Teams & Riders Peter Sagan discussion thread.

[SafeBet]

Sure, in 2010 Basso won the Giro and Nibali the Vuelta. But Sagan was only 19 at the time. He became a star at 22. In 2013 and 2014, the Liquigas weren't even in the top 15, despite having (one of) the best cyclists.

Define star.
Sagan won 36 races between 2010 and 2012. And half of them were WT races.
He wasn't winning Classics yet, but he was already a very big name in cycling.

 

[Aimar16]

Define star.
Sagan won 36 races between 2010 and 2012. And half of them were WT races.
He wasn't winning Classics yet, but he was already a very big name in cycling.

Idk. The previous poster mentioned this: "to become a star which doesn't only take into account wins/results but also personality and visibility"

For me, Sagan became a star in two months in 2012, when he won 5 stages (4 in a row) in California, dominated the points classification in the Tour de Suisse and the TdF with impressive multiple stage wins.

Back to the original topic, for me Remco is nowhere near that level. He is nowhere near Sagan in terms of results. He may be a star in Belgium, but where I live he is not. So I would not call him a global name in cycling.

 

[tobydawq]

Idk. The previous poster mentioned this: "to become a star which doesn't only take into account wins/results but also personality and visibility"

For me, Sagan became a star in two months in 2012, when he won 5 stages (4 in a row) in California, dominated the points classification in the Tour de Suisse and the TdF with impressive multiple stage wins.

Back to the original topic, for me Remco is nowhere near that level. He is nowhere near Sagan in terms of results. He may be a star in Belgium, but where I live he is not. So I would not call him a global name in cycling.

Remco was the main draw for the Tour of Denmark last year. A race where he beat a former Danish world champion. So yeah, he's a star allright.

 

[Ilmaestro99]

Sagan won 2 Paris Nice stages age 20. He was already a star then.

 

[Aimar16]

Remco was the main draw for the Tour of Denmark last year. A race where he beat a former Danish world champion. So yeah, he's a star allright.

The star of the randomly selected 2.Pro races.

 

[Bolder]

Sagan won 2 Paris Nice stages age 20. He was already a star then.

Sagan was so good, so young. We tend to forget that, I think. He's lucky he wasn't Belgian.

 

[tobydawq]

The star of the randomly selected 2.Pro races.

Yeah, well, still a big star. Whether or not he grinds you the correct way.

 

[Zoef-Lightning]

Very strange that some would like to compare Sagan's physique with the physique of other riders (sprinters). No sense at all. The only thing you have to do is compare his actual physique (and of the last three or four years) with the physique of Sagan 5 or more years ago. Then there is no doubt. He clearly weighs a lot heavier. Insiders have known for a long time that Sagan no longer lives like a pro. During winter, alcohol abuse etc. Even during the season he does not approach the ideal weight anymore. He has been earning 5 million a year for years now, without any performance in return. The people in charge of Total Energies were very stupid to offer him (and his entouraga) another hallucinatory contract.

 

[Ilmaestro99]

Very strange that some would like to compare Sagan's physique with the physique of other riders (sprinters). No sense at all. The only thing you have to do is compare his actual physique (and of the last three or four years) with the physique of Sagan 5 or more years ago. Then there is no doubt. He clearly weighs a lot heavier. Insiders have known for a long time that Sagan no longer lives like a pro. During winter, alcohol abuse etc. Even during the season he does not approach the ideal weight anymore. He has been earning 5 million a year for years now, without any performance in return. The people in charge of Total Energies were very stupid to offer him (and his entouraga) another hallucinatory contract.

I'm a sagan fan but I kind of get this impression as well

 

[ij74]

Remco was the main draw for the Tour of Denmark last year. A race where he beat a former Danish world champion. So yeah, he's a star allright.

Please, tell me you don´t mean this seriously

 

[Blanco]

English is the primary language of international communication. It plays quite an important role in marketing and business, which has been the subject of the last few posts.

Sagan is a cyclist, not businessman, and the best marketing for him were his wins and spectacular way of racing. No English could've helped as the pedals did.

 

[tobydawq]

Please, tell me you don´t mean this seriously

?

 

[Keram]

Speaking of Sagan physique. Yes he was lean in 2013 where he was great on hills and especially in 2014 but his sprinting suffered. Then he was heavier again. When he won Roubaix he was bulky. He is declining since his 2018 tour fall. He is not same since then. He is declining steadily though. In 2019 he was able to won green jersey but he was visibly weaker at classics due to illnes in prep. 2020 he was even weaker despite that great stage win at Giro. 2021 season he had covid and again ruined prep but despite wining stage at Giro and ciclamino ( very defensive style at his standard) his season was subpar on his standard. He is declining in 2022 again and yet it is his worst season. I dont know if it is lack of training, illness or post covid but he is sad to see this year

 

[Zoef-Lightning]

Speaking of Sagan physique. Yes he was lean in 2013 where he was great on hills and especially in 2014 but his sprinting suffered. Then he was heavier again. When he won Roubaix he was bulky. He is declining since his 2018 tour fall. He is not same since then. He is declining steadily though. In 2019 he was able to won green jersey but he was visibly weaker at classics due to illnes in prep. 2020 he was even weaker despite that great stage win at Giro. 2021 season he had covid and again ruined prep but despite wining stage at Giro and ciclamino ( very defensive style at his standard) his season was subpar on his standard. He is declining in 2022 again and yet it is his worst season. I dont know if it is lack of training, illness or post covid but he is sad to see this year

What would you do when you get 5.5 million euros a year, during years, without having to perform anything for it ? Exactly. Do what Sagan is doing. In this case it is not Sagan who is to blame, but the moneylenders and cycling teams. Say Bora hansgrohe and this year (and the next years ?) Total Energie.

 

[tobydawq]

What would you do when you get 5.5 million euros a year, during years, without having to perform anything for it ? Exactly. Do what Sagan is doing. In this case it is not Sagan who is to blame, but the moneylenders and cycling teams. Say Bora hansgrohe and this year (and the next years ?) Total Energie.

Then why is Pogacar not doing the same thing?

 

[Bolder]

Then why is Pogacar not doing the same thing?

Let's see what level Pogacar is at when he's 32.

As we age, life gets complicated. It's harder to stay in shape, harder to find time to train when you've got a family to support etc. And cycling is a particularly unforgiving sport w/r/t training.

 

[tobydawq]

harder to find time to train when you've got a family to support etc.

Uh, sure, if you're not doing it as your job...

 

[Bolder]

Uh, sure, if you're not doing it as your job...

It's easier to live like a monk or work overtime if you're single or don't have children, an entourage of hangers-on etc. Things happen, life gets complicated as I said. Of course sometimes we inflict those complications on ourselves...

 

[stonerider]

If you are paid 5.5 million euros per year, you can have a fulltime cook, cleaning person, personal shopper, nanny, etc. You probably need to set aside 6 to 7 hours per day on average for training/recovery so you have the rest of your day to spend time with your child in a relaxed manner. All that is lacking for Sagan is the motivation to do the work.

 

[dercuforever]

If you are paid 5.5 million euros per year, you can have a fulltime cook, cleaning person, personal shopper, nanny, etc. You probably need to set aside 6 to 7 hours per day on average for training/recovery so you have the rest of your day to spend time with your child in a relaxed manner. All that is lacking for Sagan is the motivation to do the work.

100% True. Time is not at all an issue. A "normal job" takes 10-12h per day, considering the driving to work and the lunch time which is wasted. If you have nothing to do at home (due to being rich), then you probably have more than 5 hours to spend with your family, making you are luckier that most of us. I fail to see how procycling can prevent this in off season / training time.
He probably lacks motivation, or maybe the body does not respond as great as when he was young. Which is sad, as I enjoyed a lot watching Sagan ride.

 

[Eddy Evenepoel]

The people in charge of Total Energies were very stupid to offer him (and his entouraga) another hallucinatory contract.

To be fair, I think signing Sagan and his entourage + getting Specialized on board overall was a decent trade for Total.

• Yes, Sagan has been a big disappointment so far, but I think he still has it in him to win one or two WT wins if he can get going for a while without some new problems.
• Oss and Bodnar has been decent additions to the team, so even if Sagan been bad his entourage has been decent (I don’t count Juraj lol).
• the whole team have generally performed well this season, I think a better bike is one of the reasons.
• Having Sagan in the team have probably been a nice way of putting less pressure on Turgis in the early season.
• Having Sagan in the team gives the team more attention, even when he doesn’t perform.

 

[Devil's Elbow]

DNF in the Sarthe today, that's the first half of his season written off if it wasn't already.

 

[DoYouEvenRideBruh]

DNF in the Sarthe today, that's the first half of his season written off if it wasn't already.

More health problems?

 

[Oldermanish]

Speaking of Sagan physique. Yes he was lean in 2013 where he was great on hills and especially in 2014 but his sprinting suffered. Then he was heavier again. When he won Roubaix he was bulky. He is declining since his 2018 tour fall. He is not same since then. He is declining steadily though. In 2019 he was able to won green jersey but he was visibly weaker at classics due to illnes in prep. 2020 he was even weaker despite that great stage win at Giro. 2021 season he had covid and again ruined prep but despite wining stage at Giro and ciclamino ( very defensive style at his standard) his season was subpar on his standard. He is declining in 2022 again and yet it is his worst season. I dont know if it is lack of training, illness or post covid but he is sad to see this year

Getting Covid twice in a year suggests he is not recovered from that exposure. His off-season behavior certainly doesn't help that situation and he needs to get squared away or he is done.

 

[PeterB]

“Just like one month ago, he just felt bad with unusual pain in his legs and his chest," his media officer Giuseppe Uboldi told Cyclingnews.

Sounds like Sagan finding out about the thing called fatigue for the first time in his life..??