Nordic Skiing/Biathlon Thread

[OJRvE]

Diggins fastest Ski time today. She said she “finally got a pair of ski that matched her body”.

Karlsson said she felt bad and a bit stressed in the beginning but when she got caught it was shoulder down and she could ski into the race. She praised Pärmäkoski who she said was super strong.

 

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At least guys like Roethe and Moch gained a ton of time on Klaebo today.
Did nobody tell the Norwegians that the pure stage time counte for the gc?

I don't know what you are on about, the FIS website is telling me it was a 'tactical masterclass' by Klaebo.

well, he saved energy, won, and is still likely to have 1+ minute on all lightweights heading into Alpe Cermis. I struggle to see the issue for Klaebo, to be honest.

Last year Moch gained 15s on him, and he currently is 1 minute behind, and will lose another one the next two races.

 

[KZD]

Karlsson was ruthless in the end and I mean that in the best possible way. Raced at a more moderate pace at the start, let Pärmakoski (who had a big incentive to gain time on the gc) and Weng do the work, followed Pärmakoski when the later dropped the 2 Norwegians and then dropped her with one brutal acceleration on the final lap. Sure, Krista being further down on the gc and having to gain time helped her a lot, but that was a really smart race and in the end she was one of the strongest besides her.

I agree with you that actually having the gc gaps at the start of the pursuit would have added a lot to the men's race today.

Not that sure about Pellegrino, he's a lot better in mass starts than in individual starts and the shorter, steep hills in Val di Fiemme and the final Zorzi climb should be good for him. He was also already decent for a sprinter on the Alpe Cermis last year against a clearly stronger field (top 20) and he and Cramer have worked a lot on his ability as a distance skier. I mean, he's not gonna finish on the podium, but I expect a really respectable result for him in the end.

When I said that the 15k mass-start would be a bit too long for Pellegrino, I was actually comparing him to Klaebo. If Golberg has a bad day on Saturday (and I kind of expect that) then there is actually a good chance that Pellgrino finishes the Tour de Ski on the podium because Golberg is not a good climber. There are always skiers that can overtake him on the final climb but only Krüger has been showing a great shape so far and the mass-start format should help him too.

Karlsson was superb today but Pärmakoski was above my expectations and made sure that there is still a race for first place. As for Diggins, she should learn to keep her mouth shut sometimes.

 

[Mayomaniac]

Diggins fastest Ski time today. She said she “finally got a pair of ski that matched her body”.

Karlsson said she felt bad and a bit stressed in the beginning but when she got caught it was shoulder down and she could ski into the race. She praised Pärmäkoski who she said was super strong.

Lol, all the Americans had rockets on their feet yesterday, but she had bad skis, right...
That said, something was surely off with her to miss the top 30 in the opening tracks on a course that is great for her.

 

[Mayomaniac]

When I said that the 15k mass-start would be a bit too long for Pellegrino, I was actually comparing him to Klaebo. If Golberg has a bad day on Saturday (and I kind of expect that) then there is actually a good chance that Pellgrino finishes the Tour de Ski on the podium because Golberg is not a good climber. There are always skiers that can overtake him on the final climb but only Krüger has been showing a great shape so far and the mass-start format should help him too.

Karlsson was superb today but Pärmakoski was above my expectations and made sure that there is still a race for first place. As for Diggins, she should learn to keep her mouth shut sometimes.

I don't know, Krüger will likely finish ahead of Pellegrino and if guys like Toenseth and Holund aren't too far behind after the sprint they could also still overtake him, since they are good classic skiers who are also good on the Alpe Cermis. Last year Toenseth gained 41 sec on him on the Alpe Cermis, but at the same time I also feel like this version of Pellegrino is much stronger than the one we saw last year. A top 15 result on the Alpe Cermis stage wouldn't surprise me at all, he finished 16th 2 years ago when he climbed it for the first time and the field was kinda similar (with all the Norwegians missing instead of the Russians).

 

[OJRvE]

Her V1 uphill looked better uphill after she got caught/she looked less tense. Her pacing seems to be better in longer races, that has to be said.

It seems to be a pattern, she is more relaxed when skiing with others. It’s definitely something that she needs to work with.

As for pacing, I think it is that longer races suits her better - there is a need of fast pace all the race in the 10k and that’s why she sometimes opens to hard. If she would ski a 10k at her 20k pace she wouldn’t win even if she put in a sprint in the end. For sure there is a middle of the road here but often it’s actually the start the gets her to the podium/win .

 

[Mayomaniac]

On the women's side Eiduka and Urevc are probably the biggest revelations of the last 2 days. I know that Eiduka is very talented, but I always saw Urevc as yet another sprinter, never knew that she was this good of a distance racer and she actually did tons of work in the chasing group today.

 

[Mayomaniac]

It seems to be a pattern, she is more relaxed when skiing with others. It’s definitely something that she needs to work with.

As for pacing, I think it is that longer races suits her better - there is a need of fast pace all the race in the 10k and that’s why she sometimes opens to hard. If she would ski a 10k at her 20k pace she wouldn’t win even if she put in a sprint in the end. For sure there is a middle of the road here but often it’s actually the start the gets her to the podium/win .

The armchair warrior in me thinks that she should probably try negative splits. I don't know if starting to fast is in anyway beneficial, from a mental aspect it has to be hard to still keep a good pace when you realize that you have to slow down a bit and pushing on on top of the climbs and accelerating becomes more difficult.

 

[BullsFan22]

On the women's side Eiduka and Urevc are probably the biggest revelations of the last 2 days. I know that Eiduka is very talented, but I always saw Urevc as yet another sprinter, never knew that she was this good of a distance racer and she actually did tons of work in the chasing group today.

She’s not a good distance racer. These results are out of the blue, but good for her. Slovenia desperately needs a competitive skier now that Lampič left.

Diggins moving up is not a surprise. Her blaming the skis is not surprising, that’s almost always been the case, she and her coaches either don’t get it or don’t want to admit it that her technique is awful and she’s not capable of adjusting to tougher conditions.

Karlsson now with a comfortable lead. She can even afford a slip up in the sprint and still be in the driver’s seat. I’d like to see Stadlober fighting for the podium, but she’ll lose time in the sprint, unfortunately.

 

[Mayomaniac]

She’s not a good distance racer. These results are out of the blue, but good for her. Slovenia desperately needs a competitive skier now that Lampič left.

Diggins moving up is not a surprise. Her blaming the skis is not surprising, that’s almost always been the case, she and her coaches either don’t get it or don’t want to admit it that her technique is awful and she’s not capable of adjusting to tougher conditions.

Karlsson now with a comfortable lead. She can even afford a slip up in the sprint and still be in the driver’s seat. I’d like to see Stadlober fighting for the podium, but she’ll lose time in the sprint, unfortunately.

That was one of the only times I've actually seen Stadlober gaining groud and dropping others from a group on the final sprint climb. She looked like she was at her limit for a long time, but at the end she had something left in the tank.

 

[OJRvE]

The armchair warrior in me thinks that she should probably try negative splits. I don't know if starting to fast is in anyway beneficial, from a mental aspect it has to be hard to still keep a good pace when you realize that you have to slow down a bit and pushing on on top of the climbs and accelerating becomes more difficult.

I would say skiing is little bit different to say running because you have the downhills to recover and the complex technique. Often you can gain a lot pushing a higher gear when you are fresh compared to saving the energy to late in the race. It’s always the balance of course and it’s true Karlsson started to hard many times, but my feeling is she never lost a podium because of it, those days the shape simply wasn’t there. In form she should be able to go very fast in the first climb then recover and find a pace that she could hold for the rest of race. I think both Beitostölen and Lillehammer are examples of that. She started fast and the almost immediately dropped down to a pace which corresponded to her final position.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

On the women's side Eiduka and Urevc are probably the biggest revelations of the last 2 days. I know that Eiduka is very talented, but I always saw Urevc as yet another sprinter, never knew that she was this good of a distance racer and she actually did tons of work in the chasing group today.

If she was Norwegian/Swedish/Finnish/Russian, maybe also American, Pace would already be a star. I rate her base talent very highly.

 

[DonAragona]

You saw why they have the pursuit in the middle of the tour...it's to stop the leader from deciding the Tour prior to Alpe Cemis.

It works for the men and, whilst boring, it suddenly keeps the men's tour alive. Yes, it was boring but I much prefer a tight tour to one with the bonus seconds flying everywhere. Klaebo doesn't yet have the tour in the bag...

Equal distances have killed the women's tour, had today been 10k the two Norweigian girls would still be in touch with Karlsson.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

You saw why they have the pursuit in the middle of the tour...it's to stop the leader from deciding the Tour prior to Alpe Cemis.

It works for the men and, whilst boring, it suddenly keeps the men's tour alive. Yes, it was boring but I much prefer a tight tour to one with the bonus seconds flying everywhere. Klaebo doesn't yet have the tour in the bag...

Equal distances have killed the women's tour, had today been 10k the two Norweigian girls would still be in touch with Karlsson.

Yea, but I'll gladly take Karlsson having a decent sized lead as a trade-off for actually getting some decent distance races rather than ones where we're seeing sprinters duking out the win. There's already almost half the calendar given to sprints without giving the distance races to the sprinters too. The Tour is one of the only ways the World Cup balance gets redressed. And unfortunately with (Heidi) Weng undercooked, not enough classic distance for the Finns, the Russians banned, Diggins only showing her first signs of life today (she seems to really like this 20k skate pursuit format, she had a great race from deep in the field in Ruka in the 20k skate pursuit too - or maybe it's just that (whisper it so ES don't hear) she's just not that good in Classic) and no Ebba Andersson, Frida's been left with limited competition from distance skiers. Kalvaa is having an amazing season but you'd usually back Frida to beat her nine times out of ten, no?

 

[OJRvE]

Kalvaa out with Covid. Such a shame, she missed the Olympics last year because of that too.

 

[Mayomaniac]

Kalvaa out with Covid. Such a shame, she missed the Olympics last year because of that too.

Momo also out with a fever, apparently he was feeling sick since monday.

Something else, it's interesting how pretty much all the Italian men besides Graz are better classic distance skiers than skating ones. Rather atypical for central Europe. I guess this has to do a bit with the heavy focus on sprints in their training over the last few years and classic sprinting technique translating better to distance racing than the skating technique, but maybe I'm wrong.

 

[BullsFan22]

Momo also out with a fever, apparently he was feeling sick since monday.

Something else, it's interesting how pretty much all the Italian men besides Graz are better classic distance skiers than skating ones. Rather atypical for central Europe. I guess this has to do a bit with the heavy focus on sprints in their training over the last few years and classic sprinting technique translating better to distance racing than the skating technique, but maybe I'm wrong.

Manificat should just retire. Is he really expecting to compete and be competitive until the next Olympics, when he’ll be almost 40?

 

[OJRvE]

Something else, it's interesting how pretty much all the Italian men besides Graz are better classic distance skiers than skating ones. Rather atypical for central Europe. I guess this has to do a bit with the heavy focus on sprints in their training over the last few years and classic sprinting technique translating better to distance racing than the skating technique, but maybe I'm wrong.

How popular is Marcialonga in Italy? I know the startfield is huge but I guess it’s mostly Scandinavians on Italian vaccation. Otherwise I was thinking a great race like this in classic technique might be an inspiration. Your sprint theory makes sense as well.

 

[Mayomaniac]

How popular is Marcialonga in Italy? I know the startfield is huge but I guess it’s mostly Scandinavians on Italian vaccation. Otherwise I was thinking a great race like this in classic technique might be an inspiration. Your sprint theory makes sense as well.

Yeah, while the Tentino has a decent amateur skiing scene that also carries many of the ski marathons in South Tyrol, the Marcialonga has a really big international field and it's lots of Scandinavians.
Maybe some old fashioned coaches in the youth ranks who put lots of emphasis on proper classic technique, but I guess the focus on the sprint team in recent years is the main reason.

 

[Mayomaniac]

Ok, the main takeaways from today is that Calle seems to be in monster shape. He made it close in the final.

Mocellini confirmed his podium, the guy has a brutal top speed on the finishing straight.

That corner on top of the short climb after the long descent is just too narrow, at this point they should try something different.

 

[KZD]

I know that we are used to see JT Boe with the best ski times day after day but gaining 55 seconds on Lægreid in 10k with one miss each is just crazy strong.

 

[BigCoward]

I know that we are used to see JT Boe with the best ski times day after day but gaining 55 seconds on Lægreid in 10k with one miss each is just crazy strong.

I just saw that, *** madness, he could have missed 3 in a sprint and nearly beat his brother shooting clean.

 

[BigCoward]

I know there are no Russians, and everyone hates him blah blah blah, but Klaebe is a *** beast.
I used to think Bjoergen had a record that would last 1000 years, now I'm not sure? All time victories he is well over half way there, and just approaching his prime.

 

[BullsFan22]

I know there are no Russians, and everyone hates him blah blah blah, but Klaebe is a *** beast.
I used to think Bjoergen had a record that would last 1000 years, now I'm not sure? All time victories he is well over half way there, and just approaching his prime.

33 year old Halfvarsson was his closest pursuer today. He’s got no competition without the Russians.

 

[BigCoward]

FFS, why is the final stage not a pursuit again? It's the whole point of the week.