Olympics 2021

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A contrasted Olympics campaign for France, and not really encouraging before Paris 2024.

We were astonishingly good in team events, but we won't reach top 5 in the medal table if we continue to subperform in the three main olympic sports that are Athletics, Swimming and Cycling (2 silver and 2 bronze in Tokyo).
 


made it look easy....

womens/mens races were similar ....large pack covered early km no problem....slowly
whittled down as conditions took toll....so attritional

Mark L
Daniel Do Nasciemento looked a lot better there than he did later on.

Yeah, this was a pretty nasty move. Luckily he was dropped not that long after.
 
This was such a crap move, especially given the severe weather conditions. He wasn't just being unsportsman-like, he was downright endangering other runners' wellbeing.

I'm sure social media is letting him have it, I don't see how he can be granted any benefit of the doubt.
 
A contrasted Olympics campaign for France, and not really encouraging before Paris 2024.

We were astonishingly good in team events, but we won't reach top 5 in the medal table if we continue to subperform in the three main olympic sports that are Athletics, Swimming and Cycling (2 silver and 2 bronze in Tokyo).
Don't worry, the medals will come as soon as you're host. ;)
In seriousness, I think France will do better at Athletics again.
What would you say are the structures for other sports like?
 
Germany is disappointed with the outcome, of course, but it was to be expected, and then on top there was some "bad luck" involved in some cases which turned some planned gold medals into nothing, like in javelin throw and karate, but that's always and for every nation the case.
I like, though, that the medals are spread across many sports, honestly I don't need 15 medals in track cycling or shooting or even canooing.
So, Germany won medals in canooing, equestrians, tennis, wrestling, athletics, cycling, swimming, judo, rowing, sailing, gymnastics, table tennis, archery and diving.
It can be concluded, though, that there is still a tendency to win in sports that require expensive equipment (horses, bicycles, boats) and even more, that the medals are a result of very ambitious, talented individuals who are willing to put everything into their dream, not of good structures or any kind of program (I don't mean the clinic stuff, but some kind of organized effort and respect for sports/ athletes).
Since the structures won't change for the better I can't see Germany's results getting better in the future.
 
Germany is disappointed with the outcome, of course, but it was to be expected, and then on top there was some "bad luck" involved in some cases which turned some planned gold medals into nothing, like in javelin throw and karate, but that's always and for every nation the case.
I like, though, that the medals are spread across many sports, honestly I don't need 15 medals in track cycling or shooting or even canooing.
So, Germany won medals in canooing, equestrians, tennis, wrestling, athletics, cycling, swimming, judo, rowing, sailing, gymnastics, table tennis, archery and diving.
It can be concluded, though, that there is still a tendency to win in sports that require expensive equipment (horses, bicycles, boats) and even more, that the medals are a result of very ambitious, talented individuals who are willing to put everything into their dream, not of good structures or any kind of program (I don't mean the clinic stuff, but some kind of organized effort and respect for sports/ athletes).
Since the structures won't change for the better I can't see Germany's results getting better in the future.
Well, the more disciplines there are, the more chances each country will have, including Germany.
 
Germany is disappointed with the outcome, of course, but it was to be expected, and then on top there was some "bad luck" involved in some cases which turned some planned gold medals into nothing, like in javelin throw and karate, but that's always and for every nation the case.
I like, though, that the medals are spread across many sports, honestly I don't need 15 medals in track cycling or shooting or even canooing.
So, Germany won medals in canooing, equestrians, tennis, wrestling, athletics, cycling, swimming, judo, rowing, sailing, gymnastics, table tennis, archery and diving.
It can be concluded, though, that there is still a tendency to win in sports that require expensive equipment (horses, bicycles, boats) and even more, that the medals are a result of very ambitious, talented individuals who are willing to put everything into their dream, not of good structures or any kind of program (I don't mean the clinic stuff, but some kind of organized effort and respect for sports/ athletes).
Since the structures won't change for the better I can't see Germany's results getting better in the future.
My first Olympic watching is Seoul 1988, how the young me thought the unified Germany would have 40 to 50 golds every time...
 
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I attempted to watch every sport during the olympics and here are my best and worst

Best:
Sport climbing - Sure the format sucked but it was entertaining, best of the new events.
Track Cycling - I usually only watch road and a bit of cross but was most entertained here by the track. The omnium in particular is great.
Modern Pentathlon - Aside from the dodgy animal abuse, it's a pretty unique event and the biathlon pursuit ending was great fun.
Archery - Surprisingly dramatic, the Turkish guy who won men's gold was brilliant to watch.
Taekwondo - My favourite of the combat events
Showjumping - Another one more enjoyable than I expected
Rugby 7s - Favourite team event
Athletics - The best because of the variety of events. Most other sports tend to be the same thing again and again.

Worst:
Weightlifting - Dull to watch, no skill or talent required beside strength, the medals are often decided before they even begin, clinic issues...
Synchronised swimming - Respect for the swimmers as it's clearly incredibly difficult but I find it so awkward to watch. Why do they pull those weird faces the whole time?
Surfing - Each match was 30 minutes of floating about in the sea to produce 10 seconds of highlights, represents the way sport is consumed today.
Karate - Really frustrating to watch, they stop every few seconds and it was never clear what exactly you need to do to win. Half the good hits got penalised for hitting 'too hard'. Not surprised this one is getting dropped.
'Routine' Events - Things like trampolining, dressage, bmx etc where a load of competitors do a routine in turn. It's fun watching the first couple but you end up watching the same thing again and again, and it's not always clear who's the best unless you're a technical expert.

All in all I enjoyed the games though and I'm glad it went ahead. Thanks Japan!
 
My first Olympic watching is Seoul 1988, how the young me thought the unified Germany would have 40 to 50 golds every time...
Clinic stuff clearly reduced... and the east-german structures which carried the unified Germany for a surprisingly long time are vanishing.
There are some good high performance centres, but the problem is clearly the lack of support for the youth, unless you are very clear about what you want early and go to a sports school (which only exist in certain places so if you aren't from that place you will have to move far), and then the lack of financial support for pretty much all athletes that are not in pro-sports like football or handball, with pro-contracts. Even if you are really, really good you only get some support that will hardly pay your rent. And if you are not among the very best in Germany yet, you often won't even get that. For the vast majority joining the police or military is pretty much the only option, I think in some other countries it's like that as well, but not everyone wants that, some don't want to have to deal with weapons and so on, some want to have another job/ education which is not fitting in, some don't want to covenant like that...

When my sister was a teenager she had lots of training camps due to which she missed a lot of school days, and it was always a bit of a fight with the school to get the free days for that, although her grades were still great. On the other hand in my brother's class there was a talented violinist and she never had any problems to get free days, people were proud of her... Well, my sister never intended a sporting career as an adult, but for those in her situation who want to, I think it's not made easy.
As long as you don't make money with it or win an Olympic medal, sports are looked on as a "hobby" that shouldn't be taken too seriously. While I kind of oppose "medal programs" which only exist to go high up in an Olympic medal count, I think those who are talented and actually love to persue their sport should get more support.
 
Germany is disappointed with the outcome, of course, but it was to be expected, and then on top there was some "bad luck" involved in some cases which turned some planned gold medals into nothing, like in javelin throw and karate, but that's always and for every nation the case.
I like, though, that the medals are spread across many sports, honestly I don't need 15 medals in track cycling or shooting or even canooing.
So, Germany won medals in canooing, equestrians, tennis, wrestling, athletics, cycling, swimming, judo, rowing, sailing, gymnastics, table tennis, archery and diving.
It can be concluded, though, that there is still a tendency to win in sports that require expensive equipment (horses, bicycles, boats) and even more, that the medals are a result of very ambitious, talented individuals who are willing to put everything into their dream, not of good structures or any kind of program (I don't mean the clinic stuff, but some kind of organized effort and respect for sports/ athletes).
Since the structures won't change for the better I can't see Germany's results getting better in the future.
Isn't this fairly typical, though? I mean, sports which require some kind of expensive equipment tend to favour wealthier countries and disproportionately favour the financially well-off within those countries too. It's perhaps no surprise that developing countries are more easily able to bridge the gap to the wealthier countries in the sports that don't require such significant financial investment from their participants than in things like sailing, cycling and equestrian as a result.

The other thing that needs bearing in mind when looking at these medal counts, also, is that you have to remember that many of the countries above Germany in the medal table don't see their Olympic sports funding needing to be split across summer and winter games quite so evenly - only really Russia and the US are direct competition in that respect, and they have the financial might to be ahead of Germany anyhow. Japan has some wintersport interest, but this tends to be in specific disciplines (ski jump, for example) as they are peripheral nations in many of the other events, plus they will have invested more heavily in this Games as the host. The Dutch - and I know it hurts to be behind the Dutch on the medal table (Germany had more total and the same number of golds, but the Dutch had an extra silver) - only have one sport they pay any heed to in the winter Olympiad, although like the track cycling being focused on by the British, it does have a high number of medals in a fairly shallow pool of competition. Across a combination of both Summer and Winter games (going by position rather than total medals, as there are far more available in the summer games), Germany rank 2nd across Pyeongchang+Tokyo, after the USA - although of course this is not the easiest of cycles to fairly judge the Russians on due to the politics and controversies surrounding eligibility of athletes especially at Pyeongchang.
 
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Isn't this fairly typical, though? I mean, sports which require some kind of expensive equipment tend to favour wealthier countries and disproportionately favour the financially well-off within those countries too. It's perhaps no surprise that developing countries are more easily able to bridge the gap to the wealthier countries in the sports that don't require such significant financial investment from their participants than in things like sailing, cycling and equestrian as a result.

The other thing that needs bearing in mind when looking at these medal counts, also, is that you have to remember that many of the countries above Germany in the medal table don't see their Olympic sports funding needing to be split across summer and winter games quite so evenly - only really Russia and the US are direct competition in that respect, and they have the financial might to be ahead of Germany anyhow. Japan has some wintersport interest, but this tends to be in specific disciplines (ski jump, for example) as they are peripheral nations in many of the other events, plus they will have invested more heavily in this Games as the host. The Dutch - and I know it hurts to be behind the Dutch on the medal table (Germany had more total and the same number of golds, but the Dutch had an extra silver) - only have one sport they pay any heed to in the winter Olympiad, although like the track cycling being focused on by the British, it does have a high number of medals in a fairly shallow pool of competition. Across a combination of both Summer and Winter games (going by position rather than total medals, as there are far more available in the summer games), Germany rank 2nd across Pyeongchang+Tokyo, after the USA - although of course this is not the easiest of cycles to fairly judge the Russians on due to the politics and controversies surrounding eligibility of athletes especially at Pyeongchang.
Winter sports are definitely very important here... I don't have any real insight, I just know that in the winter they get broadcasted practically 24/7 during the weekends, a treatment which otherwise only football gets. I think a lot of people enjoy watching the snow... And maybe it's because people in winter sports are often from more rural areas (in southern Germany), where there's not much else to do. :tearsofjoy:
Sorry, stereotypes... honestly I think most winter sports require expensive equipment, too - and of course the opportunity, so many countries don't have the chance to compete in those...
As I'm virtually half-Dutch I don't mind the Dutch being in front. ;)
But in the end it's also a question of inhabitants, Germany has 80 million people, they "should" be ahead of some countries like the Netherlands... also of Australia...
New-Zealand! How many inhabitants does New-Zealand have?? 5 million? Slovenia is also over-performing... ;)
Then, if we are going that route, of course India should be really up there...
Well, what I mean is, we clearly don't have structures like many anglophone-countries, with sports and school so closely connected. Usually you go to school until 1 or 2 or 3 pm, and then you can persue your hobbies, so whether you get involved in any sport is totally up to you - and your parents. It's a very private and individual decision. Sometimes there are certain clubs at school, but those are just spread here and there and usually happen on quite a low level, for fun, without any competitions. School teams and such are rather rare. So if the country says they want some elite in sports that is able to compete on a level with the best world wide, they have to support the individuals that think about going that way, but instead they are rather discouraged. I think the general sentiment here, though, is that that is not worth the money and even the support that wouldn't cost much or even nothing, isn't really there.
Well, it's a decision that society makes, but then nobody should complain about a lack of medals.

What is it like in Spain?
 
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In analyzing relations of the sports, state, economy, standard, etc., examples of the countries going through (political0 transition should be the most valid.
A deeper and more credible analysis can be obtained using the data mostly out of reach to an average fan, but examples of Bulgaria, Romania, Hungary... offer an interesting overview of the topic.
Even the basic statistics (medals) encompassing "before" and "after" periods lead to some conclusions.
Then, the structure of success can be looked at (disciplines, requirements for development, for example, and so on...).
 
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Isn't this fairly typical, though? I mean, sports which require some kind of expensive equipment tend to favour wealthier countries and disproportionately favour the financially well-off within those countries too. It's perhaps no surprise that developing countries are more easily able to bridge the gap to the wealthier countries in the sports that don't require such significant financial investment from their participants than in things like sailing, cycling and equestrian as a result.
This is also true of other sports where participation at youth levels is 'pay to play'. In the US, swimming is one such sport and the people you are seeing in the Olympics are often from wealthy families that can tote their kids to far flung meets and early morning practices and enter them into the prestigious swim clubs. Of course, swimming is available to all in various degrees, but the path to the Olympics is much narrower. Phelps might be claimed by Baltimore, but he is from Fells Point.
 
Winter sports are definitely very important here... I don't have any real insight, I just know that in the winter they get broadcasted practically 24/7 during the weekends, a treatment which otherwise only football gets. I think a lot of people enjoy watching the snow... And maybe it's because people in winter sports are often from more rural areas (in southern Germany), where there's not much else to do. :tearsofjoy:
Sorry, stereotypes... honestly I think most winter sports require expensive equipment, too - and of course the opportunity, so many countries don't have the chance to compete in those...
As I'm virtually half-Dutch I don't mind the Dutch being in front. ;)
But in the end it's also a question of inhabitants, Germany has 80 million people, they "should" be ahead of some countries like the Netherlands... also of Australia...
New-Zealand! How many inhabitants does New-Zealand have?? 5 million? Slovenia is also over-performing... ;)
Then, if we are going that route, of course India should be really up there...
Well, what I mean is, we clearly don't have structures like many anglophone-countries, with sports and school so closely connected. Usually you go to school until 1 or 2 or 3 pm, and then you can persue your hobbies, so whether you get involved in any sport is totally up to you - and your parents. It's a very private and individual decision. Sometimes there are certain clubs at school, but those are just spread here and there and usually happen on quite a low level, for fun, without any competitions. School teams and such are rather rare. So if the country says they want some elite in sports that is able to compete on a level with the best world wide, they have to support the individuals that think about going that way, but instead they are rather discouraged. I think the general sentiment here, though, is that that is not worth the money and even the support that wouldn't cost much or even nothing, isn't really there.
Well, it's a decision that society makes, but then nobody should complain about a lack of medals.

What is it like in Spain?
Well, having lived in Germany on two separate occasions, I saw where a lot of the money is going towards, especially the more recent time I was there. If that continues, there may be problems and upheaval.
 
In analyzing relations of the sports, state, economy, standard, etc., examples of the countries going through (political0 transition should be the most valid.
A deeper and more credible analysis can be obtained using the data mostly out of reach to an average fan, but examples of Bulgaria, Romania, Hungary... offer an interesting overview of the topic.
Even the basic statistics (medals) encompassing "before" and "after" periods lead to some conclusions.
Then, the structure of success can be looked at (disciplines, requirements for development, for example, and so on...).
Compared to other pre-1990 Eastern Bloc states, the basic statistic show Hungary to be less impacted by the change. I know the difference in the spread of medal potentials - compared to, say, Romania and Bulgaria - is one thing, but is there any explanation?
(wife is half-Hungarian but she neither knows a lot about her half part or sports:( )
 
Compared to other pre-1990 Eastern Bloc states, the basic statistic show Hungary to be less impacted by the change. I know the difference in the spread of medal potentials - compared to, say, Romania and Bulgaria - is one thing, but is there any explanation?
(wife is half-Hungarian but she neither knows a lot about her half part or sports:( )
I think Hungary went through the transition the least affected... the economic indicators should confirm that.
Hence, their ability to support sports, invest and create turnover through it kept the high quality of performance.
And, probably, the affirmation through sports means to their officials more than to others mentioned.
 
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