No doping controls??

This makes JTL's performances even more interesting. The 27 year old who barely had a single CQ point at 25 is now destroying the sport's most talented athletes in a race in which there are no doping controls.

Great to see Dan Martin protest. Also note that he called Locke's win in Tour of Med "unbelievable".
 
Jul 24, 2010
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maltiv said:
This makes JTL's performances even more interesting. The 27 year old who barely had a single CQ point at 25 is now destroying the sport's most talented athletes in a race in which there are no doping controls.

Great to see Dan Martin protest. Also note that he called Locke's win in Tour of Med "unbelievable".
You're making an awful lot of assumptions about Dan's tweets.

"Unbelievable" can be used as a compliment.

Maybe Dan is making a joke that HE has gone two races without being tested, and that makes a change. Point being we don't know, so it's daft to suggest he is making a protest about JTL.
 
Mar 12, 2009
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What makes dan Martin the voice on doping in the peloton?

Fwiw endura and indeed tiernan Locke are bike pure.

This has only rankled me as why should I believe dan Martin or anyone on garmin if they have dekker, millar or danielson?
 
stefrees said:
What makes dan Martin the voice on doping in the peloton?

Fwiw endura and indeed tiernan Locke are bike pure.

This has only rankled me as why should I believe dan Martin or anyone on garmin if they have dekker, millar or danielson?
Nobody is saying he is the voice.
 

Dr. Maserati

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stefrees said:
What makes dan Martin the voice on doping in the peloton?

Fwiw endura and indeed tiernan Locke are bike pure.

This has only rankled me as why should I believe dan Martin or anyone on garmin if they have dekker, millar or danielson?
Well thats a rather odd position - because Dan Martin is a member of Bike Pure too.

Martin isn't the voice on doping (or anti-doping ;) ) either - he just tweeted his frustration, which is actually what one would expect from someone with nothing to hide. The question is why have more Pro's not voiced concern.
 
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Dr. Maserati said:
Well thats a rather odd position - because Dan Martin is a member of Bike Pure too.

Martin isn't the voice on doping (or anti-doping ;) ) either - he just tweeted his frustration, which is actually what one would expect from someone with nothing to hide. The question is why have more Pro's not voiced concern.
So, in your terms, the fact tiernan Locke has performed well, immediately makes you assume he is juiced?
 
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gooner said:
Well one thing we shouldnt do and that is we shouldnt be criticising him for flagging this thing up.
So therefore anyone can now be beaten, and say so and so's performance was unbeatable, and we now view them as suspicious? I'm sorry I'm all for anti doping but your taking dan martins tweets as gospel here
 

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stefrees said:
So, in your terms, the fact tiernan Locke has performed well, immediately makes you assume he is juiced?
Due to the fact I never even commented on Tiernan Lockes performance..... then the answer is quite simply no.
 

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stefrees said:
So therefore anyone can now be beaten, and say so and so's performance was unbeatable, and we now view them as suspicious? I'm sorry I'm all for anti doping but your taking dan martins tweets as gospel here
Hold on - you are the one who is upset because of what someone here said (mativ), which is probably misinterpreting DMs tweet.

And you are not really in a position to make comments on what makes people "suspicious" if you use their association with riders on their team.
 
stefrees said:
So therefore anyone can now be beaten, and say so and so's performance was unbeatable, and we now view them as suspicious? I'm sorry I'm all for anti doping but your taking dan martins tweets as gospel here
Did Dan Martin comment on JTL?

Or did he just say that there were no tests?
 
Jul 24, 2010
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We don't know what Martin's tweet meant, and we certainly have no evidence he was suggesting anything at all about Tiernan-Locke.

Two things.
1. The idea that JTL has come out of absolutely nowhere isn't quite true. He was a very talented youngster who was struck down with a very severe illness, and was out of racing for a number of years because of it. He came back to ride a British calendar, which is the exact opposite sort of racing that suits him. When he did get a chance to ride more suitable races (vuelta a leon, tour of britain etc) he performed just about every time.

2. I think people are going slightly overboard in rating JTL's performances thus far this year. He has of course been very impressive, but at this point of the season form/fitness can carry a rider a long way (Porte, Richie).
 
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Obviously the pro peloton is now so clean that the UCI dont need to bother with testing :rolleyes:

IMO when a pro calls another pro's performance 'unbelievable' it generally is ;), history of the sport has also shown this to be true.

That does not mean JTL is doping but it does raise a suspicion.
 
hatcher said:
The idea that JTL has come out of absolutely nowhere isn't quite true. He was a very talented youngster who was struck down with a very severe illness, and was out of racing for a number of years because of it. He came back to ride a British calendar, which is the exact opposite sort of racing that suits him. When he did get a chance to ride more suitable races (vuelta a leon, tour of britain etc) he performed just about every time.
This has become the standard excuse for everybody who does come out of nowhere :eek:

Not saying JTL dopes or anything. He got a couple of great victories early in the season against less than stellar fields, and his performance, while surprising, is still in line with what he had shown before.
 
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hrotha said:
This has become the standard excuse for everybody who does come out of nowhere :eek:

Not saying JTL dopes or anything. He got a couple of great victories early in the season against less than stellar fields, and his performance, while surprising, is still in line with what he had shown before.
It is, but that doesn't stop it from being a legitimate reason why someone would seemingly come out of nowhere. With Tiernan-Locke it has been in the cycling press for at least 2 years that he was off his bike for a good 3 years with mono, and we've seen what mono can do to riders.

When all settles down, and all riders have decent fitness + form, I think we'll discover JTL is a good, solid rider, not an all conquering force.
 
Well having watched JTLs performance today, "unbelievable" is the only word I can think of as well. He wasnt just the best guy in the race but the best by miles, it looked like he was playing with the rest of the peloton. I understand not everyone is in top fitness at the moment but for him to be so far ahead of everyone having had zero predigree beforehand is just unreal. I dont really care if he missed seasons or not, to perfrom like that is simply amazing. If it was someone like Nicolas Roche who suddenly started racing like this, I would be equally suspicious and Roche has a lot better palmares than JTL to go on.

Yes he is a signed up member of Bikepure and I would truly love it if he is doing it properly as it would mean the peloton is indeed very clean but I guess almost 25 years of following this sport had made me too cynical to be confident in that. This is like Froome at the Vuelta last year, almost too good to be true. I guess only time will tell what the truth is.
 
Disagree. It's not as hilariously ridiculous as Chris Froome just yet.

If he wins the hilly stage in Murcía, then stomps everybody by a minute in the time trial, then we can talk about it being as hilariously ridiculous as Chris Froome. But not until.
 
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pmcg76 said:
Well having watched JTLs performance today, "unbelievable" is the only word I can think of as well. He wasnt just the best guy in the race but the best by miles, it looked like he was playing with the rest of the peloton. I understand not everyone is in top fitness at the moment but for him to be so far ahead of everyone having had zero predigree beforehand is just unreal. I dont really care if he missed seasons or not, to perfrom like that is simply amazing. If it was someone like Nicolas Roche who suddenly started racing like this, I would be equally suspicious and Roche has a lot better palmares than JTL to go on.

Yes he is a signed up member of Bikepure and I would truly love it if he is doing it properly as it would mean the peloton is indeed very clean but I guess almost 25 years of following this sport had made me too cynical to be confident in that. This is like Froome at the Vuelta last year, almost too good to be true. I guess only time will tell what the truth is.
Do your homework.
 
Libertine Seguros said:
Disagree. It's not as hilariously ridiculous as Chris Froome just yet.

If he wins the hilly stage in Murcía, then stomps everybody by a minute in the time trial, then we can talk about it being as hilariously ridiculous as Chris Froome. But not until.
Keep in mind that Froome was actually a respectable professional bike rider before his Vuelta, with decent results such as being top 15 in a TDF time trial at a very young age. Results aren't everything either as Froome also had done some very decent domestique work too. JTL, on the other hand, isn't even a professional and had barely collected a single CQ point before the end of last year. Of course those are small races he is winning but the competition isn't that bad and the easy in which he wins is just ridiculous. I haven't seen anything like this since Ricco sprinted up mountains in 2008 without even opening his mouth.
 
User Guide said:
Do your homework.
Lol. if 5th place in the Tour of Britain, 5th place in the RAS and 2nd in the Vuelta A Leon is your definition of a good palmares, then every cyclist on the planet must have a good palmares. Please dont make me laugh.

If that had been Gedeminas Bagdonas that was stopming everyone, do you think nobody would have been asking questions.
 
maltiv said:
Keep in mind that Froome was actually a respectable professional bike rider before his Vuelta, with decent results such as being top 15 in a TDF time trial at a very young age. Results aren't everything either as Froome also had done some very decent domestique work too. JTL, on the other hand, isn't even a professional and had barely collected a single CQ point before the end of last year. Of course those are small races he is winning but the competition isn't that bad and the easy in which he wins is just ridiculous. I haven't seen anything like this since Ricco sprinted up mountains in 2008 without even opening his mouth.
Froome's best mountain performance to that point was in an uphill sprint in Romandie. Elsewhere he'd managed a top 10 on Mont Faron - in February '08 - and a top 10 in an MTF in the Brixia Tour, behind such lauded climbers as Fabio Taborre. People pointed out about his performance in the Alpe d'Huez stage in '08 at the time as a justification of him always having that ability, but Johan van Summeren was also in the group at that point, and you bet that if people like Taborre and van Summeren start shedding people like Rodríguez and Nibali out the back door on GT MTFs I'll wet myself laughing.

As a UK domestic pro, Tiernan-Locke has not had the chance to do races like this that suit him. The UK domestic scene is full of flat races, crits and occasionally moderately hilly one-day races. Froome on the other hand had been part of the pro circuit for five years, and proven very little.

And for added comedy value, you had people going on about how obviously Cobo was doping and cheating the clean Chris Froome out of a GT. Hours of fun.
 
Libertine Seguros said:
Froome's best mountain performance to that point was in an uphill sprint in Romandie. Elsewhere he'd managed a top 10 on Mont Faron - in February '08 - and a top 10 in an MTF in the Brixia Tour, behind such lauded climbers as Fabio Taborre. People pointed out about his performance in the Alpe d'Huez stage in '08 at the time as a justification of him always having that ability, but Johan van Summeren was also in the group at that point, and you bet that if people like Taborre and van Summeren start shedding people like Rodríguez and Nibali out the back door on GT MTFs I'll wet myself laughing.

As a UK domestic pro, Tiernan-Locke has not had the chance to do races like this that suit him. The UK domestic scene is full of flat races, crits and occasionally moderately hilly one-day races. Froome on the other hand had been part of the pro circuit for five years, and proven very little.

And for added comedy value, you had people going on about how obviously Cobo was doping and cheating the clean Chris Froome out of a GT. Hours of fun.
I know, but my point is that even Froome's results before his breakthrough were so much better than JTL's that it's downright ridiculous.

Races that suit him...well, as he won an almost completely flat stage in Tour of Med last week by attacking in the final kilometers I can't imagine there are any races on the local scene in Britain which doesn't suit him when all he needs is a small hill to get an enormous gap on a bunch of professionals.
 

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