official Ilnur Zakarin thread

[TheGreenMonkey]

hi guys so I thought it would be fun to analyze how Ilnur Zakarins performances compares with for instance Adam & Simon Yates. conclusion is that Ilnur is not very suspicious and Adam & Simon maybe are.

check facts below.


z: out of an established system in a nation that have found and developed talent for fifty+ years
y: from a cycling backwater that had like one professional cyclist until ten years ago

z: big talent that showed results throughout juniors and u23, positive test + ban delayed time to reach WT
y: before third year as u23 only few results mostly in mass sprints, then exploded to the elite u23s the following year, then first year WT w very good performance in the hardest races

z: proves you can come back from doping and race clean and still be good in this modern era, Ilnur knows people in Russia will be ashamed if he tests positive again so of course he will not use anything
y: from a country that has experienced no doping scandals and so has no ethics about doping at all, where media says Tiernan-Locke is innocent, also home to the infamous Sky team

z: represents a team that is under pressure because the sponsor might leave, so obviously won't risk using illegal substances because that would mean the team will close for sure
y: represents a team that takes Darryl Impey to cycle races and pays him to race in them

This is a very funny post, well done. However it does need to be corrected.

z: out of an established doping system in a nation that have found and developed talent using doping for fifty+ years
y: from a cycling doping backwater that had like one professional cyclist until ten years ago because they were very slow to learn how to properly dope cyclists

 

[hrotha]

It'd be nice for the overall quality of the forum if, instead of counter-trolling, people actually tried to discuss things.

 

[argyllflyer]

Re:

It'd be nice for the overall quality of the forum if, instead of counter-trolling, people actually tried to discuss things.

The Clinic is very entrenched though - for every person convinced Rider A (or 15) is doping, there is another who doesn't. Discussion rarely follows because there rarely is any actual evidence with which to argue. It is built on rumour, innuendo, extrapolation and prejudice. So your quote there could be placed on every single page on this forum and never be achievable, especially on threads where those of a contrary opinion don't bother to voice that contrary opinion which means rumour solidifies into 'fact'. When these 'facts' are challenged, discussion is impossible and accusations of trolling / counter-trolling soon emerge. This is one rare thread where there actually is a historical body of evidence against the subject.

 

[The Hitch]

And why do you choose not to argue this "contrary opinion"? Why do you instead choose to cry about it in other threads about other riders, but absolutely refuse to participate in the actual threads about the subject?

Let me answer that for you. Because you don't have any arguments, just entrenched fan loyalty.

When I see arguments I disagree with and think the facts can disprove, I will confront those arguments head on. The fact that almost all fans of a certain team who allegedly believe they are clean prefer to take pot shots from other threads and forums but plain out refuse to actually present their case and argue it, is as I said, very telling.

 

[More Strides than Rides]

Except for F Schleck, who has come back from a ban in notably worse form, (not due to age or not being that good while on drugs)?

 

[the sceptic]

hi guys so I thought it would be fun to analyze how Ilnur Zakarins performances compares with for instance Adam & Simon Yates. conclusion is that Ilnur is not very suspicious and Adam & Simon maybe are.

check facts below.


z: out of an established system in a nation that have found and developed talent for fifty+ years
y: from a cycling backwater that had like one professional cyclist until ten years ago

z: big talent that showed results throughout juniors and u23, positive test + ban delayed time to reach WT
y: before third year as u23 only few results mostly in mass sprints, then exploded to the elite u23s the following year, then first year WT w very good performance in the hardest races

z: proves you can come back from doping and race clean and still be good in this modern era, Ilnur knows people in Russia will be ashamed if he tests positive again so of course he will not use anything
y: from a country that has experienced no doping scandals and so has no ethics about doping at all, where media says Tiernan-Locke is innocent, also home to the infamous Sky team

z: represents a team that is under pressure because the sponsor might leave, so obviously won't risk using illegal substances because that would mean the team will close for sure
y: represents a team that takes Darryl Impey to cycle races and pays him to race in them

this post compete with "Sky has black shirts cause they are recharging batteries shirts" for the clinic post of the year.

truly no mods here. the amount of *** and trolling per square word shoot through the roof

anyway i had a good laugh reading

the trolling does seem to have picked up after you came back with another account.

 

[hrotha]

Re:

Except for F Schleck, who has come back from a ban in notably worse form, (not due to age or not being that good while on drugs)?

Thomas Dekker.
Emanuele Sella (although only if you compare him to his ultra-mutant 2008 Giro form, I guess).
Moisés Dueñas (although it's hard to compare due to the level of the races he's done since his comeback).

 

[The Hitch]

I don't really find Skytears annoying, at least in the clinic atm. Despite his username, he's already admitted sky dope, and he's focusing most of his rage on Nibali who is a massive hypocrite and doper and absolutely deserves it

 

[TheGreenMonkey]

Re:

Except for F Schleck, who has come back from a ban in notably worse form, (not due to age or not being that good while on drugs)?

He is not the only rider to come back noticeably weaker, Thomas Dekker and Emanuele Sella spring to mind. Perhaps also Schmacher, Sinkewitz? Probably more. It of course does not mean they are clean but almost certainly limiting their doping from previous levels. Basso probably fits in there as well to a certain extent, 2006>>>2010.

 

[doperhopper]

here we go, Romandie in the bag despite bike chande in TT, new Mercx was born (if he can sprint without steroids)

 

[burning]

This is a great victory for modern cleans cycling.

 

[argyllflyer]

Re:

And why do you choose not to argue this "contrary opinion"? Why do you instead choose to cry about it in other threads about other riders, but absolutely refuse to participate in the actual threads about the subject?

Let me answer that for you. Because you don't have any arguments, just entrenched fan loyalty.

When I see arguments I disagree with and think the facts can disprove, I will confront those arguments head on. The fact that almost all fans of a certain team who allegedly believe they are clean prefer to take pot shots from other threads and forums but plain out refuse to actually present their case and argue it, is as I said, very telling.

No, arguing with people like yourself is like arguing with a toddler. You don't use facts, you use rumour, innuendo, extrapolation and prejudice. You're actually one of the worst culprits for it. Tinfoil hat conspiracies are not worth wasting bandwidth over. I prefer my disliked dopers to be busted than imaginary.

 

[Alexandre B.]

It's just sad.

The Santambrogio of 2015.

 

[May0maniac]

Re:

It's just sad.

The Santambrogio of 2015.

But Mauro never had Makarov backing him, that's a big difference.

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

Anyone following the Olympic sport of speed skating knows something is brewing in Mother Russia.

 

[Irondan]

hi guys so I thought it would be fun to analyze how Ilnur Zakarins performances compares with for instance Adam & Simon Yates. conclusion is that Ilnur is not very suspicious and Adam & Simon maybe are.

check facts below.


z: out of an established system in a nation that have found and developed talent for fifty+ years
y: from a cycling backwater that had like one professional cyclist until ten years ago

z: big talent that showed results throughout juniors and u23, positive test + ban delayed time to reach WT
y: before third year as u23 only few results mostly in mass sprints, then exploded to the elite u23s the following year, then first year WT w very good performance in the hardest races

z: proves you can come back from doping and race clean and still be good in this modern era, Ilnur knows people in Russia will be ashamed if he tests positive again so of course he will not use anything
y: from a country that has experienced no doping scandals and so has no ethics about doping at all, where media says Tiernan-Locke is innocent, also home to the infamous Sky team

z: represents a team that is under pressure because the sponsor might leave, so obviously won't risk using illegal substances because that would mean the team will close for sure
y: represents a team that takes Darryl Impey to cycle races and pays him to race in them

lol

 

[Big Doopie]

It is really hysterical to read the posts in much of the CN forums. Most are absolutely THRILLED at Zakharin's results. However Pinot's ride yesterday got hardly a mention.

The posters on CN - by large majorities - much prefer a proven doper over the guy who openly publishes his very human parameters.

If you are wondering why there is no motivation to change bad habits perhaps you should look inwards.

Then again, some fans like a doper to win because somehow it justifies the doper they support.

Lol.

 

[the sceptic]

Says the guy who supports proven doper Hesjedal.

Maybe Zakarin only doped once too?

 

[DFA123]

Re:

It's just sad.

The Santambrogio of 2015.

Let's hope he is the new Santambrogio rather than the new Froome. It's depressing to think that in two years time it may have become normal to be discussing this guy as a GT contender - like it has become with Froome.

Probably won't though because he is Russian not British, so the press and most fans probably won't give him such an easy ride.

 

[IndianCyclist]

near tony martin's pace without the mechanical!!!!

 

[mihhint]

Strangely enough, the fact that a young cyclist can enter the scene and immediately defeat the likes of Quintana and Froome in mountains, TT like Tony Martin the next day(he could have perhaps won if not the bike change) and win one of the more competitive 1 week stage races..it almost makes me feel a bit better about the situation in cycling in a way.

 

[Irondan]

Re:

Strangely enough, the fact that a young cyclist can enter the scene and immediately defeat the likes of Quintana and Froome in mountains, TT like Tony Martin the next day(he could have perhaps won if not the bike change) and win one of the more competitive 1 week stage races..it almost makes me feel a bit better about the situation in cycling in a way.

BUT... Nobody believes his performance is clean. So, there's that.

 

[mihhint]

Re: Re:

Strangely enough, the fact that a young cyclist can enter the scene and immediately defeat the likes of Quintana and Froome in mountains, TT like Tony Martin the next day(he could have perhaps won if not the bike change) and win one of the more competitive 1 week stage races..it almost makes me feel a bit better about the situation in cycling in a way.

BUT... Nobody believes his performance is clean. So, there's that.

Exactly.

 

[Guybrush]

Remember Ricco? he's back! in Zakarin form!

 

[The Hitch]

Re:

Says the guy who supports proven doper Hesjedal.

Maybe Zakarin only doped once too?

Well, he's got you there Big Dopie.