad to see RW3 playing great too, I think he's the future for Celtics bigs. Theis still can't catch breaks and gets penalised for breathing on people... Oh, Boston haven't lost a game yet in the play-offs. They look great so far and that's without Hayward.
 
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