Official Lance Armstrong Thread: Part 3 (Post-Confession)

[Zweistein]

Simon Weisenthal, the famous Nazi hunter, wrote a book called "The Butterfly". For those unfamiliar with the premise, Weisenthal recounts how he was called upon to take the confession of a dying German soldier who had participated in atrocities related to the Holocaust. The soldier was looking for forgiveness before he died, and Weisenthal left the room saying absolutely nothing to him.
.

I think you mean "The Sunflower".

 

[DirtyWorks]

... he will get no forgiveness from me, only silence. Betsy Andreu and Jonathan Vaughters need to do likewise, not only for cycling but for themselves.

Absolutely true. Even then, the Armstrong internal dialog is he's not the problem. Which is why you can't engage it.

JV thinks he's smarter than that, and he may be until Wonderboy puts him on the sh!t list for some petty offense.

 

[Berzin]

I think you mean "The Sunflower".

Thanks. Changed it in the original post.

 

[horsinabout]

You have worked hard on this post Berzin

Why is it that certain people want to reach out to Armstrong, especially Betsy Andreu? It seems as if closure is really important to her. She must realize by now the type of person Armstrong is. This has been cemented by the things he stated during their latest back-and-forth.

Yes and also Lemond is inviting him to anti doping conferences, which makes me wonder. LA to clean up cycling is like asking Charles Manson to clean up Bedlam.

Simon Weisenthal, the famous Nazi hunter, wrote a book called "The Sunflower". For those unfamiliar with the premise, Weisenthal recounts how he was called upon to take the confession of a dying German soldier who had participated in atrocities related to the Holocaust. The soldier was looking for forgiveness before he died, and Weisenthal left the room saying absolutely nothing to him.

The absolution that should never come.

I find it disturbing that he's still able to manipulate people through the sheer force of the cult of his personality. There is no need to be scared of him anymore. He's officially a nobody who can't even take part in two-bit triathlons because of the stench of his actions. Nobody wants him anymore, yet he still thinks the cycling world can't do without his presence.

What about the near 4,000,000 twitter followers he has, not quite a nobody just yet.

He deserves to go to Hell for the manner in which he manipulated the cancer community into making him Cancer Martyr #1, and for that he will get no forgiveness from me, only silence.

You can work wonders when you have a charity behind you, see Jimmy Saville.

Betsy Andreu and Jonathan Vaughters need to do likewise, not only for cycling but for themselves

And Lemond.

 

[Benotti69]

You have worked hard on this post Berzin


Yes and also Lemond is inviting him to anti doping conferences, which makes me wonder. LA to clean up cycling is like asking Charles Manson to clean up Bedlam.



The absolution that should never come.




What about the near 4,000,000 twitter followers he has, not quite a nobody just yet.

You can work wonders when you have a charity behind you, see Jimmy Saville.

And Lemond.

I doubt MonkeyMouth has 4 million followers. No doubt he has lots watching, but that is due to 'car crash tv' or 'rubber necking'

 

[horsinabout]

I doubt MonkeyMouth has 4 million followers. No doubt he has lots watching, but that is due to 'car crash tv' or 'rubber necking'

Tweets 3,964,292 last count. Must be more followers than the clinic?

 

[northstar]

You have worked hard on this post Berzin

Yes and also Lemond is inviting him to anti doping conferences, which makes me wonder. LA to clean up cycling is like asking Charles Manson to clean up Bedlam.

The absolution that should never come.

What about the near 4,000,000 twitter followers he has, not quite a nobody just yet.

You can work wonders when you have a charity behind you, see Jimmy Saville.

And Lemond.

When did Lemond invite Armstrong to an anti-doping conference? Very surprised to hear this.

Do you mean the arbitration hearing with USADA? Or UCI’s independent commission? Or WADA’s ‘fictional’ truth and reconciliation? I think Greg would invite Lance to attend these anti-doping events prior to any other conference.

 

[Berzin]

Well Betsy Andreu, Greg Lemond and JV are prepared to forgive him or to reconcile issues with LA, so although I made a joke about Manson, he is no mass murderer. Perhaps they share some of LA's guilt, if not his horrible personality.

You couldn't be more wrong on this point if you tried, so my suggestion to you is give up on this line of reasoning. It reeks of trolling.

 

[horsinabout]

You couldn't be more wrong on this point if you tried, so my suggestion to you is give up on this line of reasoning. . . .

What I meant was that Betsy, Lemond and JV have both been associated with doping in some form. But I did highlight that they don't in any way share LA's horrible personality. This was my point. I think you have misunderstood me.

I have always expressed an honest and genuine viewpoint. I do try to add cutting humour sometimes, but that is just me - no offence meant. You may not agree with me.

I believe Lemond asked LA to attend the last university talk he did, which was posted here on the clinic. LA turned down the offer. It was to confront LA with true price of winning. This is how I believe Lemond deals with his experiences, and this is not related to Armstrong, who is not confronting his actions.

You say that JV, Betsy should forget LA for the good of the sport. But perhaps Lemond has the right idea here, get LA to confront the true price of winning.

EDIT Dr Masarati has kindly informed us that the university invited LA.

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/i...xas-symposium-article-1.1324698#ixzz2RH1cDjlE

 

[ultimobici]

Sorry, but I missed the doping of Lemond & Betsy. Enlighten me.

 

[Semper Fidelis]

What I meant was that Betsy, Lemond and JV have both been associated with doping in some form. But I did highlight that they don't in any way share LA's horrible personality. This was my point. I think you have miss understood me.

Exuse me, I am no troll, I never have been and never will be. I have always expressed an honest and genuine viewpoint. I do try to add cutting humour sometimes, but that is just me - no offence meant. You may not agree with me, but this doesn't give you the right, even as a mod, to call me a troll.

I believe Lemond asked LA to attend the last university talk he did, which was posted here on the clinic. LA turned down the offer. It was to confront LA with true price of winning. This is how I believe Lemond deals with his experiences, and this is not related to Armstrong, who is not confronting his actions.

You say that JV, Betsy should forget LA for the good of the sport. But perhaps Lemond has the right idea here, get LA to confront the true price of winning.

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/i...xas-symposium-article-1.1324698#ixzz2RH1cDjlE

Lucky for you that you made this post very early in the AM for the US time zones. Otherwise the amount of hate you're about to receive is going to be overwhelming.

Other thing is someone will come on and argue the point that Modman never called you a troll but thinks your post was a troll. That will go on for about 20 posts before they banninate ya.

But with regards to the other doping is also going to cause some rump hurt around here. JV's druge use is well known. Betsy was not a cyclist but her husband was and maybe you were trying to make a relationship argument with regards to PED use. Lemond that is going to be the biggest argument you receive here, BECAUSE anytime I have seen someone bring it up the pile on begins because you will be labeled a fanboy trying to deflect LA pain through Lemond.

Good Luck da-Horssinabout Hope all goes well.

 

[horsinabout]

Sorry, but I missed the doping of Lemond & Betsy. Enlighten me.

Betsy association = Husband admitting doping

Lemond association = death of a team mate possibly caused from experimental doping back in the 80's.

JV = confession to doping.

 

[DirtyWorks]

Betsy association = Husband admitting doping

Lemond association = death of a team mate possibly caused from experimental doping back in the 80's.

JV = confession to doping.

Find the Lemond thread and read it. It gets repetitive because of people that weren't following cycling during Lemond's reign apply a bunch of modern and false assumptions, just like you, to his career.

Wonderboy is not changing. According to his world view, the problem is everyone else not understanding how he was railroaded. There appears to be no possibility of rehabilitation. This is not the same as Frankie and JV's handling of their doping.

 

[horsinabout]

Find the Lemond thread and read it. It gets repetitive because of people that weren't following cycling during Lemond's reign apply a bunch of modern and false assumptions, just like you, to his career.

Wonderboy is not changing. According to his world view, the problem is everyone else not understanding how he was railroaded. There appears to be no possibility of rehabilitation. This is not the same as Frankie and JV's handling of their doping.

I have expressed a number of opinions on the Lemond anti doping stance. And in doing so have read and watched many of articles and videos he has done. I personally have learnt a lot in doing so. One of the articles was this one.
http://greglemond.com/blog/doping-and-those-we-love/

I don't believe I have drawn any false assumptions, that you do not specify. If you read the above article it say's all you need to know about the Lemond era, and his believable personal anti doping stance. I have much empathy for him. What is more I have learnt this by posting here on the clinic forum.

Regarding Wonderboy as you call him (LA). I think he probably is quite high on the narcissistic personality spectrum. And he will thus seek only oportunities for himself. So he is not worth spending any more time on. I will also say that in the sport of cycling he is not the only one of this ilk.

And in expressing a view point on Lemond on the clinic, as a poster, I have been bullied, harrassed, baited and now see glen-wilson poster inciting hatred from the many posters in the USA, which just about takes the biscuit. And posters have been banned for a lot less.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

I have expressed a number of opinions on the Lemond anti doping stance. And in doing so have read and watched many of articles and videos he has done. I personally have learnt a lot in doing so. One of the articles was this one.
http://greglemond.com/blog/doping-and-those-we-love/

I don't believe I have drawn any false assumptions, that you do not specify. If you read the above article it say's all you need to know about the Lemond era, and his believable personal anti doping stance. I have much empathy for him. What is more I have learnt this by posting here on the clinic forum.

Regarding Wonderboy as you call him (LA). I think he probably is quite high on the narcissistic personality spectrum. And he will thus seek only oportunities for himself. So he is not worth spending any more time on. I will also say that in the sport of cycling he is not the only one of this ilk.

And in expressing a view point on Lemond on the clinic, as a poster, I have been bullied, harrassed, baited and now see glen-wilson poster inciting hatred from the many posters in the USA, which just about takes the biscuit. And posters have been banned for a lot less.

To the blue - in one of your recent posts said LeMond invited LA to the 'university talk" - he did no such thing, the university invited LA, who declined.

 

[hiero2]

. . .
Wonderboy is not changing. According to his world view, the problem is everyone else not understanding how he was railroaded. There appears to be no possibility of rehabilitation. This is not the same as Frankie and JV's handling of their doping.

Oddly, I think, that is pretty much horsin's point. See the next quote.

I have expressed a number of opinions on the Lemond anti doping stance. And in doing so have read and watched many of articles and videos he has done. I personally have learnt a lot in doing so. One of the articles was this one. . . .

Regarding Wonderboy as you call him (LA). I think he probably is quite high on the narcissistic personality spectrum. And he will thus seek only oportunities for himself. So he is not worth spending any more time on. I will also say that in the sport of cycling he is not the only one of this ilk.
. . . .

To the blue - in one of your recent posts said LeMond invited LA to the 'university talk" - he did no such thing, the university invited LA, who declined.

Dr Mas - you could be right, maybe horsin is. Neither one of you provided any links to validate your version of what happened.



Now, a little word to the wise. So far most of the responses have been fairly reasonable - but this is obviously quite potentially a wildfire - as a number of you have pointed out. Let us KEEP it reasonable. READ the posts carefully, and ask for clarification where necessary, as was done above (even if it was done with tongue in cheek, it was done well enough to keep things civil, see next quotes). Think twice about what you are writing, and thank you very much.

I doubt MonkeyMouth has 4 million followers. No doubt he has lots watching, but that is due to 'car crash tv' or 'rubber necking'

Sorry, but I missed the doping of Lemond & Betsy. Enlighten me.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

Oddly, I think, that is pretty much horsin's point. See the next quote.





Dr Mas - you could be right, maybe horsin is. Neither one of you provided any links to validate your version of what happened.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Now, a little word to the wise. So far most of the responses have been fairly reasonable - but this is obviously quite potentially a wildfire - as a number of you have pointed out. Let us KEEP it reasonable. READ the posts carefully, and ask for clarification where necessary, as was done above (even if it was done with tongue in cheek, it was done well enough to keep things civil). Think twice about what you are writing, and thank you very much.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I cannot link to something that didn't happen (ie LeMond "inviting" LA)
It didn't happen, in the video it mentions La was invited by the University and he declined.

 

[Semper Fidelis]

I have expressed a number of opinions on the Lemond anti doping stance. And in doing so have read and watched many of articles and videos he has done. I personally have learnt a lot in doing so. One of the articles was this one.
http://greglemond.com/blog/doping-and-those-we-love/

I don't believe I have drawn any false assumptions, that you do not specify. If you read the above article it say's all you need to know about the Lemond era, and his believable personal anti doping stance. I have much empathy for him. What is more I have learnt this by posting here on the clinic forum.

Regarding Wonderboy as you call him (LA). I think he probably is quite high on the narcissistic personality spectrum. And he will thus seek only oportunities for himself. So he is not worth spending any more time on. I will also say that in the sport of cycling he is not the only one of this ilk.

And in expressing a view point on Lemond on the clinic, as a poster, I have been bullied, harrassed, baited and now see glen-wilson poster inciting hatred from the many posters in the USA, which just about takes the biscuit. And posters have been banned for a lot less.

2n's man.

Dude chill. I was not inciting hatred. I was trying to let you know that a post pile on was coming your way. That is what happens everytime someone brings something like that up (Lemond and doping). Regardless of the view many around here will get all worked up that his name is even mentioned. That was what I was saying in my post.

I was trying to give you a heads up with what was coming or for when the clinic brought the heat onto you.

 

[86TDFWinner]

Yes and also Lemond is inviting him to anti doping conferences, which makes me wonder.

Curious where you heard/read this? Afaict, LeMond DETESTS Wonderboy and I doubt seriously he has anything whatsoever to do with Wonderboy. Just my opinion though. But seriously, where did you get this crazy info? You certainly have an imagination on some things.

 

[webvan]

Yeah last we heard he refused to take his "apology" call.

 

[horsinabout]

Curious where you heard/read this? Afaict, LeMond DETESTS Wonderboy and I doubt seriously he has anything whatsoever to do with Wonderboy. Just my opinion though.


Also, please post your proof/evidence on Lemond and doping please. But seriously, where did you get this crazy info?

I think I heard Lemond discuss it on a video, but only in contxt of LA having been invited to the Texas conference. This is most likely where I drew my inference from.

I'm pretty sure that Dr Masarati and his famous counter intuition is correct on this one, that the university actually invited LA. He turned it down anyway, which just shows you what sort of person LA is, as if we need reminding.

 

[TomasC]

Yeah last we heard he refused to take his "apology" call.

Much more healthier approach than Betsy, methinks.

 

[ChewbaccaD]

Much more healthier approach than Betsy, methinks.

Which is understandable considering the difference in their relationships to LA in the 90's...

 

[Race Radio]

I think I heard Lemond discuss it on a video, but only in contxt of LA having been invited to the Texas conference. This is most likely where I drew my inference from.

LeMond never invited lance nor would have attended if Lance was there.

If lance and Greg are going to be in the same room it will be because lance is writing Greg a big check for screwing him

 

[horsinabout]

LeMond never invited lance nor would have attended if Lance was there.

If lance and Greg are going to be in the same room it will be because lance is writing Greg a big check for screwing him

OK THANK YOU! OVER and OUT!