Official Lance Armstrong Thread: Part 3 (Post-Confession)

[Dr. Maserati]

(1) How did George smear Frankie?
(2) What is your source?
(3) Why is your representation of the Andreu-Armstrong conflict more reliable than Brodeal's representation.

Hi Mark,
Remember those fact things I asked you for and you didn't get.
That would be the difference in the representation.
You're welcome.

 

[Fausto's Schnauzer]

I like my credibility

"We like our credibility."

 

[Granville57]

(1) How did George smear Frankie?

Gee whiz. And all this time I thought you were here just to argue for the pure f'ck of it.

 

[BroDeal]

(1) How did George smear Frankie?

When Hincapie tells the truth it is smearing because Armstrong may have convinced him to speak out. In fact we cannot even discuss what Hincapie actually said. Instead we must concentrate on why he is telling the truth at this time or pretend that Hincapie said something we heard Armstrong has been saying. Also giving an interview to someone's home town newspaper, which is the media that would be most interested in running such a story, is further proof that the truth is actually a smear.

 

[Granville57]

In fact we cannot even discuss what Hincapie actually said. Instead we must concentrate on why...

And what of it? Since when does Big George have a Big Mouth?

The "why" in all this is the crux of the matter. And "why" now?

Maybe we need two separate threads. One for the "why" and one for the "content."

But until then...why? What say you?

 

[MarkvW]

Hi Mark,
Remember those fact things I asked you for and you didn't get.
That would be the difference in the representation.
You're welcome.

My questions are legitimate. Is there one point on which Brodeal is lying? Which one? Why do you think so?

Does your opinion boil down to "Betsy says so." or "RR says so."? Or is there something more?

 

[Race Radio]

And what of it? Since when does Big George have a Big Mouth?

George gives his first interview with Frankie's hometown newspaper, says Frankie was lying about his level of involvement, pretends he was the same level of junkie and lance and he are, ignores what he said in his affidavit and implies Frankie was the reason he doped.

Why the change is a good question.......much better then "When did George smear Frankie?" The answer to that is obvious

 

[Dr. Maserati]

My questions are legitimate. Is there one point on which Brodeal is lying? Which one? Why do you think so?

Hi Mark,
My question was legitimate - the one you refused to answer.
I never said Bro was lying. You think that to insinuate that as a question is legitimate?
You have some cheek.

Does your opinion boil down to "Betsy says so." or "RR says so."? Or is there something more?

My opinion - unlike yours is based on facts (not distorting,) - I don't believe George is lying, but it is obviously a smear when a Detroit paper gets LA&GH on record and George appears to forget about blood doping, but the EPO in Frankies fridge. He remembers that.

 

[MarkvW]

Hi Mark,
My question was legitimate - the one you refused to answer.
I never said Bro was lying. You think that to insinuate that as a question is legitimate?
You have some cheek.



My opinion - unlike yours is based on facts (not distorting,) - I don't believe George is lying, but it is obviously a smear when a Detroit paper gets LA&GH on record and George appears to forget about blood doping, but the EPO in Frankies fridge. He remembers that.

Peace, brother.

 

[Archibald]

Dude. Not a cool visual. Not cool at all. Please, next time, more humor, less...um..."bile."


OK, I admit it. I had to look up "occluded."


Of course there's no way to prove that. Perhaps that exactly what he should've been doing though, that way those kids could pass the EPO along to Cancer Kids who could've actually put it to better use than winning a bicycle race.

My point is: I don't see how any of this makes Lance less of a complete and total a$$hole. The one question that no one—from Oprah, to Benson, to Tilford—seems to be screaming in Lance's face is: What about all the cancer kids you lied to, and how do you justify using, all of things, EPO to win bicycle races, when that very product is used in the fight against cancer?

Because as far as I'm concerned, everything else in this saga is mostly meaningless BS. Was Lance treated unfairly by USADA? Who f'cking cares? The system is broken and the sport is a joke, if we really want to get down to brass tacks here. So if a broken and corrupt system ends up screwing up the career and legacy of Lance Armstrong, am I supposed to feel some sense of outrage about it? I'm not here to fix the world, and I'm certainly not here to fix pro cycling. If in all this sordid mess, Armstrong gets the short end of the stick? Oh well. Karma is a b!tch.


With the exception of Zabriskie and maybe Vande Velde, I seem to recall that many of the riders adopted a line more similar to Floyd. They had worked so hard, they weren't prepared to throw it all away, etc, etc, blah, blah, blah.
[Edit]
I just realized that Dr. Mas already covered this point quite well here




Again, I freely admit it. I had to look that one up too.


Those two, I am familiar with.




All this, just when I thought this thread had lost all the fun. I'm gettin' popcorn for the next few pages.

now that's one of the more refreshing posts in a while

I'll take a punt at the bolded...

with a slightly bemused look on his face, "because I'm a cancer survivor" suggesting that its obvious that he should be allowed to take it for what ever reason he choses.
or maybe just a simple "because Uncle Heiny said I could"?

 

[mewmewmew13]

Well, it is Tuesday.

This alone that 'breaking news' is coming is breaking news.

 

[Scott SoCal]

When Hincapie tells the truth it is smearing because Armstrong may have convinced him to speak out. In fact we cannot even discuss what Hincapie actually said. Instead we must concentrate on why he is telling the truth at this time or pretend that Hincapie said something we heard Armstrong has been saying. Also giving an interview to someone's home town newspaper, which is the media that would be most interested in running such a story, is further proof that the truth is actually a smear.

When Hincapie tells the truth

Truth? Consistent lie? Who knows. Neither you nor your source.

Armstrong may have convinced him to speak out

Nope. George decided he was going to come out to this reporter at this time for maximum exposure. I'm sure LA had nothing to do with anything.

we cannot even discuss what Hincapie actually said

Sure. It's much more interesting to discuss why he said it. Except to you because (feel free to fill in the blank).

Instead we must concentrate on why he is telling the truth at this time

See above.

Also giving an interview to someone's home town newspaper, which is the media that would be most interested in running such a story, is further proof that the truth is actually a smear.

Occam's Razor. Simply.

 

[ChewbaccaD]

Window dressing. While drowning in an ocean of sobs and insincere regrets, they occasionally have come to the surface to deny they are making excuses so they don't look so pathetic. Those riders are not standing up to assert that USADA's portrayal of riders being forced to dope is a distortion, that the same hiring and contract extension dynamic existed throughout the sport.

There is a huge difference between the picture Landis portrayed of himself, his motivations, and incentives and the maelstrom of chicanery those riders have engaged in. Ironically, Landis is the one who lost everything and would have the most believable reason to say he regretted his decisions. Instead it is those who gained the most who would have us believe are the most apologetic.

What I don't remember is any of these other people using cancer patients to cover their doping. What I don't remember is any of these people using the legal system in an offensive manner, knowing that his funds could destroy people financially. What I don't remember are any of these people undertaking a systematic program of PR meant to belittle, bully, and financially and emotionally destroy people. (you're a fu*king idiot if you don't think any of that happened.)

You'll have to cry me a fu*king river that the entity that brought that piece of sh!t to the only justice he is likely to see was USADA. Good for them. Good for Tygart. I hope the punishment is unjust. I hope all of the ******s at the USADA who may have been complicit get away with it. I hope Lance loses sleep over his indignation over how wrongly he was treated. I hope life deals him some more sh!t because he hasn't stopped dishing it out.

You can keep going back to the car to get some bottles for him because Leiphemier apparently can't get a job doing that anymore.

Swim in the cesspool of the sycophants dude, it looks good on you.

If I'm a hater, I'm a hater. I've always carried these stripes, and I have my reasons why. I wear the badge proudly. Here's a fern to show how much I think of you.

 

[ChewbaccaD]

Bro's attempt at parody would be kind of funny if RR hadn't proven time and again to be right. Sorry that sticks in the craw of some of you. Don't be so distraught with your station in life. Jealousy isn't healthy.

 

[Hugh Januss]

So at this point I can only surmise that Brodeal has gone on vacation and thehog has hacked his account.

 

[mewmewmew13]

So at this point I can only surmise that Brodeal has gone on vacation and thehog has hacked his account.

Pretty sure that is what we are all thinking at this point..

 

[ChewbaccaD]

So at this point I can only surmise that Brodeal has gone on vacation and thehog has hacked his account.

Oh no, Bro decided that Lance deserves to have tears cried for him on his own...well, he decided that he doesn't like Besty nor RR, and so now he will fit whatever narrative he has to in order to make that point time and again. So he's decided that being an Armstrong apologist is his best method of doing that. MarkyvW just tags along like a good puppy because intellectually, he doesn't have the chops to pull if off on his own. He needs to send Bro a friend request.

Hey, you'll be judged by the company you keep...I like to hang out by myself personally.

 

[Hugh Januss]

Oh no, Bro decided that Lance deserves to have tears cried for him on his own...well, he decided that he doesn't like Besty nor RR, and so now he will fit whatever narrative he has to in order to make that point time and again. So he's decided that being an Armstrong apologist is his best method of doing that. MarkyvW just tags along like a good puppy because intellectually, he doesn't have the chops to pull if off on his own. He needs to send Bro a friend request.

Hey, you'll be judged by the company you keep...I like to hang out by myself personally.

Either way I apparently just got a red card for saying something mean about Net_erk so I'm gonna leave this one be, for now.

 

[JMBeaushrimp]

I dunno.

I've been enjoying Bro's posts. They're well written, and I like that.

I just think he's arguing the objective against the subjective. The larger scene of doping in cycling as whole, versus the Lancecentric myopia of LA's evilness in the whole of cycling.

There is no doubt that LA's an evil d*uche, and I don't think Bro would argue that.

I think his point is that cycling was rotten before LA showed up, and it's still rotten, because not really much has changed since the Grand Denouement of Armstrong.

This certainly doesn't change that fact that LA needs a serious *ss-handing, but it does lend some needed context.

Maybe I'm wrong...

 

[aphronesis]

I dunno.

I've been enjoying Bro's posts. They're well written, and I like that.

I just think he's arguing the objective against the subjective. The larger scene of doping in cycling as whole, versus the Lancecentric myopia of LA's evilness in the whole of cycling.

There is no doubt that LA's an evil d*uche, and I don't think Bro would argue that.

I think his point is that cycling was rotten before LA showed up, and it's still rotten, because not really much has changed since the Grand Denouement of Armstrong.

This certainly doesn't change that fact that LA needs a serious *ss-handing, but it does lend some needed context.

Maybe I'm wrong...

heresy. where from there?

 

[blackcat]

When Hincapie tells the truth it is smearing because Armstrong may have convinced him to speak out. In fact we cannot even discuss what Hincapie actually said. Instead we must concentrate on why he is telling the truth at this time or pretend that Hincapie said something we heard Armstrong has been saying. Also giving an interview to someone's home town newspaper, which is the media that would be most interested in running such a story, is further proof that the truth is actually a smear.

was this not about Frankie teaching George how to dope? That is BS. George can tell the truth, but when he starts to lie for others, its difficult to discern what is not BS

 

[ChewbaccaD]

I dunno.

I've been enjoying Bro's posts. They're well written, and I like that.

I just think he's arguing the objective against the subjective. The larger scene of doping in cycling as whole, versus the Lancecentric myopia of LA's evilness in the whole of cycling.

There is no doubt that LA's an evil d*uche, and I don't think Bro would argue that.

I think his point is that cycling was rotten before LA showed up, and it's still rotten, because not really much has changed since the Grand Denouement of Armstrong.

This certainly doesn't change that fact that LA needs a serious *ss-handing, but it does lend some needed context.

Maybe I'm wrong...

I think he just doesn't like RR very much.

 

[Maxiton]

I dunno.

I've been enjoying Bro's posts. They're well written, and I like that.

I just think he's arguing the objective against the subjective. The larger scene of doping in cycling as whole, versus the Lancecentric myopia of LA's evilness in the whole of cycling.

There is no doubt that LA's an evil d*uche, and I don't think Bro would argue that.

I think his point is that cycling was rotten before LA showed up, and it's still rotten, because not really much has changed since the Grand Denouement of Armstrong.

This certainly doesn't change that fact that LA needs a serious *ss-handing, but it does lend some needed context.

Maybe I'm wrong...

That's my reading of it, too. I think what BroDeal has been saying is nuanced, refreshing, and largely correct.

 

[MarkvW]

So...Frankie quits doping in 2000, at his wife's request. What does he do then? The answer is not pretty, folks. He becomes (with full knowledge of the doping) an assistant director of the USPS team--the greatest doping conspiracy the sport has ever known (yet).

Hard to say Lance forced Frankie into that second job....

Lance's filthy and corrupt team must have been quite seductive back then. Or, maybe it was just one filthy and corrupt team in a thoroughly filthy and corrupt sport?

 

[RobbieCanuck]

So...Frankie quits doping in 2000, at his wife's request. What does he do then? The answer is not pretty, folks. He becomes (with full knowledge of the doping) an assistant director of the USPS team--the greatest doping conspiracy the sport has ever known (yet).

Hard to say Lance forced Frankie into that second job....

Lance's filthy and corrupt team must have been quite seductive back then. Or, maybe it was just one filthy and corrupt team in a thoroughly filthy and corrupt sport?

It may not have been a sinister as this. My hunch is Frankie, like all of us, had bills to pay.