Official Lance Armstrong Thread: Part 3 (Post-Confession)

[SlantParallelogram]

Keith Olberman on the Armstrong interview.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KuLB...ch?v=KuLB5Xi2qFg&feature=youtu.be&app=desktop

Keith was awesome!

 

[Pazuzu]

Keith was awesome!

Interesting how he pegged both Armstrong and Woods years earlier for their duplicitous behavior during the strike. As they say, actions speak louder than words.

 

[StyrbjornSterki]

Corriere della Sera:

Ottobre 1993: centomila dollari a Gaggioli per lasciarlo vincere Un piano diabolico: i soldi dentro a un panettone

«Era un giovane collega americano. Mi consegnò un panettone in confezione regalo augurandomi “Merry Christmas” e andò via. Nella scatola centomila dollari in biglietti di piccolo taglio. Quel collega era Lance Armstrong» --Roberto Gaggioli

"It was a young American colleague. He offered me a panettone (Christmas cake) as a present and wished me a merry Christmas. In the box there were $100,000 in small bills. That colleague was Lance Armstrong."

 

[Athame]

What a joke, this "confession". Imagine a serial raper coming to the catholic church for a confession and instead of

__________________ Boo~

 

[D-Queued]

Armstrong is a fake but he only played the whole huge payoff think to the logical conclusion

Pretty obvious that Basso took a dive for Lance on the Alpe d'Huez TT. Poor Riis blew a fuse over that.

Dave.

 

[blackcat]

Pretty obvious that Basso took a dive for Lance on the Alpe d'Huez TT. Poor Riis blew a fuse over that.

Dave.

mom to indiana oncologist?
ever since dailypeloton you and another minority, were emphatic on that.

i was credulous on armstrong winning mano-a-mano.

did not take myself for the gullible type

 

[blackcat]

i think it's actually quite refreshing that Armstrong admits he would still decide to use EPO in '95. would Olbermann rather he lie and say "oh no, i'd totally not do it and i'd just retire right there and go work at Wal-Mart"? would he rather a BS admission that we got from the likes of A-Rod and Ryan Braun, about how so sorry they were and how it was a mistake they'll never make again?

i'm usually a fan of Olbermann but he's also being quite delusional, acting like he has no idea that all of the sports he makes money covering are just as much of a cesspool of doping as Cycling is/was. i wonder how many NFL players are faced with the exact same decision now that cyclists were in the EPO era? it's a joke. everything is a joke.

that said, Olbermann is pretty spot on with the rest of the video after that.

prefer he told us how he started doping in triathlon as a 15yo. that makes more sense

 

[roundabout]

Pretty obvious that Basso took a dive for Lance on the Alpe d'Huez TT. Poor Riis blew a fuse over that.

Dave.

Yeah, 2nd, 3rd, same ****.

 

[D-Queued]

mom to indiana oncologist?
ever since dailypeloton you and another minority, were emphatic on that.

i was credulous on armstrong winning mano-a-mano.

did not take myself for the gullible type

I didn't catch it during the Tour.

Almost lost it myself watching the movie. Couldn't wait for the credits to roll in order to start asking, "Did you see that?"

Dave.

 

[Oldman]

Corriere della Sera:

Ottobre 1993: centomila dollari a Gaggioli per lasciarlo vincere Un piano diabolico: i soldi dentro a un panettone

«Era un giovane collega americano. Mi consegnò un panettone in confezione regalo augurandomi “Merry Christmas” e andò via. Nella scatola centomila dollari in biglietti di piccolo taglio. Quel collega era Lance Armstrong» --Roberto Gaggioli

"It was a young American colleague. He offered me a panettone (Christmas cake) as a present and wished me a merry Christmas. In the box there were $100,000 in small bills. That colleague was Lance Armstrong."

I love this....Swart said the team was offered $50gs, GaggiOily must have pocketed the other $50K. Probably took his team split off the backend too. Seriously slimey group of "pros".

 

[MarkvW]

Looks like Lance has totally betrayed Weasel. Now Lance has demonstrated that he is absolutely no different from all the other snitches.

http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/15997/As-clock-ticks-in-relation-to-Qui-Tam-case-Armstrong-implicates-Weisel-over-team-doping.aspx

I love it!!! Looks like Weasel might have to go to trial with Lance!!

 

[MarkvW]

We know from Hamilton's stories that Wiesel was a **very** hands-on guy with his teams by this time. We know it from Landis too. We also know Wiesel has a creepy mancrush on Wonderboy. But, I don't know if it's sufficient for judicial/law enforcement action.

Wonderboy has stories to tell. If they can make it out of his mouth with some proximity to what actually happened and can be corroborated without implicating him in some other crimes, then Wiesel can be implicated. That's a big ask though.

Wiesel is a corruption genius and has incredibly deep pockets to legislate his way out of any trouble he may experience. Still hoping for the best, and glad to see him finally implicated.

Looks like you're right. Lance is imploding!

 

[mewmewmew13]

Looks like you're right. Lance is imploding!

Lance may not be sleeping as well lately

I wonder who will blink first …I'm betting Weisel with his bottomless pockets and thugs will keep wonderboy in his place...

 

[MarkvW]

Lance may not be sleeping as well lately

I wonder who will blink first …I'm betting Weisel with his bottomless pockets and thugs will keep wonderboy in his place...

Turning on Weasel seems to me to indicate that Lance is fatalistic about his chances in the USPS lawsuit. The more Lance implicates Weasel, the more he implicates himself.

 

[86TDFWinner]

LOL, I'm not sure if this has been posted already, but this did make me chuckle a bit. Looks like TT won't be reducing Wonderboys lifetime ban anytime soon.



Travis Tygart: “The door is closed” to Lance Armstrong after 18-months of non-cooperation

Read more: http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/1...es-Weisel-over-team-doping.aspx#ixzz2nVc1ag4M

 

[Merckx index]

Wiesel is a corruption genius and has incredibly deep pockets to legislate his way out of any trouble he may experience.

Weisel’s pockets are so deep that he could probably pay the entire $100 million without being seriously impacted. Avoiding being charged, for him, is mostly about not being publicly embarrassed, certainly not any worry about bankruptcy. He might also be concerned not to get implicated in crimes punishable by more than fines.

But it was reported a while back that Weisel had made a separate agreement with the feds. I don't know if this means he won't be charged, or if maybe he has already agreed to pay a certain amount in return for not being pursued further. For a guy with his wealth, it would seem very sensible to take the latter option, if available. The deal would surely include no public revelation that he paid anything at all. Back to normal for a few million in pocket change.

 

[86TDFWinner]

But it was reported a while back that Weisel had made a separate agreement with the feds. I don't know if this means he won't be charged, or if maybe he has already agreed to pay a certain amount in return for not being pursued further. For a guy with his wealth, it would seem very sensible to take the latter option, if available. The deal would surely include no public revelation that he paid anything at all. Back to normal for a few million in pocket change.

Wouldn't Wonderboy at least have some knowledge of this?

 

[blackcat]

I didn't catch it during the Tour.

Almost lost it myself watching the movie. Couldn't wait for the credits to roll in order to start asking, "Did you see that?"

Dave.

when i saw Overcoming on its release, i was already in confirmation bias phase. I did not think that Basso could possibly fall over like one of don king's boxers in a fixed vegas fight.

say it aint so joe

 

[Benotti69]

Weisel’s pockets are so deep that he could probably pay the entire $100 million without being seriously impacted. Avoiding being charged, for him, is mostly about not being publicly embarrassed, certainly not any worry about bankruptcy. He might also be concerned not to get implicated in crimes punishable by more than fines.

But it was reported a while back that Weisel had made a separate agreement with the feds. I don't know if this means he won't be charged, or if maybe he has already agreed to pay a certain amount in return for not being pursued further. For a guy with his wealth, it would seem very sensible to take the latter option, if available. The deal would surely include no public revelation that he paid anything at all. Back to normal for a few million in pocket change.

To a guy like Weisel, having to pay 1$ is a loss to him and will hurt. Guys like Wesiel look after each and every dollar.

 

[Oldman]

To a guy like Weisel, having to pay 1$ is a loss to him and will hurt. Guys like Wesiel look after each and every dollar.

I think it's more along the lines Merckx I said earlier; he can poop out $100m without breaking a sweat.
But the guy hates to lose and if he values a dollar it's because it used to belong to someone else.
It will be more important to him to have an arrangement that doesn't qualify him as losing. This guy doped to compete in Master's races so he harbors no illusions about separation of cheating from winning. It's just about winning and he'll justify as a cost of business as long as his wrist is not publicly slapped.
Lance better hide, though.

 

[D-Queued]

when i saw Overcoming on its release, i was already in confirmation bias phase. I did not think that Basso could possibly fall over like one of don king's boxers in a fixed vegas fight.

say it aint so joe

Always wondered if the filmmakers truly knew what they had captured.

Dave.

 

[MarkvW]

All I've seen so far is a USA Today story and a Shane Stokes story about that USA Today story. There is a void of information right now. We know that the feds are not taking a position on Weasel, but I haven't seen what facts Floyd (and maybe Armstrong??) are using in an attempt to keep Weasel in the lawsuit.

It's probably a good thing that Lance isn't worth that much attention any more.

 

[skidmark]

This case, and how Armstrong is seemingly implicating Wiesel (and therefore willing to tell some 'truth') is starting to make clearer his possible endgame. I've been as confused as everyone else as to what he's getting at with the CN interview, the espn interview, etc. But it becomes clearer to me when I see his options.

First, on the sporting front, I know he'd like to be un-banned. But that door was closed as much as it was going to be months ago when TT gave him 30 days to cooperate and he didn't. He doesn't lose anything by delaying on that front, really - any solution is going to come from something bigger than TT, like him participating in this UCI-run thing that he's suddenly an advocate for. I'm sure he's long since realized that his best option on that front once the door was closed on USADA was to focus on bringing out the whole story on some other front and then pulling some strings to put pressure on USADA to reduce the lifetime ban, hence the repeated peppering of his interviews with 'death sentence' etc.

Second, on the public relations front, I think he's really just testing. He's in uncharted waters, since his arrogance was forgiven by much of the public because he was a winner and a hero. Now, aspects of that are distasteful to the average Joe. A really clear moment for me was in the ESPN interview when he's reflecting on things in his other interviews that (I'm sure his PR people and their analytics have told him) 'resonated'. It's almost like he's trying a bunch of different tactics after the Oprah interview was such a big disaster, if nothing else just to see what works so that he can cobble together a long-term approach for redemption. Right now he's saturating all the interviews with the same points about things being unfair and him getting the 'death sentence' etc, but he's honing that a bit to take more and more responsibility and seem less and less like someone who is just trying to figure out how to manipulate people into forgiving him. Of course he is the latter, so it's an uphill battle.

An important sidenote to the PR side of things is that if he ever does hope to get reinstated, it would really help to have the public believe that he should be as well. I think he needs to orchestrate his bombshell sharing of information with a time when the public is interested in listening with a sympathetic ear.

Third, and maybe most importantly, his status as a figure of public interest. Redemption is hard to achieve because, unlike other athletes who undergo personal setbacks, he's too old (aside from being banned) to come back for a sporting redemption, which is usually the easiest way to get people to be on your side again. He's not doing wonders on the personality front, either. It's come to the point where the biggest asset he has is the truth, or rather, 'truth' (what it's convenient and prudent to share for him). He may be a disgrace, but he's still a compelling figure at least on the front of being viewed as the kingpin of this whole doping culture. He's kept his cards real close to his chest, and the farther it goes on the more I'm beginning to suspect that his whole 'I'll talk to authorities but won't write this salacious tell-all book' is his best strategy for being relevant. And, for making some money.

It's almost like he's creating a brand around 'what Lance Armstrong knows'. I think he's been advised to hold off, hold off, hold off on sharing details, get the talking point out there that he may be guilty and he gets that, but he's not gonna run telling on everyone for cheap tabloid trash benefits, and then, when the lawsuits play out and people are less mad (and, maybe most importantly, the movies about him get made and there is a more curious than angry public interest in him again), THEN come out with the tell-all. That will maximize his relevance and chance to humanize himself to people, once the harshness of his offenses have softened in people's eyes. Plus, he will have the benefit of saying 'see, I didn't just spew out everything at first chance, I took the high road'; then we'll see how the public sees his lifetime ban. I see it as possible that he could get some significant leverage from that position - 'look, we've dragged this guy through the mud for 2 years, he's said he's sorry, he's cooperated... lifetime seems harsh' is the public opinion he'd be going for.

Don't get me wrong, I don't know if it would work and I certainly hope the ******* fails. But it seems clearer to me that this is what he's going for.

 

[MarkvW]

This case, and how Armstrong is seemingly implicating Wiesel (and therefore willing to tell some 'truth') is starting to make clearer his possible endgame. I've been as confused as everyone else as to what he's getting at with the CN interview, the espn interview, etc. But it becomes clearer to me when I see his options.

First, on the sporting front, I know he'd like to be un-banned. But that door was closed as much as it was going to be months ago when TT gave him 30 days to cooperate and he didn't. He doesn't lose anything by delaying on that front, really - any solution is going to come from something bigger than TT, like him participating in this UCI-run thing that he's suddenly an advocate for. I'm sure he's long since realized that his best option on that front once the door was closed on USADA was to focus on bringing out the whole story on some other front and then pulling some strings to put pressure on USADA to reduce the lifetime ban, hence the repeated peppering of his interviews with 'death sentence' etc.

Second, on the public relations front, I think he's really just testing. He's in uncharted waters, since his arrogance was forgiven by much of the public because he was a winner and a hero. Now, aspects of that are distasteful to the average Joe. A really clear moment for me was in the ESPN interview when he's reflecting on things in his other interviews that (I'm sure his PR people and their analytics have told him) 'resonated'. It's almost like he's trying a bunch of different tactics after the Oprah interview was such a big disaster, if nothing else just to see what works so that he can cobble together a long-term approach for redemption. Right now he's saturating all the interviews with the same points about things being unfair and him getting the 'death sentence' etc, but he's honing that a bit to take more and more responsibility and seem less and less like someone who is just trying to figure out how to manipulate people into forgiving him. Of course he is the latter, so it's an uphill battle.

An important sidenote to the PR side of things is that if he ever does hope to get reinstated, it would really help to have the public believe that he should be as well. I think he needs to orchestrate his bombshell sharing of information with a time when the public is interested in listening with a sympathetic ear.

Third, and maybe most importantly, his status as a figure of public interest. Redemption is hard to achieve because, unlike other athletes who undergo personal setbacks, he's too old (aside from being banned) to come back for a sporting redemption, which is usually the easiest way to get people to be on your side again. He's not doing wonders on the personality front, either. It's come to the point where the biggest asset he has is the truth, or rather, 'truth' (what it's convenient and prudent to share for him). He may be a disgrace, but he's still a compelling figure at least on the front of being viewed as the kingpin of this whole doping culture. He's kept his cards real close to his chest, and the farther it goes on the more I'm beginning to suspect that his whole 'I'll talk to authorities but won't write this salacious tell-all book' is his best strategy for being relevant. And, for making some money.

It's almost like he's creating a brand around 'what Lance Armstrong knows'. I think he's been advised to hold off, hold off, hold off on sharing details, get the talking point out there that he may be guilty and he gets that, but he's not gonna run telling on everyone for cheap tabloid trash benefits, and then, when the lawsuits play out and people are less mad (and, maybe most importantly, the movies about him get made and there is a more curious than angry public interest in him again), THEN come out with the tell-all. That will maximize his relevance and chance to humanize himself to people, once the harshness of his offenses have softened in people's eyes. Plus, he will have the benefit of saying 'see, I didn't just spew out everything at first chance, I took the high road'; then we'll see how the public sees his lifetime ban. I see it as possible that he could get some significant leverage from that position - 'look, we've dragged this guy through the mud for 2 years, he's said he's sorry, he's cooperated... lifetime seems harsh' is the public opinion he'd be going for.

Don't get me wrong, I don't know if it would work and I certainly hope the ******* fails. But it seems clearer to me that this is what he's going for.

I think you're right, but if Lance sings a phony song there's now a huge chorus of people (who aren't scared of him anymore) who will sing bullshit.

 

[Briant_Gumble]

Second, on the public relations front, I think he's really just testing. He's in uncharted waters, since his arrogance was forgiven by much of the public because he was a winner and a hero.

I can't say I agree with that bit, his name is mud to an awful lot of people.