Race Thread

[Samu Cuenca]

I think Crees and/or Kay would be able to do decently in the elite race, considering the number of stronger riders that are taking part in the U23 race instead, and they've already been cheated out of doing the Euros this season. Kay did finish 17th last year, and out of those that beat her there, we know that Verdonschot, Rochette and Honsinger won't be there this time around and that Casasola might not be either, but I guess it was easier (and cheaper) not to field anyone among the elites.

That said, Kay did beat Franck and Fouquenet in Tábor, and it's definitely not a given that she would do that again this year, but a top 20 should still be within reach (Franck isn't riding, but Julie Browers has a similar level). Mason and Mein aren't looking like they'll be able to do much better than that, but Mason should probably still get the benefit of the doubt regarding his future potential.

You could of course argue that the third placed rider in the WC standings shouldn't be riding the U23 race (although she obviously isn't the third best rider in the World (yet)), but that is a different discussion.

 

[JR1012]

It will be interesting to see whether Schreiber can finally offer up any sort of challenge to Backstedt in the U23 race. Based on this season you'd say that she's simply the better rider, but somehow in championships she always falls short. Even managed to lose in the Euro champs against Celia Gery... unbelievable if you look at their respective level now.

On the other hand you can say that Backstedt is always in top form when in comes to the Worlds.

 

[theyoungest]

You could of course argue that the third placed rider in the WC standings shouldn't be riding the U23 race (although she obviously isn't the third best rider in the World (yet)), but that is a different discussion.

Backstedt is just not good enough, that's why she's still racing the U23s. But that makes a potential world title also a bit meaningless. Same goes for Tibor del Grosso, btw. What's the point of him racing the U23 race, other than the fact that he can win there rather than placing top-5.

The really exceptional talents, like MVDP and WVA on the men's side, and Pieterse and Van Empel on the women's, already rode the elite race at that age.

 

[Wyndbrook]

Backstedt is just not good enough, that's why she's still racing the U23s. But that makes a potential world title also a bit meaningless. Same goes for Tibor del Grosso, btw. What's the point of him racing the U23 race, other than the fact that he can win there rather than placing top-5.

The really exceptional talents, like MVDP and WVA on the men's side, and Pieterse and Van Empel on the women's, already rode the elite race at that age.

Maybe reduce the age limit by a year or even two might be the answer.
It's not an uncommon situation, Van Anrooij two years ago had already won several senior world cups and still raced u23 because she was second the previous year and wanted a title, if she had raced up Backstedt would now be looking a a potential third u23 title.

 

[Samu Cuenca]

Backstedt is just not good enough, that's why she's still racing the U23s. But that makes a potential world title also a bit meaningless. Same goes for Tibor del Grosso, btw. What's the point of him racing the U23 race, other than the fact that he can win there rather than placing top-5.

The really exceptional talents, like MVDP and WVA on the men's side, and Pieterse and Van Empel on the women's, already rode the elite race at that age.

I think it's different on the men's side where they actually ride U23 races during the season. There could be some rules regarding eligibility, for instance that a Worlds title and/or overall U23 World Cup title would keep you from ever riding them again. Under those rules, Van Anrooij would still have been able to do the U23 race two years ago, but it would have disqualified Bäckstedt and Del Grosso this year.

 

[Armchair Cyclist]

Backstedt is just not good enough, that's why she's still racing the U23s. But that makes a potential world title also a bit meaningless. Same goes for Tibor del Grosso, btw. What's the point of him racing the U23 race, other than the fact that he can win there rather than placing top-5.

The really exceptional talents, like MVDP and WVA on the men's side, and Pieterse and Van Empel on the women's, already rode the elite race at that age.

At risk of repeating the discussion we had in relation to the U23 RR WC from this year on , I disagree strongly with the bolded.

It is to my thinking entirely nonsensical to say that, if a title by age (or sex, or disability) restriction is meaningful, that people who meet that age restriction should not be eligible because they are too good. Too good to be world champion is an oxymoron.

If the WU23 championship would be rendered meaningless by Backstedt winning it easily, does that mean the ME WC is meaningless if it is going to be won by van der Poel with little difficulty?

If some riders consider it below them to enter such an event, that is their career development/commercial decision. But as soon as it is said that they should not enter it, it seems to me impossible for the person saying that to defend the existence of said restricted championship.

 

[awavey]

Backstedt is just not good enough, that's why she's still racing the U23s. But that makes a potential world title also a bit meaningless. Same goes for Tibor del Grosso, btw. What's the point of him racing the U23 race, other than the fact that he can win there rather than placing top-5.

The really exceptional talents, like MVDP and WVA on the men's side, and Pieterse and Van Empel on the women's, already rode the elite race at that age.

It's back to the funding model for BC, a win at a world championships whatever the age bracket counts for more than finishing in the pack in the next level up, so they'll focus the riders they have on what they can win, rather than come away potentially with nothing.

 

[jono]

I think it's different on the men's side where they actually ride U23 races during the season. There could be some rules regarding eligibility, for instance that a Worlds title and/or overall U23 World Cup title would keep you from ever riding them again. Under those rules, Van Anrooij would still have been able to do the U23 race two years ago, but it would have disqualified Bäckstedt and Del Grosso this year.

Has Backstedt ever raced in her U23 rainbow jersey?

 

[Samu Cuenca]

Has Backstedt ever raced in her U23 rainbow jersey?

I believe she's only ever worn it during the U23 podium ceremonies after races.

 

[theyoungest]

At risk of repeating the discussion we had in relation to the U23 RR WC from this year on , I disagree strongly with the bolded.

It is to my thinking entirely nonsensical to say that, if a title by age (or sex, or disability) restriction is meaningful, that people who meet that age restriction should not be eligible because they are too good. Too good to be world champion is an oxymoron.

If the WU23 championship would be rendered meaningless by Backstedt winning it easily, does that mean the ME WC is meaningless if it is going to be won by van der Poel with little difficulty?

If some riders consider it below them to enter such an event, that is their career development/commercial decision. But as soon as it is said that they should not enter it, it seems to me impossible for the person saying that to defend the existence of said restricted championship.

I'm not saying Backstedt is too good for the U23s, although she probably is (given the form she usually shows up at in championship races) but what does another world title in that category prove? It would be interesting to see if her championship form could translate to a podium result among the elites, who knows.

I can understand she'd rather do a race she can actually win, but that kind of defeats the purpose of the U23 race. And yes, I do think it should be a U21 race, like I've argued before. That age category makes much more sense.

It's back to the funding model for BC, a win at a world championships whatever the age bracket counts for more than finishing in the pack in the next level up, so they'll focus the riders they have on what they can win, rather than come away potentially with nothing.

But in that case she'll probably do the U23 race next year again.

 

[jono]

And yes, I do think it should be a U21 race, like I've argued before. That age category makes much more sense.

Similar discussions to be had about changing the age cut-off for BYR jersey at the various tours.

 

[awavey]

I believe she's only ever worn it during the U23 podium ceremonies after races.

but it would need to be an U23 only race for her to be allowed to wear it, because it could clash with the Elite champion, Its like Cat Ferguson is U23 national champion now, but she wont ever get to wear it in a race either.

 

[jono]

Both Holmgren sisters are back on the startlists for this weekend's World Cups, which is a good sign for their participation at Lievin after their mysteriously abbreviated kerstperiode. Tyler Clark will be lining up for his first races since his 3rd place at nationals, so you can expect him to take part in the elite race at worlds. Elite national champ Ian Ackert will be racing U23s.

No Gunnar Holmgren, so I assume he's in full mountain bike mode and will not be taking part in any more CX this year.

 

[awavey]

But in that case she'll probably do the U23 race next year again.

she might feel in a years time with another year of pro tour development, and she's only 20 still dont forget, that shes able to take on the Elite level, and hit the target results she wants just as much as BC wants, and with Cat, Imogen & Ella a year further in their development too there'd still be decent U23 chances for success.

also I might be misremembering this but is there a UCI rule that says you cant swap between Elite/U23 categories as you choose, once you pick & raced Elite thats it no more U23 races ? because Im sure we had this same thing with Pidcock for a while.

 

[theyoungest]

also I might be misremembering this but is there a UCI rule that says you cant swap between Elite/U23 categories as you choose, once you pick & raced Elite thats it no more U23 races ? because Im sure we had this same thing with Pidcock for a while.

Yeah, or with Pieterse vs. Van Empel two years ago, one in the U23 world cup leader's jersey and the other in the elite leader's jersey. Even though they're the same age. But Pieterse wanted to keep her options open for Worlds.

 

[Axel Hangleck]

Both Holmgren sisters are back on the startlists for this weekend's World Cups, which is a good sign for their participation at Lievin after their mysteriously abbreviated kerstperiode. Tyler Clark will be lining up for his first races since his 3rd place at nationals, so you can expect him to take part in the elite race at worlds. Elite national champ Ian Ackert will be racing U23s.

No Gunnar Holmgren, so I assume he's in full mountain bike mode and will not be taking part in any more CX this year.

It's a big year for him; now on one of the big Factory teams, he'll want to hit the ground running; I'm guessing the early season races in Spain are on his calendar. Team mates Evie & Maddie no longer bother with European CX races; I wonder if that's personal, and/or a team policy.

 

[jono]

Assuming no changes to the start lists, it will be the last CX battle of the season between Wout and Mathieu tomorrow.

 

[theyoungest]

Assuming no changes to the start lists, it will be the last CX battle of the season between Wout and Mathieu tomorrow.

There's already one change: Nys is out with a cold.

To be honest I think he would have been closer to MVDP than Wout probably is.

 

[Sciatic]

There's already one change: Nys is out with a cold.

To be honest I think he would have been closer to MVDP than Wout probably is.

Has MVDP’s rib injury all healed?

 

[jono]

Has MVDP’s rib injury all healed?

I would assume it's cleared up if he's taking to the start line. I don't think he'd risk it otherwise.

 

[jono]

Does anyone know what kind of conditions we are expecting for the race? I had a look back at last year's race video and it looked pretty dry wasn't a mudfest, but the race came much earlier in the season.

 

[Wvv]

Does anyone know what kind of conditions we are expecting for the race? I had a look back at last year's race video and it looked pretty dry wasn't a mudfest, but the race came much earlier in the season.

It's quite muddy, but not enough to be in Van Aert's advantage.

 

[Coffeeplanter]

What a great race.

 

[Coffeeplanter]

Conclusion of this race: Lars Boom should be in prison for mismanagement.

 

[theyoungest]

Wow, that was some race. Backstedt seemed the strongest, right now you'd think she certainly has a chance at the elite worlds... and a great win for Vas, first world cup win in 4 years or so?

Van Empel can't keep f.cking up like this and having to chase for the entire race, you can see the fight is just going out of her.