Official Lance Armstrong Thread: Part 3 (Post-Confession)

[webvan]

Lol, it is a 'process' hrotha

PS: is it just me or was the lettertype out of this world; not normal?

Definitely, so much so that I had to stop reading the article ! Maybe a cut/paste in notepad would help!

 

[trompe le monde]

http://www.texasmonthly.com/story/man-who-fell-earth

Thanks for the link.

I don't understand how Lance thinks he can be redeemed, a la Bill Clinton. Clinton never sold a false bill of goods like Lance did. Did Clinton sell the American populace a tattered narrative, only for it to be revealed as an unapologetic farce?

Maybe the worst thing about Lance trying to redeem himself is that he doesn't want to recognize that it is essentially an impossible task. He manufactured this image of a symbol, of someone who surmounted a terrible obstacle in his life and could thrive afterwards by winning the Tour de France. Now that that symbolic meaning has been completely divorced from anything that resembles a positive value - that you can overcome personal hardship through dedication and hard work and thrive afterwards - what is left to redeem?

It's weird, in one way Lance acknowledges that he is a fallen idol, in another way he wants to be that idol again. It seems, well, a bit hypocritical and strange because he really and truthfully never was an idol to begin with.

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

So Lance admits to using a bunch of toxic drugs that cause and accelerate cancer......what does his doctor say? He supports him. Said he couldn't win the Tour without the drugs that likely accelerated lance's cancer

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sport...rmstrong-einhorn-cancer-doctor-oprah/1842777/

Hey, isn't that the 'in cache' article doc which was 'suddenly' removed?

 

[Fortyninefourteen]

http://www.texasmonthly.com/story/man-who-fell-earth

The real beauty here is comparing himself to Bill Clinton.

I am starting to feel really sorry for his kids and mother.

 

[Race Radio]

On Oprah Lance said that he volunteered to step away from the foundation when he saw that he was a liability......yeah, that was a lie

“The whole night was a train wreck,” one longtime Livestrong supporter told me.

The board knew it had to go further. “A handful of us talked about it, and it was obvious,” remembered McKinnon. Lance couldn’t be on the board at all. He had to leave the foundation. Garvey agreed. “There was not a doubt in my mind—we had to establish separation. He had to voluntarily resign.”

Lance reacted predictably: he fought like hell. This was his foundation, the one he’d created after climbing out of his deathbed and built into one of the best cancer charities in the world. On November 4, calling the board members “cowards,” he gave in and resigned,

 

[DirtyWorks]

I don't understand how Lance thinks he can be redeemed, a la Bill Clinton. Clinton never sold a false bill of goods like Lance did. Did Clinton sell the American populace a tattered narrative, only for it to be revealed as an unapologetic farce?

I'm not sure how you arrived at this conclusion, but, yeah he was selling a false bill of goods even during deposition. Paraphrased examples:

"It depends on the meaning of the word is"
"I did not have sexual relations with ....."

It's all here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impeachment_of_Bill_Clinton

 

[Scott SoCal]

So Lance admits to using a bunch of toxic drugs that cause and accelerate cancer......what does his doctor say? He supports him. Said he couldn't win the Tour without the drugs that likely accelerated lance's cancer

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sport...rmstrong-einhorn-cancer-doctor-oprah/1842777/

Wow. Just wow.

He's Einhorn's Cancer Jesus. That's really disturbing.

 

[Oldman]

Thanks for the link.

I don't understand how Lance thinks he can be redeemed, a la Bill Clinton. Clinton never sold a false bill of goods like Lance did. Did Clinton sell the American populace a tattered narrative, only for it to be revealed as an unapologetic farce?

Maybe the worst thing about Lance trying to redeem himself is that he doesn't want to recognize that it is essentially an impossible task. He manufactured this image of a symbol, of someone who surmounted a terrible obstacle in his life and could thrive afterwards by winning the Tour de France. Now that that symbolic meaning has been completely divorced from anything that resembles a positive value - that you can overcome personal hardship through dedication and hard work and thrive afterwards - what is left to redeem?

It's weird, in one way Lance acknowledges that he is a fallen idol, in another way he wants to be that idol again. It seems, well, a bit hypocritical and strange because he really and truthfully never was an idol to begin with.[/QUOTE]

It's weird that Lance can still imagine himself as anything but a completely concocted cartoon. Clinton may have had a piccadillo and been less than forthcoming about it but he also led the country for 8 years; which was real. You gotta wonder at what point Lance actually realized where he is?

 

[Carols]

This idiot has the audacity to compare himself to Bill Clinton????

Just when I calm down a bit stuff like this comes out:

For most people, redemption involves atonement and remorse for doing wrong. But Lance is not like most people. And the truth is, Lance doesn’t feel like he did much wrong: in his mind, the doping leveled the playing field. He also says now that the way he treated people wasn’t so bad. “I prefer the word ‘defiance’ to ‘bullying,’ ” he told me, “but I’m sure there was some. I used that word a lot in the interview. That might be something I’d say less now. I don’t think those situations have been accurately portrayed. The facts are out there. People can decide.”

Narcisstic, sociopathic ARSEhole

 

[trompe le monde]

I'm not sure how you arrived at this conclusion, but, yeah he was selling a false bill of goods even during deposition. Paraphrased examples:

"It depends on the meaning of the word is"
"I did not have sexual relations with ....."

It's all here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impeachment_of_Bill_Clinton

Maybe I should have re-phrased.

To me, the difference between Clinton and Armstrong is that the good they may have done for others, assisting/inspiring cancer survivors in Armstrong's case and the US populace in general in Clinton's case, is that Clinton's achievements weren't built on a foundation of outright lies. He did not lie, cheat, bully, or corrupt his way into the Oval office the way that Lance lied, cheated, bullied and corrupted his way into seven Tour De France titles.

That's kind of what I meant in the false bill of goods comment - in that Clinton at least came by his achievements more honestly than Lance did. I didn't even factor in the obfuscation of the whole Lewinsky affair when I made that comment.

I suppose in some way people judge Clinton by the Lewinsky affair, but that was just one mistake that did not completely define or impede his ability to act as President. Lance's ability to be a Tour De France winning cyclist was premised on the fact that he had to do it dishonestly; you really can't separate Lance the cyclist from Lance the cheater whereas you can separate Clinton the President from Clinton the philanderer.

 

[Oldman]

Maybe I should have re-phrased.

To me, the difference between Clinton and Armstrong is that the good they may have done for others, assisting/inspiring cancer survivors in Armstrong's case and the US populace in general in Clinton's case, is that Clinton's achievements weren't built on a foundation of outright lies. He did not lie, cheat, bully, or corrupt his way into the Oval office the way that Lance lied, cheated, bullied and corrupted his way into seven Tour De France titles.

That's kind of what I meant in the false bill of goods comment - in that Clinton at least came by his achievements more honestly than Lance did. I didn't even factor in the obfuscation of the whole Lewinsky affair when I made that comment.

I suppose in some way people judge Clinton by the Lewinsky affair, but that was just one mistake that did not completely define or impede his ability to act as President. Lance's ability to be a Tour De France winning cyclist was premised on the fact that he had to do it dishonestly; you really can't separate Lance the cyclist from Lance the cheater whereas you can separate Clinton the President from Clinton the philanderer.

And then there's that "good....assisting/inspiring cancer survivors.." thing. It's obvious that Lance and his handlers were cynically constructing a defense shield and cash machine for their use. It was another scam and, if any people recieved inspiration it was merely part of the greater manipulation and cloak. That makes it much worse in my mind.

 

[Carols]

Lance's ability to be a Tour De France winning cyclist was premised on the fact that he had to do it dishonestly; you really can't separate Lance the cyclist from Lance the cheater whereas you can separate Clinton the President from Clinton the philanderer.

Indeed Bill Clinton lead a country for 8 years, and getting a bl*w job had no impact on how he got there or what he did in office.

Lance's entire career was built on 'The Big Lie', to quote him.

 

[DirtyWorks]

Indeed Bill Clinton lead a country for 8 years, and getting a bl*w job had no impact on how he got there or what he did in office.

Lance's entire career was built on 'The Big Lie', to quote him.

Be careful with this. I'm not going to derail the thread, but in many ways Clinton and Armstrong are very similar. Being elected as a recent President in the U.S. is as tainted as being a modern winner of the Tour de France.

This has nothing to do with my own party affiliations either. It just is the way it is.

 

[Carols]

Be careful with this. I'm not going to derail the thread, but in many ways Clinton and Armstrong are very similar. Being elected as a recent President in the U.S. is as tainted as being a modern winner of the Tour de France.

This has nothing to do with my own party affiliations either. It just is the way it is.

Well you're entitled to your opinion but Bill Clinton as president, presided over the longest period of peacetime economic expansion in American history. And I am not a Democrat either.

Lance is a dirty, lying drug thug that ruled a sport through intimidation.

I see a big difference between the two

 

[D-Queued]

Well you're entitled to your opinion but Bill Clinton as president, presided over the longest period of peacetime economic expansion in American history. And I am not a Democrat either.

Lance is a dirty, lying drug thug that ruled a sport through intimidation.

I see a big difference between the two

...and wasn't elected as a result of a messed up recount in Florida.

Even that, however, bears no resemblance to extent of the fraud involved in the swindling of 7 yellow jerseys.

Dave.

 

[Microchip]

Definitely, so much so that I had to stop reading the article ! Maybe a cut/paste in notepad would help!

I'm seeing this type of page more and more. I wondered if it's a mobile view running amok on a PC. Couldn't read the article either.

 

[thehog]

Well you're entitled to your opinion but Bill Clinton as president, presided over the longest period of peacetime economic expansion in American history. And I am not a Democrat either.

Lance is a dirty, lying drug thug that ruled a sport through intimidation.

I see a big difference between the two

He was the forefather of deregulation of the banking industry. Joining investment to consumer banks.

Probably the cause for the banking collapse and global recession.

He also deregulated the airline industry and security. You know how that worked out.

Often cause and effect are years apart. Decades.

 

[stevie47]

Ok everybody... Just stop.

Thanks,

New guy

 

[DirtyWorks]

Ok everybody... Just stop.

Thanks,

New guy

This is right. I'm deleting my posts that spoiled the Clinton love. I hate it when others start a skirmish and it's not particularly relevant anyway. Not a big deal.

Now, back on topic.

Were Wonderboy documents that he fought so hard to keep private ever released?????

 

[northstar]

Ok everybody... Just stop.

Thanks,

New guy

Hey new guy,
Welcome to the forum. Your request has been noted. Please don’t click on the thread if it bothers you.
Regards,
New girl

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

He was the forefather of deregulation of the banking industry. Joining investment to consumer banks.

Probably the cause for the banking collapse and global recession.

He also deregulated the airline industry and security. You know how that worked out.

Often cause and effect are years apart. Decades.

So, he is just like Armstrong, a puppet for the higher society.

Grazie.

Both A-holes, first class.

 

[D-Queued]

He was the forefather of deregulation of the banking industry. Joining investment to consumer banks.

Probably the cause for the banking collapse and global recession.

He also deregulated the airline industry and security. You know how that worked out.

Often cause and effect are years apart. Decades.

Sorry, but you. don't. know. what. you. are. talking. about. You clearly don't understand how the US political system works - or how it was an act of Congress that ultimately repealed Glass-Steagall.

This is NOT a political statement.

This is simply fact.

Deregulation of the banking industry started long ago.Here is a good summary. And, it was the 'push of the Reagan administration' that created the momentum to repeal Glass-Steagall. As noted in Wikipedia, "The push of the Reagan administration for deregulation made it harder to catch the fraud. "

While Glass-Steagall (1933) was ultimately repealed in 1999, the steps to deregulation started long before that.

High interest rates in the 1970s (when monetary policy focused on money supply instead of interest rates), and initial deregulation in S&L, helped lead to the S&L crisis.

In turn, the Tax Reform Act of 1986 along with the 1986 S&L crisis gave us the forerunner of the 2007/8 real estate crisis. With that Tax Reform Act, real estate speculation was catalyzed and S&L's were motivated to make increasingly risky loans on speculative real estate transactions.

It was the 1980s when US banks began purchasing investment banks, not the 1990s.

Lance is being investigated for criminal activity. That activity was on a deliberate path to defraud an entire sport.

There is only one President that committed anything close to the kind of organized fraud perpetuated to secure a title.

Now, if you want to make a comparison to Clinton then it is noteworthy that Clinton was actively consulting that same President for insight on foreign relations.

Ultimately, this comparison between Lance and any President is more than a threadjack or a red herring. It is a complete waste of bandwidth.

You may not like a particular elected official, but there are no asterisks, strikeouts, or statements of 'Abandoned' under the official record of 'President of the United States'.

Dave.

 

[RobbieCanuck]

Hey new guy,
Welcome to the forum. Your request has been noted. Please don’t click on the thread if it bothers you.
Regards,
New girl

If a new guy is bothered by something that is exactly why he should click on and comment. That's what forums are all about! Surely you are not trying to stifle opinion?

 

[shawnrohrbach]

Sorry, but you. don't. know. what. you. are. talking. about. You clearly don't understand how the US political system works - or how it was an act of Congress that ultimately repealed Glass-Steagall.

This is NOT a political statement.

This is simply fact.

Deregulation of the banking industry started long ago.Here is a good summary. And, it was the 'push of the Reagan administration' that created the momentum to repeal Glass-Steagall. As noted in Wikipedia, "The push of the Reagan administration for deregulation made it harder to catch the fraud. "

While Glass-Steagall (1933) was ultimately repealed in 1999, the steps to deregulation started long before that.

High interest rates in the 1970s (when monetary policy focused on money supply instead of interest rates), and initial deregulation in S&L, helped lead to the S&L crisis.

In turn, the Tax Reform Act of 1986 along with the 1986 S&L crisis gave us the forerunner of the 2007/8 real estate crisis. With that Tax Reform Act, real estate speculation was catalyzed and S&L's were motivated to make increasingly risky loans on speculative real estate transactions.

It was the 1980s when US banks began purchasing investment banks, not the 1990s.

Lance is being investigated for criminal activity. That activity was on a deliberate path to defraud an entire sport.

There is only one President that committed anything close to the kind of organized fraud perpetuated to secure a title.

Now, if you want to make a comparison to Clinton then it is noteworthy that Clinton was actively consulting that same President for insight on foreign relations.

Ultimately, this comparison between Lance and any President is more than a threadjack or a red herring. It is a complete waste of bandwidth.

You may not like a particular elected official, but there are no asterisks, strikeouts, or statements of 'Abandoned' under the official record of 'President of the United States'.

Dave.

Dave, thanks. I was just about to dive in on this one and you have done a good job of it. There was one notorious abandonment, of course, Richard Milhouse Nixon. I think there is an asterisk somewhere by his name as well.

 

[MarkvW]

Dave, thanks. I was just about to dive in on this one and you have done a good job of it. There was one notorious abandonment, of course, Richard Milhouse Nixon. I think there is an asterisk somewhere by his name as well.

There are a few DNFs, as well.