NYTimes article on Georgie as witness..

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Jun 19, 2009
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JPM London said:
Not sure if they changed the wording in the meantime, but in any case the article currently says road stage - which would be correct AFAIK. 1984 was indeed TTT and 1985 was ITT, no? In 86 they both won stages, but Phinney much earlier in the race if I'm not mistaken...
Haha, they have indeed updated it to includ the word "road" - a small but important distinction.
Good that it was picked up and corrected.

I also notice they changed a line that said a sanction could be completely removed.
 
Jun 13, 2010
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TubularBills said:
Good on Joe for his harmless jab at self deprecation.

I was going to pull the trigger as well, until I realized we were being taken.

"Unimpeachable?"

"Joe Papp, a former professional cyclist and convicted steroid trafficker turned antidoping advocate, said Hincapie’s word would be “unimpeachable” and “will finally lead people to the point where they don’t believe Lance is innocent anymore.”

I'll bet his honor too.

"a former professional cyclist and convicted steroid trafficker turned antidoping advocate"

I like his 'credibility.'

+ he offers the (losers) inside scoop, the Forum should embrace his 'flailing attempt at redemption.'

:D

JP... well played. & in a Global newspaper! - one of the forums finest*!

*Accolades dismissed for being a self perpetuating pharmacist.
I DO greatly respect Joe's input to The Clinic!
 
Jul 12, 2012
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Perhaps the point others were trying to make is that while the NYT article was about the difficulty Hincapie's testimony would pose for Armstrong, it largely sidesteps the obvious: Hincapie doped on the same level as Armstrong.
 
May 7, 2009
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Berzin said:
The theme throughout the Hincapie piece is that we should all feel sorry for him, a good guy who fell into a bad situation.

Yet years later, he still makes public statements about Armstrong and how he's done so much for the sport instead of just being quiet.

Strip Hincapie of his fake halo, and you'll see what he truly was-an opportunist who reveled in the vapors of Armstrong's ridiculous Tour run and did what he could to take advantage of the reputation he's garnered as the peloton's "Captain America".

With his constant "no comments" to the media he's just trying to insulate himself as much as possible once the truth ever comes out. Because then we'll see the true Hincapie, an unrepentant serial doper who did nothing but hide behind his good-guy demeanor.
All good points. George made a lot of $$$ off of being Lance's right-hand man.
Clothing company and cycling-based community in South Carolina.
 
sartain said:
I DO greatly respect Joe's input to The Clinic!
Thanks! I enjoy contributing to the civilized and respectful (if sometimes intense/emotional) debates here, and am always happy to share my experiences and insights. And I certainly welcome constructive criticism or feedback that conflicts with whatever position I've stated, as long as it's delivered in good humor, without rancor or snark. I also

Turner29 said:
Perhaps the point others were trying to make is that while the NYT article was about the difficulty Hincapie's testimony would pose for Armstrong, it largely sidesteps the obvious: Hincapie doped on the same level as Armstrong.
This is true in that the piece does not indict Hincapie but again, I think that's because it's a story that's being told incrementally, for the benefit of readers infinitely less-sophisticated than you and other Clinic contributors. You could argue that journalists should start beating the drum for Hincapie's dope-accelerated funeral as a professional cyclist, but without the facts of his grand jury testimony on-the-record, and barring a direct admission from him now, how are they going to write that story and source it legitimately?

We know that he wouldve had to dope along w/ Armstrong in order to testify about Armstrong's doping, but none of us who weren't there with them or party to an admission by George can do anything about influencing a story in the Times on that point...

Anyway, carry-on. lol
 
Mar 18, 2009
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Deagol said:
All good points. George made a lot of $$$ off of being Lance's right-hand man.
Clothing company and cycling-based community in South Carolina.
Hincapie probably could have done better for himself if he had left Postal for a team with a classics focus. He was forced to build his season around the Tour. This involved dropping his weight to climb better. His weight must have yo-yoed up and down every season.
 
Aug 13, 2010
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Berzin said:
It goes further back than that, when he was terrorizing the wanna-be's riding around Central Park, long before Chris Carmichael and his "extract of cortisone" shots on the US national team.
I recall George in Central Park in the 1980s, when everyone was talking about the young teenaged wonder. He was tall and lanky and awkward at that time, but he smoked about everyone in the bunch.
 
Oct 26, 2009
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Turner29 said:
Perhaps the point others were trying to make is that while the NYT article was about the difficulty Hincapie's testimony would pose for Armstrong, it largely sidesteps the obvious: Hincapie doped on the same level as Armstrong.
I suspect we will be waiting for months or even a year-plus before we know whether we'll ever read his testimony.
 
Turner29 said:
...it largely sidesteps the obvious: Hincapie doped on the same level as Armstrong.
Joe, this is what I'm trying to get at. Lots of guys just walked away when they had to make the decision to join the doping culture. Hincapie didn't and that was a looong time ago in his development days. He's a first-rate doper/cheat.

In terms of a story narrative, he fills a couple of archetypes every good story needs. So, there are lots of reasons for ignoring a long-lived career of bad behaviour.
 
Sep 26, 2009
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Betsy Andreu saying she couldnt wait to see how Hincapies baby came out was the best....she said it would be the strangest looking thing :)
 
Sep 10, 2009
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Cycle Chic said:
Betsy Andreu saying she couldnt wait to see how Hincapies baby came out was the best....she said it would be the strangest looking thing :)
I think it was Stephanie McIlvain who said that, in the taped phone call with Greg Lemond.
 
Jul 12, 2012
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joe_papp said:
Thanks! I enjoy contributing to the civilized and respectful (if sometimes intense/emotional) debates here, and am always happy to share my experiences and insights. And I certainly welcome constructive criticism or feedback that conflicts with whatever position I've stated, as long as it's delivered in good humor, without rancor or snark. I also



This is true in that the piece does not indict Hincapie but again, I think that's because it's a story that's being told incrementally, for the benefit of readers infinitely less-sophisticated than you and other Clinic contributors. You could argue that journalists should start beating the drum for Hincapie's dope-accelerated funeral as a professional cyclist, but without the facts of his grand jury testimony on-the-record, and barring a direct admission from him now, how are they going to write that story and source it legitimately?

We know that he wouldve had to dope along w/ Armstrong in order to testify about Armstrong's doping, but none of us who weren't there with them or party to an admission by George can do anything about influencing a story in the Times on that point...

Anyway, carry-on. lol
Joe, in New York, many view Hincapie in the same fashion as Andy Pettitte.
Interesting, since they have similar demeanors and parallel careers, albeit in different sports.

I just don't get it. Do people not see the forest for the trees?
 
As long as he doesn't give an Andy Pettite like testimony where he gets on the stand and decides to say, "I could be wrong"...

Have a feeling JV's testimony will give a good deal of weight to USADA as well. Levi and DZ somewhat as well. But JV's stature in the sport, and his ability to articulate is going to carry a lot as well to the general public.
 
Aug 13, 2009
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Alpe d'Huez said:
As long as he doesn't give an Andy Pettite like testimony where he gets on the stand and decides to say, "I could be wrong"...

.
You think Wonderboy is working hard to try to get this to happen?
 
May 19, 2012
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Race Radio said:
You think Wonderboy is working hard to try to get this to happen?
Hincapie didn't previously give a detailed statement?

It would be kind of hard to backtrack from that, no?
 
Nov 20, 2010
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VeloMaster said:
I recall George in Central Park in the 1980s, when everyone was talking about the young teenaged wonder. He was tall and lanky and awkward at that time, but he smoked about everyone in the bunch.
I remember him from early mornings in Central Park. Nice guy. He would sometimes ride along for a few minutes with Fred Mengioni, another nice guy,
 
Nov 20, 2010
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Topangarider said:
Maybe both are true - she's been working on it for a while AND USADA just leaked some stuff. How you can you possibly claim to know what USADA has said in confidence to a reporter?
He likely doesn't know much of anything JM is getting and from whom. He's one of her sources, that's all, and a fairly limited one at this point.

From JP's comments he appears to not know that Hincapie did NOT testify before the grand jury in CA. He gave sworn statements, affidavits, to the US Attorney in lieu of testimony. Did he give affidavits to USADA. Don't know for certain, but I would hope so.
 
Oct 25, 2010
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George is just the only guy in the whole mess who hasn't humiliated himself in some way. He stays pretty silent, choose his words VERY carefully, and only uses them sparingly. He's got most of the cycling fans convinced (still, to to this day) that he's cool, respectable and honest.

The only thing that we really know is that George is probably smarter than all of them. We have no idea if he is honest, respectable or loyal. Only time will tell that.

I do have high hopes for George. He seems like a smart guy. But lots of smart guys do really DUMB things.
 
Jul 12, 2012
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BotanyBay said:
Lance will show up to court with George's long lost cousin from Columbia at his side. I wish I were joking.
First, he gets a US Representative to put in a good word for him...
 

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