Teams & Riders Peter Sagan discussion thread.

[Punkan]

Re:

if hushovd managed to survive at the steepest part of mur de bretagne in 2011 sagan is easily capable to do the same and even more, i personally expect a win from him there

What Hushovd did that day was exceptional, especially when you consider how many strong riders that didn't make the front group. Not sure we count on Sagan being up there if the steep part on the climb is raced hard. But I think there is a possibility of Sagan coming back on the flatter section before the finish.

 

[Ludwig's Olaf]

Re:

Already asked this, Zabel leads with 22. But Sagan has a great chance to get there and claim that dubious record.

Mention of Contador's GC victories should be just deleted or contained in the Contador thread.

I'm afraid Sagan will be forgotten the moment he retires, just like Zabel. What stays is memory are Grand Tour winners, and that's why Sagan will play second fiddle to AC as long as they're in one team. Like he did before to Nibali at Liquigas.

 

[Squirbos_19]

Just had a look at the Vuelta route and there's a few stages that suit him there. Perhaps he'll ride it and get proper team support because Contador won't be there.

 

[Mr.White]

Re: Re:

Already asked this, Zabel leads with 22. But Sagan has a great chance to get there and claim that dubious record.

Mention of Contador's GC victories should be just deleted or contained in the Contador thread.

I'm afraid Sagan will be forgotten the moment he retires, just like Zabel. What stays is memory are Grand Tour winners, and that's why Sagan will play second fiddle to AC as long as they're in one team. Like he did before to Nibali at Liquigas.

Zabel isn't forgotten, nor will be Sagan, you're wrong on that. In fact Zabel is far more remembered than many of the GT winners, and a far better rider

 

[qwerty16]

Re:

Just had a look at the Vuelta route and there's a few stages that suit him there. Perhaps he'll ride it and get proper team support because Contador won't be there.

Don't worry, they will have 7 men who will all support Majka then. What a horrible team he finds himself in. Compare that with Rodriguez bridging back to the group and leading out Kristoff.

On the other hand, he knew this was coming when he joined the team.

 

[mrhender]

Re: Re:

Just had a look at the Vuelta route and there's a few stages that suit him there. Perhaps he'll ride it and get proper team support because Contador won't be there.

Don't worry, they will have 7 men who will all support Majka then. What a horrible team he finds himself in. Compare that with Rodriguez bridging back to the group and leading out Kristoff.

On the other hand, he knew this was coming when he joined the team.

I don't think either parties planned on him being just a dom getting his chance here and then...

Quite sure the aim was making him a dominant classic rider a lá Cancellara...

Had Sagan won Paris Roubaix or Flandern this would not have been an issue...

 

[Electress]

Well, I'm just glad to see Sagan so much cheerier. If he's not indignant about his 'treatment' then I'm not going to mind on his behalf.

 

[Vasilis]

Re: Re:

if hushovd managed to survive at the steepest part of mur de bretagne in 2011 sagan is easily capable to do the same and even more, i personally expect a win from him there

What Hushovd did that day was exceptional, especially when you consider how many strong riders that didn't make the front group. Not sure we count on Sagan being up there if the steep part on the climb is raced hard. But I think there is a possibility of Sagan coming back on the flatter section before the finish.

No doubt Sagan will finish second.

 

[Ludwig's Olaf]

Is he? I checked 'Zabel' with the search function, and he is rarely mentioned in this prolific forum. Maybe half of the few hits are about Rick. Anyway, it's about Sagan. A guy with brute force second to none, but something is lacking. Tactical awareness? Hence the endless string of 2nd places? Oleg's hair must have turned from pink to gray by now. When this year is done someone will probably ask, what was the most memorable ride of the year? Many will suggest the one of the rider who must not be named in this thread despite being in the same team as leader ploughing through the peloton from behind on the Motirolo. 2nd places? Who cares?

 

[SeriousSam]

Tour stages are nice and all but if that is the only claim to fame, there is a limit to how remembered you can be. I think Cav will be remembered for some time, despite his victories being extremely boring, repetitive and formulaic, because he amassed a great many of them.

But he will not be remembered like Cancellara or Boonen because they won much more important races, and in style. The road to lasting fame for non GC riders goes through monuments, not Tour stages.

 

[damian13ster]

I don't think its lack of tactical awareness. He is on business end in pretty much every race, won or came close to winning from breakaways before. He just needs one super-domestique that will lead him out and close the gaps at the end of the races.
Tinkoff doesn't provide that, and it will bite the team in the ass because if nothing changes then the only thing they will come out with out of this Tour is the green jersey.

 

[mrhender]

Re:

Tour stages are nice and all but if that is the only claim to fame, there is a limit to how remembered you can be. I think Cav will be remembered for some time, despite his victories being extremely boring, repetitive and formulaic, because he amassed a great many of them.

But he will not be remembered like Cancellara or Boonen because they won much more important races, and in style. The road to lasting fame for non GC riders goes through monuments, not Tour stages.

This..

All though I think there is still time and ability for Sagan to become a big shot....

 

[skidmark]

Re:

Is he? I checked 'Zabel' with the search function, and he is rarely mentioned in this prolific forum. Maybe half of the few hits are about Rick.

Zabel retired before this forum existed. There is not much evidence you can get to compare them by using this forum, to either give evidence for or against your point. Otherwise one could make the counterpoint that GT riders aren't as remembered because there is more about Sagan on this forum than, say, Jacques Anquetil. Or, to maybe use a more comparable example to Zabel, Jan Ullrich.

Regardless of that comparison, I agree with the comment that Sagan has plenty of time to add to his memorable wins. If he wins the Worlds this fall, for example (or any of the next ten years, which is entirely imaginable), that completely changes the conversation.

 

[IndianCyclist]

Sagan will be the Poulidor of sprinting it seems

 

[virenque216]

I don't think going to Oleg's team was a good option for Sagan, he seemed to be at his best when riding with Nibali a few years back, just imagine him on the cobbles if he would be riding with Astana, one two with Vincenzo, they are also very good friends and Sagan rides better when he is relaxed, he knows for sure that he is expected to win stages like yesterday and he seems more nervous all round, Saxo do not have riders who could help him neither in spring or in Tour obviously they want the yellow jersey in Paris, he also can not ride away alone anymore like he could in 2011-2013, though it is amazing how everybody else is riding against him when he is the favourite

 

[Bushman]

It seems people are forgetting that the Tour isn't his main goal this year. Since the beginning the plan was to aim for the classics and then go to the Tour as luxury helper/free role but not as leader. I think he seems to enjoy riding at the moment, helping Contador when needed (and getting recognition for what he does as a helper) and riding to win stages. Of course he would have liked a win by now, but he really seems to enjoy himself atm which is the most important thing.

 

[cineteq]

Re:

Sagan will be the Poulidor of sprinting it seems

Do you know what a pure sprinter is? Sagan is NOT. Meaning he's beating pure sprinters to get 2nd places. I hope this clarifies your confusion.

 

[Psalmon]

Sagan's road to Green AND Yellow AND White on the rest day in Pau:

- First get up the MdB and finish in the top 8 (assumes Greipel does not get up and minimal changes at the intermediate)
- Second Tinkoff has to beat BMC and take 12 seconds out of Sky in the TTT (not accounting for any time bonuses on MdB which could go to Froome or Sagen)

The second is a stretch vis a vis BMC, but the guy could be Dominating the Tour jerseys thru 9 if they pulled that off.

 

[elfed68]

Re: Re:

Sagan will be the Poulidor of sprinting it seems

Do you know what a pure sprinter is? Sagan is NOT. Meaning he's beating pure sprinters to get 2nd places. I hope this clarifies your confusion.

It seems to me that Sagan is a ridiculous talent who can do almost anything nearly as good as the specialists, surely if he decided to become a pure sprinter he'd be unbeatable as the speed he's showing in these sprint finishes are so impressive!

I'd love to see him take the Yellow Jersey and I'm sure the GC guys wouldn't mind either.

Is it time to decide which speciality to focus on?

 

[BigMac]

Re:

Just had a look at the Vuelta route and there's a few stages that suit him there. Perhaps he'll ride it and get proper team support because Contador won't be there.

I hope not. I hope he does Québec and Montréal, both races missed him last year.

 

[ad9898]

Sagan in yellow tomorrow as I predicted a few days ago, TS just need 12 seconds over Sky, lets hope so as he fully deserves it after this first week.

 

[Lance Armstrong]

Re:

Sagan in yellow tomorrow as I predicted a few days ago, TS just need 12 seconds over Sky, lets hope so as he fully deserves it after this first week.

Not with Van Garderen just 2 seconds behind Sagan.

 

[SeriousSam]

Decent ride today, but he needs to go for it a bit more. You can't always expect others to lead you out, Peter, sometimes you have to chase!

 

[Z3lvet]

Re:

Decent ride today, but he needs to go for it a bit more. You can't always expect others to lead you out, Peter, sometimes you have to chase!

He was spent after Froome´s attack.

 

[roundabout]

It's good that he finally had Kreuziger in support to do exactly nothing.