Teams & Riders Peter Sagan discussion thread.

[KGB]

Very good and unusual open sprint from Sagan.Happy to see he smoked Demare and Viviani in sprint.After Friday he was overatted and now he is in decent form again as CN forum experts said.
The race was very boring but CN forum experts save with comments day once again.

 

[Bardamu]

This victory will give him some reassurance for next week. Pretty sure he will be one of the strongest riders next week.

 

[Salvarani]

I think he rode smart today. Positioned himself well and made the group with the favorites. Took turns to distance the group behind. Then could save energy for the sprint in the last 10km. Made a smart move when Viviani was trapped and quite easily won the sprint in the end.

Hopefully this will give some confidence back after E3 and he could be in good shape next Sunday.

 

[SKSemtex]

Re:

Very good and unusual open sprint from Sagan.Happy to see he smoked Demare and Viviani in sprint.After Friday he was overatted and now he is in decent form again as CN forum experts said.
The race was very boring but CN forum experts save with comments day once again.

Lol. Yes. CN forum ones again saved the race. It's so much more fun to have race on one screen and CN forum on other.

Rule no.1: When he lose he is a tactical idiot
Rule no. 2.: When he wins, it is never deserved win
Rule no. 3. Whatever he say after the lost race is whinning
Rule no. 4. Whatever he say after the won race is arrogant.
Rule no. 3.

 

[tomorrow]

He should ride DDV on Wednesday, he clearly has too little race days. Also, he could try to break the quickstep machine, they're definitely try to destroy the race like last year.

 

[MichalJ]

Yeah, I can imagine him riding DDV and trying some long range attack just to properly strech his legs. But I think he will skip it like it was planned.

 

[tomorrow]

Re:

Yeah, I can imagine him riding DDV and trying some long range attack just to properly strech his legs. But I think he will skip it like it was planned.

Well, I just looked at steephill and bora has still one rider undecided there. So Bora may have been playing with that idea too.

 

[repre]

Re: Re:

Very good and unusual open sprint from Sagan.Happy to see he smoked Demare and Viviani in sprint.After Friday he was overatted and now he is in decent form again as CN forum experts said.
The race was very boring but CN forum experts save with comments day once again.

Lol. Yes. CN forum ones again saved the race. It's so much more fun to have race on one screen and CN forum on other.

Rule no.1: When he lose he is a tactical idiot
Rule no. 2.: When he wins, it is never deserved win
Rule no. 3. Whatever he say after the lost race is whinning
Rule no. 4. Whatever he say after the won race is arrogant.
Rule no. 3.

Haha, so true. Not too much people, who really appreciate greatness of Sagan.

 

[Parker]

Re: Re:

Very good and unusual open sprint from Sagan.Happy to see he smoked Demare and Viviani in sprint.After Friday he was overatted and now he is in decent form again as CN forum experts said.
The race was very boring but CN forum experts save with comments day once again.

Lol. Yes. CN forum ones again saved the race. It's so much more fun to have race on one screen and CN forum on other.

Rule no.1: When he lose he is a tactical idiot
Rule no. 2.: When he wins, it is never deserved win
Rule no. 3. Whatever he say after the lost race is whinning
Rule no. 4. Whatever he say after the won race is arrogant.
Rule no. 3.

But then there's Sagan's own rules:

Rule 1: If I win I am the best
Rule 2: If I don't win I am the most entertaining which is most important
Rule 3: Even if I have done nothing in the race, my presence is entertaining.

 

[Tonton]

BIG WIN!!!

When other riders don't ride against him, he wins. Best rider of his generation...just wish that his fans were as gracious in defeat as they are when in victory.

 

[loge1884]

BIG WIN!!!

When other riders don't ride against him, he wins. Best rider of his generation...just wish that his fans were as gracious in defeat as they are when in victory.

not sure whom you are heading at by "his fans" .... I admit being one of them (of all riders I've seen, starting from the times of Bernard Hinault and Francesco Moser, he's the one I believe is the most fun to watch) and of course there are races when I would have thought, Peter would have been the more deserved winner (in those mostly he came in second) - but then again, this is cycling and besides strong legs, good tactics, a good team you also need a bit of luck (and one can't say he was NEVER lucky: e.g. the finale in Doha could have ended him in hospital as well as him winning the race) ....

 

[Jagartrott]

When other riders don't ride against him, he wins.

I don't really like these 'Calimero' arguments. It's just not true. They didn't ride 'against' him in Strade, E3 or MSR the past weeks, for instance, he just was not good enough (Strade, E3) or made a wrong decision (MSR). Please stay nuanced. All this hyperbole tends to derail proper discussion.

 

[Lexman]

I'm not convinced for RVV, GW was ridden more "easily" and in better weather conditions than E3.

Sunday it will rain, if it will be raced as hard as E3 I'm not sure if Sagan will have the legs, it just seems he doesn't have the legs because he rode very few races...

glad to hear your opinion(s)

 

[loge1884]

there are quite few contenders for RvV and Peter is definitely one of them ...
whether he has "the legs", only Peter himself will know ... however GW was a prove of his increased smartness and (finally) a good team display (which will perhaps be more important in P-R) ... Marcus Burghardt on his side is a great value, he seemed to have calmed down and focussed Peter a few km before the finish line (in GW)

 

[Valv.Piti]

Re:

there are quite few contenders for RvV and Peter is definitely one of them ...
whether he has "the legs", only Peter himself will know ... however GW was a prove of his increased smartness and (finally) a good team display (which will perhaps be more important in P-R) ... Marcus Burghardt on his side is a great value, he seemed to have calmed down and focussed Peter a few km before the finish line (in GW)

Yeah, the Belgians are frightening with Sep, Greg, Phil, Naesen, Tiesj and honestly even WVA who I won't rule out. Then you have the two Steppers Stybar and Terpstra as well, especially the latter could easily slip away and solo. And then there's Kwiatkowski who is a legit winner as well despite him not really focusing on these races anymore.

Sagan will really have to earn this race.

 

[SKSemtex]

Re: Re:

there are quite few contenders for RvV and Peter is definitely one of them ...
whether he has "the legs", only Peter himself will know ... however GW was a prove of his increased smartness and (finally) a good team display (which will perhaps be more important in P-R) ... Marcus Burghardt on his side is a great value, he seemed to have calmed down and focussed Peter a few km before the finish line (in GW)

Yeah, the Belgians are frightening with Sep, Greg, Phil, Naesen, Tiesj and honestly even WVA who I won't rule out. Then you have the two Steppers Stybar and Terpstra as well, especially the latter could easily slip away and solo. And then there's Kwiatkowski who is a legit winner as well despite him not really focusing on these races anymore.

Sagan will really have to earn this race.

RVV is never for free.

This edition is going to be epic. We have really 5-6 names with big chance to win. I have been watching cycling only from 2011 but it was always about two names.

Of course, I want Peter to win but I would be even pretty happy if Vanmarcke will take it. He was so much better than the competition on Muur. Unfortunately, his chances to finish solo after Paterberg are very slim and in reduced sprint almost zero. He would need the finish is on the top of Paterberg. :lol:

Peter looked to be under par so far, but one thing is sure his form is growing and in PR he will be very hard to beat. RVV I am not sure. Unfortunately for him, the weather will play against him this time in RVV.

 

[Red Rick]

I don't understand why Kwiatkowski keeps being mentioned when he was equally unimpressive in Sanremo, hasn't prepared for Vlaanderen specifically and has a very old habit of exploding on the Oude Kwaremont.

 

[tomorrow]

Re: Re:

there are quite few contenders for RvV and Peter is definitely one of them ...
whether he has "the legs", only Peter himself will know ... however GW was a prove of his increased smartness and (finally) a good team display (which will perhaps be more important in P-R) ... Marcus Burghardt on his side is a great value, he seemed to have calmed down and focussed Peter a few km before the finish line (in GW)

Yeah, the Belgians are frightening with Sep, Greg, Phil, Naesen, Tiesj and honestly even WVA who I won't rule out. Then you have the two Steppers Stybar and Terpstra as well, especially the latter could easily slip away and solo. And then there's Kwiatkowski who is a legit winner as well despite him not really focusing on these races anymore.

Well, its very difficult to say if bad weather will have good or bad impact on sagan. In the past, he had both exceptional poerformances in bad weather an sometimes it is quite he opposite, like in the e3. By the way the increased toughness might also cause the race to be ridden conservatively, which would suit him, because he wouldn't have to start chasing soon. Ideal scenario for him is, when the action starts on last kwaaremont or a little bit sooner.

Very important will also by the work of burghardt and oss. They can't allow breaks on kapelmuur. Or if so, one of them has to be in that break and also able to react to gilbert-like attacks. If they cover quicksteppers on kapelmuur, then the power of quickstep declines, because with more helingens, lampaert and other lesser riders will not be able to stay with terpstra, stybar ..., which would decrease the number of quickstep riders inethe pottential break.

Sagan will really have to earn this race.

RVV is never for free.

This edition is going to be epic. We have really 5-6 names with big chance to win. I have been watching cycling only from 2011 but it was always about two names.

Of course, I want Peter to win but I would be even pretty happy if Vanmarcke will take it. He was so much better than the competition on Muur. Unfortunately, his chances to finish solo after Paterberg are very slim and in reduced sprint almost zero. He would need the finish is on the top of Paterberg. :lol:

Peter looked to be under par so far, but one thing is sure his form is growing and in PR he will be very hard to beat. RVV I am not sure. Unfortunately for him, the weather will play against him this time in RVV.

 

[tomorrow]

Re: Re:

there are quite few contenders for RvV and Peter is definitely one of them ...
whether he has "the legs", only Peter himself will know ... however GW was a prove of his increased smartness and (finally) a good team display (which will perhaps be more important in P-R) ... Marcus Burghardt on his side is a great value, he seemed to have calmed down and focussed Peter a few km before the finish line (in GW)

Yeah, the Belgians are frightening with Sep, Greg, Phil, Naesen, Tiesj and honestly even WVA who I won't rule out. Then you have the two Steppers Stybar and Terpstra as well, especially the latter could easily slip away and solo. And then there's Kwiatkowski who is a legit winner as well despite him not really focusing on these races anymore.

Sagan will really have to earn this race.

RVV is never for free.

This edition is going to be epic. We have really 5-6 names with big chance to win. I have been watching cycling only from 2011 but it was always about two names.

Of course, I want Peter to win but I would be even pretty happy if Vanmarcke will take it. He was so much better than the competition on Muur. Unfortunately, his chances to finish solo after Paterberg are very slim and in reduced sprint almost zero. He would need the finish is on the top of Paterberg. :lol:

Peter looked to be under par so far, but one thing is sure his form is growing and in PR he will be very hard to beat. RVV I am not sure. Unfortunately for him, the weather will play against him this time in RVV.

Well, its very difficult to say if bad weather will have good or bad impact on sagan. In the past, he had both exceptional poerformances in bad weather an sometimes it is quite he opposite, like in the e3. By the way the increased toughness might also cause the race to be ridden conservatively, which would suit him, because he wouldn't have to start chasing soon. Ideal scenario for him is, when the action starts on last kwaaremont or a little bit sooner.

Very important will also by the work of burghardt and oss. They can't allow breaks on kapelmuur. Or if so, one of them has to be in that break and also able to react to gilbert-like attacks. If they cover quicksteppers on kapelmuur, then the power of quickstep declines, because with more helingens, lampaert and other lesser riders will not be able to stay with terpstra, stybar ..., which would decrease the number of quickstep riders inethe pottential break.

 

[sprints n stones]

Re:

there are quite few contenders for RvV and Peter is definitely one of them ...
whether he has "the legs", only Peter himself will know ... however GW was a prove of his increased smartness and (finally) a good team display (which will perhaps be more important in P-R) ... Marcus Burghardt on his side is a great value, he seemed to have calmed down and focussed Peter a few km before the finish line (in GW)

Think your last point about Burghardt was what was needed in many of Sagan's " disappointing" results. However good his legs were without that arm round the shoulder and the words in his ear, I don't think he would have taken the victory. Don't know if it was reported anywhere what he said but can only guess it was on the lines of " don't get mad at them, get even by waiting and using your strength where it counts". My commentary suggested they were discussing tactics but judging by what had just happened before and the arm round the shoulder I'd guess it was more reassuring than just that.

 

[loge1884]

@ sprint n stones

I've seen an interview with Marcus Burghardt (in german) where he was asked what the discussion was about ... Marcus was saying, he thought Peter was a bit too tense and doing too much, so he told him to relax, if anything he (Marcus) would take care of it ...

even though Peter is not the guy who needs to be lead out in a "rikscha" by his team, he is not a "loner" - and this is a proof, that a good and experienced teammate can be of immense psychological value ....

If I were Peter I'd buy Marcus a bottle of good vintage champagne ....

 

[sprints n stones]

Re:

@ sprint n stones

I've seen an interview with Marcus Burghardt (in german) where he was asked what the discussion was about ... Marcus was saying, he thought Peter was a bit too tense and doing too much, so he told him to relax, if anything he (Marcus) would take care of it ...

even though Peter is not the guy who needs to be lead out in a "rikscha" by his team, he is not a "loner" - and this is a proof, that a good and experienced teammate can be of immense psychological value ....

If I were Peter I'd buy Marcus a bottle of good vintage champagne ....

If not a crate!
Thanks for the info. I tried looking on Burghardt's Twitter but the words weren't mentioned there. A clip was posted of it calling it " the new bromance" .He's obviously a teammate who knows the right support to give whether physical or psychological. Interesting to see if anything similar happens again it was good it was caught on camera.

 

[tomorrow]

Re:

@ sprint n stones

I've seen an interview with Marcus Burghardt (in german) where he was asked what the discussion was about ... Marcus was saying, he thought Peter was a bit too tense and doing too much, so he told him to relax, if anything he (Marcus) would take care of it ...

even though Peter is not the guy who needs to be lead out in a "rikscha" by his team, he is not a "loner" - and this is a proof, that a good and experienced teammate can be of immense psychological value ....

If I were Peter I'd buy Marcus a bottle of good vintage champagne ....

well, it's known that Sagan appeciates his teammates, and not only with words in the interiew. I have read multiple times he renounced his share of the prize money earned during TdF in favour of his teammates, he attempted to give some wins to Bodnar, Gatto, although that didn't work in the end. Actually, I think he managed to give somebody the win but I just can't remember to whom and when.

 

[Netserk]

Re:

@ sprint n stones

I've seen an interview with Marcus Burghardt (in german) where he was asked what the discussion was about ... Marcus was saying, he thought Peter was a bit too tense and doing too much, so he told him to relax, if anything he (Marcus) would take care of it ...

even though Peter is not the guy who needs to be lead out in a "rikscha" by his team, he is not a "loner" - and this is a proof, that a good and experienced teammate can be of immense psychological value ....

If I were Peter I'd buy Marcus a bottle of good vintage champagne ....

I've always thought it was weird that Bora didn't reach out to Paolini. He'd be the perfect teammate for Peter.

 

[SKSemtex]

Re: Re:

@ sprint n stones

I've seen an interview with Marcus Burghardt (in german) where he was asked what the discussion was about ... Marcus was saying, he thought Peter was a bit too tense and doing too much, so he told him to relax, if anything he (Marcus) would take care of it ...

even though Peter is not the guy who needs to be lead out in a "rikscha" by his team, he is not a "loner" - and this is a proof, that a good and experienced teammate can be of immense psychological value ....

If I were Peter I'd buy Marcus a bottle of good vintage champagne ....

I've always thought it was weird that Bora didn't reach out to Paolini. He'd be the perfect teammate for Peter.

Clinic issue probably. His racing in 2015 was too good.