PhiLiz
BANNED
- Sep 8, 2015
- 436
- 364
- 9,980
Something like that, yes. Before that he was with Horner (yeah, it's really funny) following an acceleration which he absolutely didn't need to match since Horner was 18th at the time.
love that this tour has been so obscene this thread has made a massive come back haha
Has there ever been a scientific test to compare modern bikes to bikes from different eras on a climb? It should be fairly easy to do on a set climb using a steady effort.
My guess would be that modern bikes are materially faster than the early to mid 90s bikes, mainly due to being a few kgs lighter and stiffer.
However I think the gains from the early to mid 00s bikes would be almost negligible once they were generally down to the weight limit. There might be more of a difference on the flat and downhill with improvements in brakes and aero, but not up the hills.
It would be good if there was something like this to put some more context on comparing climbing times from decades ago.
My guess would be that modern bikes are materially faster than the early to mid 90s bikes, mainly due to being a few kgs lighter and stiffer.
However I think the gains from the early to mid 00s bikes would be almost negligible once they were generally down to the weight limit. There might be more of a difference on the flat and downhill with improvements in brakes and aero, but not up the hills.
It would be good if there was something like this to put some more context on comparing climbing times from decades ago.
- Feb 20, 2012
- 53,933
- 44,320
- 28,180
I'm not for a second claiming that technological advances (or training, nurtition etc. advances) makes current performances in any way believable.
It was more just out of interest to put the climbing time/power comparisons in a better context.
I remember discussing this in 2020, especially during Giro when random riders were suddenly becoming world beaters after looking average the previous day.
- Jul 17, 2022
- 66
- 173
- 1,880
It's not like they didn't know that lighter=faster uphill. There's plenty of articles about modifications done to bikes back in 90s.
One of Pantani's climbing bikes used in 1998 is claimed to weigh 6.96kg, which is lighter than most pros use nowdays.
View: https://imgur.com/a/fbZyKzf
Light/aero bikes (and riding practice) will probably make the most difference on steadier 6%-7%-ish climbs - it would be interesting to calculate if the "estimated" VAM/WKG numbers have increased more on climbs like Peyresorude, Arcalis or even La Plange versus something with really steep ramps (that's not a new, novelty-climb) like the Marie-Blanque.
Not putting this as an explanation for everything but even a few years ago it seemed like every team had a special super-light bike for the climbers- even these now have aerodynamic elements and it's no longer unusual to just see teams straight up use the "aero bike" on mountain stages (or like Jumbo when they had Bianchis, just using the Oltre all-rounder bike for everything)
Not putting this as an explanation for everything but even a few years ago it seemed like every team had a special super-light bike for the climbers- even these now have aerodynamic elements and it's no longer unusual to just see teams straight up use the "aero bike" on mountain stages (or like Jumbo when they had Bianchis, just using the Oltre all-rounder bike for everything)
Last edited:
- Apr 10, 2019
- 12,078
- 15,990
- 23,180
Back then I was of the opinion that some teams/riders had just abused the Covid related lack of OOC testing for months, but the trend continued and I was proven wrong.
- May 3, 2010
- 4,487
- 4,563
- 21,180
Possibly the chain mechanism has improved. Team Sky had those Osymetric chainrings. Jumbo uses Dynamic Speed Wax. I don't know what difference it makes.
- May 29, 2011
- 3,549
- 1,651
- 16,680
I think gearing would be the most important drivetrain factor. Now they have 2x12, in the 90s 2x8 (or were 9s already available?). Will surely help.
The different form was never proven to make a difference.
The dynamic speed wax... didn't pog also use something similar? if it mattered even a single W, all teams would use it since it is an easy thing to add.
- Sep 2, 2011
- 17,538
- 13,761
- 28,180
- Apr 30, 2011
- 47,163
- 29,798
- 28,180
It was a super mighty VAM effort, but it's not comparable to efforts like Vingegaard's in the Tour or even Hindley on Fedaia. Tre Cime is the only proper benchmark in the Giro for that, but that quickly becomes a matter of how it is raced. I'm curious about Crans-Montana, I hope it won't be a peloton at the bottom, but it could likely be so. Then we'll see how fast they can go after some fatigue.
- Feb 20, 2012
- 53,933
- 44,320
- 28,180
Comparable maybe to Covadonga 2021? Rog did 6.0-6.1 I think after pacing the valley too.
- Jul 18, 2020
- 1,167
- 1,754
- 7,680
- Apr 10, 2019
- 12,078
- 15,990
- 23,180
- Feb 20, 2012
- 53,933
- 44,320
- 28,180
Lmao did the LR guys delete their Giro climbing times predictions article where they were literally overestimating every climbing performance by minutes?
- Apr 30, 2011
- 47,163
- 29,798
- 28,180
- Apr 10, 2019
- 12,078
- 15,990
- 23,180
I bet they let actually smart people do the calculations and are just figureheads.
- Feb 20, 2012
- 53,933
- 44,320
- 28,180
The numbers they come up with don't look like that to me.
- Apr 10, 2019
- 12,078
- 15,990
- 23,180
Yeah, that's true.
Ib4 Almeida suddenly gets supercharged with the special Pogi sauce and wins the Giro tomorrow with an absurd climbing time.
PhiLiz
BANNED
- Sep 8, 2015
- 436
- 364
- 9,980
Their formula is trash. Overcomplicated but also fails to address the problem of massive weight differences between riders because their standardization method is a joke.
TRENDING THREADS
-
Teams & Riders The Remco Evenepoel is the next Eddy Merckx thread- Started by DNP-Old
- Replies: 36K
-
Teams & Riders Tadej Pogačar discussion thread- Started by Lequack
- Replies: 41K
-
Teams & Riders The Great Big Cycling Transfers, Extensions, and Rumours Thread- Started by RedheadDane
- Replies: 13K
-
Il Lombardia 2025, monument, October 11- Started by Krzysztof_O
- Replies: 792
-
European Championship 2025: Men’s RR, October 5- Started by Berniece
- Replies: 854
-
-
Facebook
Twitter
Instagram