Official Lance Armstrong Thread: Part 3 (Post-Confession)

[Bluenote]

Though you didn't ask me, please allow me to comment.

I have no problem with people getting appearance fees. Even those people that are already wealthy, celebrity or otherwise.

Free market, demand versus supply, and all that.

However, the Lance and Lance Armstrong Foundation situation is a bit different. The obvious conflict of interest is minimally hypocritical and, arguably, likely illegal*.

If a charity is set up in your name, then you should be endorsing the charity. NOT the other way around.

Lance was clearly not promoting a charitable cause. Lance was blatantly promoting a selfish cause. This conclusion is inescapable. Particularly so when Lance never, ever donated a dime himself.

How many people paid to see Lance and didn't realize that they were not donating to the charity, or that he wouldn't provide at least some portion to the charity? The duplicity of the Livestrong.com and .org reinforces the scam.

*In the case of Greg Mortensen of Three Cups of Tea fame, the Montana Attorney General found that he had personally profited from the speaker's fees he received, the book royalties and the charter flights. Imagine if he had taken private Lear Jet flights like Lance.

As a result of that investigation, Mortensen reimbursed the charity with more than $1.1 million.

It is astounding that Lance has not yet faced similar investigations.

Dave.

Yeah, I get what you are saying, appearence fees to promote your own charity seem beyond sketchy.

Armstrong claims to have giving a lot of $$ to Livestrong.

 

[Bluenote]

So according to this article, Peletonia's former executive made 600k. Ulman's salary is supposed to be in line with his Livestrong salary.

http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/local/2014/09/23/livestrong-ceo-to-lead-pelotonia.html

That's a lot of cash for a charity that has only raise 60 million. Even if it's offset by funding partners. That's money the funding partners won't be giving to the root cause.

 

[Archibald]

Are you OK with a multi-millionare like Armstrong getting paid 6 figure appearance fees?

Not when that said celebrity uses the charity's money to fuel up his private plane to fly to (and from) the TDU and collect (and pocket) his $2m appearance fee...
If the $5k an hour usually quoted is accurate, then a 15hr flight each way (LAx to SYD) is a 30hr round trip of $150k. And then there's the additional $20k for the extra 4 hours to and from SYD to ADL*

So, livestrong(.com) pays $170k so he can collect and pocket $2m and have a January holiday in Australia...

* based on domestic flight times/speeds of which I don't know if his private plane is faster or slower...

 

[DirtyWorks]

..But I feel weird about wealthy celebs getting appearance fees.

Well, then don't dig too deep when you see those "all proceeds go to charity" events because the math for "all" goes something like:

Event_revenue - costs_to_promote_event - costs_to_run_the_event - promoter_management_fee - celeb_appearance_fees = all_proceeds.

Everyone takes theirs off before they get to the "all proceeds" part. This doesn't happen all the time everywhere. Just be aware there is plenty of money being kept for less direct people and sometimes that includes the celebrity appearing. Wonderboy at one point didn't even bother pretending anymore.

 

[DirtyWorks]

Not when that said celebrity uses the charity's money to fuel up his private plane to fly to (and from) the TDU and collect (and pocket) his $2m appearance fee...
If the $5k an hour usually quoted is accurate, then a 15hr flight each way (LAx to SYD) is a 30hr round trip of $150k. And then there's the additional $20k for the extra 4 hours to and from SYD to ADL*

So, livestrong(.com) pays $170k so he can collect and pocket $2m and have a January holiday in Australia...

* based on domestic flight times/speeds of which I don't know if his private plane is faster or slower...

Oh Archibald,

Wonderboy has paid dearly for his infractions that everyone else was doing anyway. He's flying commercial now.

Don't forget the costs of the jet are deducted from revenue along with the handy ability to shuttle drugs around with no interference.

 

[D-Queued]

Yeah, I get what you are saying, appearence fees to promote your own charity seem beyond sketchy.

Armstrong claims to have giving a lot of $$ to Livestrong.

I think he meant BS, not $$.



Dave.

 

[MarkvW]

Yeah, I get what you are saying, appearence fees to promote your own charity seem beyond sketchy.

Armstrong claims to have giving a lot of $$ to Livestrong.

"Charities" get away with murder. Great place for politicians' wives to work, though.

 

[StyrbjornSterki]

...Wonderboy has paid dearly for his infractions that everyone else was doing anyway. He's flying commercial now.....

Are you speculating or do we know this? One can buy a "time share" in a business jet, which is far cheaper than owning it, but there are availability restrictions. I'd imagined Wonderboy would go for a time share rather than flying commercial to avoid contact with the great unwashed masses.

 

[86TDFWinner]

Armstrong has tried everything to circumvent the process that was laid out for him way before he was officially sanctioned.

He hates Travis Tygart and did everything in his power to defang the USADA.

He'll never go to them to have his sanction reduced. This is what happens when you suffer the type of narcissistic personality disorder that was given opportunity to increase unchecked over so many years.

After the downfall, he still believes he's in control of his own narrative. That has been taken from him along with all of his seven tour wins despite his denials.

He is left with taking highly inappropriate, creepy and downright obscene photos partying with underage teenage girls. If that isn't as pathetic as it gets, only time will tell if he will sink any lower.

And despite what anyone thinks, he can always sink lower. For him there is no bottom.

Nailed it!

 

[Archibald]

Oh Archibald,

Wonderboy has paid dearly for his infractions that everyone else was doing anyway. He's flying commercial now.

Don't forget the costs of the jet are deducted from revenue along with the handy ability to shuttle drugs around with no interference.

somehow I just don't see him sitting in cattle class with the rest of us though.


Anyone know what/where the private plane is now? Does he still have it? Sold it? Gifted to the kids? Hiding it at Travolta's pad?

 

[MacRoadie]

somehow I just don't see him sitting in cattle class with the rest of us though.


Anyone know what/where the private plane is now? Does he still have it? Sold it? Gifted to the kids? Hiding it at Travolta's pad?

I'm assuming whoever bought it had the vanity tail number "N7LA" changed, so it will take some detective work, but he reportedly sold it in December of 2012.

Here is the most current info on the aircraft (based on the old tail number).:

http://flightaware.com/resources/registration/N7LA

 

[StyrbjornSterki]

I'm assuming whoever bought it had the vanity tail number "N7LA" changed, so it will take some detective work, but he reportedly sold it in December of 2012.

Here is the most current info on the aircraft (based on the old tail number).:

http://flightaware.com/resources/registration/N7LA

The new tail number is 999AA, owned by a Houston company, Ascend Performance Materials, LLC. I traced it using the Mellow Johnny's a/c's manufacturer's serial number listed here. FAA says the new owner registered it in September 2012, but the serial# and date of manufacture match.

There still is an active N7LA, but it's a Van's RV6 experimental.

somehow I just don't see him sitting in cattle class with the rest of us though....

As I mentioned, he could have invested in an aircraft syndicate, essentially a time-share where all owners share calendar expenses and each is responsible for his own flight hour expenses. But that necessarily involves availability restrictions, because they can't all fly it at once.

Or he could be hiring a jet as-needed.

Corinna Schumacher, wife to 7x world driving champion Michael, recently put their business jet on the market. Not because the family is strapped for cash but because the costliest aeroplane of all is the one sitting on the tarmac. Because you still have to pay fixed calendar costs (insurance, hangar fees, calendar-driven maintenance, etc), whether it's being flown or not. But if you're not flying it, your return on investment is ZERO. When Michael was healthy and they jet-setted all over the world with regularity, it was a justifiable expense. But not now.

There's an old aviation axiom, if it flies, floats or fornicates, it's cheaper to rent. I have owned private aeroplanes. On average, the monthly fixed costs of ownership was roughly the same as four hours of flight time. In other words, for the same money as it cost me to own but not fly my own aeroplane, I could have been renting and flying someone else's for four hours each month. The break-even point between flying my own and renting someone else's was around 10-12 hours per month.

If Pharmstrong's travel schedule isn't sufficiently aggressive to support defraying the fixed costs of ownership, selling it might have been purely a business decision. And he always can hire one.

 

[DirtyWorks]

Are you speculating or do we know this? One can buy a "time share" in a business jet, which is far cheaper than owning it, but there are availability restrictions. I'd imagined Wonderboy would go for a time share rather than flying commercial to avoid contact with the great unwashed masses.

http://m.cyclingnews.com/news/armstrong-claims-thomas-weisel-knew-about-usps-doping

Claims to fly commercial while whinig about being caught. Now, is it true? It might not be!!!

 

[Semper Fidelis]

They were probably confused by the less than useful idiots defending Armstrong for years on various cycling boards.

Yeah because that was were the real fight for clean cycling was going down.

I do like the way you cracked off on ChrisE though.

 

[frenchfry]

This made me think of the good old days when Lance and one of the Olsen twins were a thing. Now it is Sarkozy's half-brother who has married Mary-Kate. The link is that Sarkozy (the president one) protected Lance from any testing/legal problems here in France, in return he received a Trek bike and lots of photo ops.

http://madame.lefigaro.fr/celebrites/mary-kate-olsen-olivier-sarkozy-maries-secret-300914-975461

 

[Race Radio]

http://velonews.competitor.com/2014/09/news/new-filing-glimpses-armstrong-defense_347817

Lance's defense.....You should have known I was lying.

“Here, we’re really seeing kind of balls to the wall litigation,” Stichel said. “People are litigating anything they can.”

 

[DirtyWorks]

http://velonews.competitor.com/2014/09/news/new-filing-glimpses-armstrong-defense_347817

Lance's defense.....You should have known I was lying.

When he was attacking anyone who suggested he was doping.

The filing states that in order to “remedy the situation,” the government requested Tailwind pay $50,000 for public relations service, which is a payment “no one contends has not been paid,” the file reads.

I'm having comprehension problems with the double/triple negatives in that statement. WTH is it supposed to mean?

 

[Beech Mtn]

When he was attacking anyone who suggested he was doping.

The filing states that in order to “remedy the situation,” the government requested Tailwind pay $50,000 for public relations service, which is a payment “no one contends has not been paid,” the file reads.

I'm having comprehension problems with the double/triple negatives in that statement. WTH is it supposed to mean?

Translation:
Look, you (the government) TOLD us to hire Public Strategies. So we did. That makes you just as culpable as me for any coverup. We kept our part of the deal.

(at least, that's my best guess. My sociopath-to-legalese translations are about as good as Hog's Korean)

 

[Race Radio]

So if everyone should have known then what about Lance's buddies who lied for him under oath? Hmmmm, they might have some problems going forward.

It is clear that Lance is intending to fight this with volumes of paperwork. Today's filings alone were over 200 pages. His defense is amazingly insane. He submits as "Proof" that the USPS knew the team was doping multiple articles and emails from 2000 discussing doping and the team. What makes it so insane is all of the emails and articles have Lance, Johan, etc. strongly denying doping and smearing anyone who questioned them.

Lots of crying about leaks.....which is funny as the source for many of the early links was Lance himself. He was trying to smear Landis as an extortionist.

He goes after Floyd saying that if Floyd breaches his settlement for fraud then he should not be able to get any money from the Qui Tam......of course there is nothing to support this but his lawyers just figured they would toss it in and see if anyone notices.

Amazing amount of cajones

 

[86TDFWinner]

So if everyone should have known then what about Lance's buddies who lied for him under oath? Hmmmm, they might have some problems going forward.

It is clear that Lance is intending to fight this with volumes of paperwork. Today's filings alone were over 200 pages. His defense is amazingly insane. He submits as "Proof" that the USPS knew the team was doping multiple articles and emails from 2000 discussing doping and the team. What makes it so insane is all of the emails and articles have Lance, Johan, etc. strongly denying doping and smearing anyone who questioned them.

Lots of crying about leaks.....which is funny as the source for many of the early links was Lance himself. He was trying to smear Landis as an extortionist.

He goes after Floyd saying that if Floyd breaches his settlement for fraud then he should not be able to get any money from the Qui Tam......of course there is nothing to support this but his lawyers just figured they would toss it in and see if anyone notices.

Amazing amount of cajones

No one's said Wonderboy is intelligent, he's about as dumb as a box of rocks. Did anyone here not know he would fight this to the bitter end?

 

[RownhamHill]

When he was attacking anyone who suggested he was doping.

The filing states that in order to “remedy the situation,” the government requested Tailwind pay $50,000 for public relations service, which is a payment “no one contends has not been paid,” the file reads.

I'm having comprehension problems with the double/triple negatives in that statement. WTH is it supposed to mean?

It means: which is a payment everyone accepts was made.

Why they couch it in such bizarre negative language is anyone's case, probably indicative of the underlying mind set. . .

 

[D-Queued]

Translation:
Look, you (the government) TOLD us to hire Public Strategies. So we did. That makes you just as culpable as me for any coverup. We kept our part of the deal.

(at least, that's my best guess. My sociopath-to-legalese translations are about as good as Hog's Korean)

That's close.

You need to put a bit more emphasis on the sociopath thought process, though. Lie, lie, lie.

Thus, what this really means is not just that the government is culpable.

What Lance is saying is that 'You told us to do this'. Thus, 'YOU' are responsible. YOU told us to orchestrate a cover-up.

See, it was a Government conspiracy after all.

Dave.

 

[Race Radio]

No one's said Wonderboy is intelligent, he's about as dumb as a box of rocks. Did anyone here not know he would fight this to the bitter end?

But he is paying millions for legal advice that produces these documents. Perhaps I am missing something but I can't see how he has a chance

 

[Bluenote]

What does he have to lose? He's band for life and his reputation is totally shot. Yeah, his defense is a long shot, but spending a few million on lawyers with the slim chance of avoiding a mega-million judgement seems like a reasonable tactic.

 

[Merckx index]

The USPS paid more than $30 million for the team from 2001 to 2004 and has sought three times its investment, though Velo understands the number discussed as a possible settlement is much lower.

So maybe something like $50 million? If LA really is worth over $100 million, as has been suggested but not documented in various stories, he could survive this without going bankrupt. Even if he doesn't successfully get the Weasel to pay some of it.

And let's not forget that a while back there were stories that LA had refused a settlement on the order of maybe $20 million. As I noted back then, he might have settled all the major cases for $30-40 million. Maybe that's more than he has, or almost as much, but at the rate he's going, he's going to spend millions extra in legal fees. It does seem he would rather fight and go down in flames than submit and live on with maybe enough for a fairly lavish lifestyle.