Rank 1-4: Boonen, Cancellara, Contador & Valverde

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Gigs_98 said:
1.) Contador (really no question for me. In my opinion a gt win is way more important than a monument win and he has won 7 of them and it's quite likely he will win even more in the future)
2.) Cancellara (this was extremely difficult for me. Places 2-4 are more or less even for me and it's hard to argue which one is better. At the end I thought about which rider will be remembered in the future and I think it's Spartacus. I rate him slightly higher than Boonen since he has more variety in his palmares and higher than Valverde because although Valverde has even more variety he doesn't have quite as many big wins)
3.) Boonen (has the edge over Valverde because of the same reason. He has won 4 monuments more than Valverde, an advantage even Valverde's vuelta can't compensate. Besides that Boonen has also won more smaller one day races although Valverde's stage races make it relatively close again. However what really makes a difference is that Boonen has won a rainbow jersey, which is the one win Valverde's palmares is really missing.)
4.) Valverde (because of the reasons mentioned above. However if he wins the Olympics this year or a WC title, because who knows how long this guy will ride, he would probably be 2nd on my list)
This would be my list too for the same reasons.
 
Its pretty sad to see the most talented, most versatile and most consistent rider getting snubbed on this forum. Contador over Valverde, no problem, but Boonen? Man, I have a hard time with people placing him over Valverde. I think there is a world's difference between those two, especially lately.
 
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Valv.Piti said:
Its pretty sad to see the most talented, most versatile and most consistent rider getting snubbed on this forum. Contador over Valverde, no problem, but Boonen? Man, I have a hard time with people placing him over Valverde. I think there is a world's difference between those two, especially lately.
I think the objective stats (procycling) say it all. Valverde is the best cyclist by a landslide. Emotional reasoning will lead for people going for their favourite riders and those who win their favourite races or those who have a style they prefer, but objectively Valverde is the best cyclist - if not perhaps the best winner. Will be interesting to see if Sagan can beat Valverde's points tally by the end of his career.
 
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DFA123 said:
Valv.Piti said:
Its pretty sad to see the most talented, most versatile and most consistent rider getting snubbed on this forum. Contador over Valverde, no problem, but Boonen? Man, I have a hard time with people placing him over Valverde. I think there is a world's difference between those two, especially lately.
I think the objective stats (procycling) say it all. Valverde is the best cyclist by a landslide. Emotional reasoning will lead for people going for their favourite riders and those who win their favourite races or those who have a style they prefer, but objectively Valverde is the best cyclist - if not perhaps the best winner. Will be interesting to see if Sagan can beat Valverde's points tally by the end of his career.
Valverde has most points on PCS not because of his wins, but because of his gigantic list of podium places and top-10's. Valverde is most versatile and most consistent, but the best? No, not in my opinion. I value wins over placings and I bet many others feel the same.
 
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LaFlorecita said:
DFA123 said:
Valv.Piti said:
Its pretty sad to see the most talented, most versatile and most consistent rider getting snubbed on this forum. Contador over Valverde, no problem, but Boonen? Man, I have a hard time with people placing him over Valverde. I think there is a world's difference between those two, especially lately.
I think the objective stats (procycling) say it all. Valverde is the best cyclist by a landslide. Emotional reasoning will lead for people going for their favourite riders and those who win their favourite races or those who have a style they prefer, but objectively Valverde is the best cyclist - if not perhaps the best winner. Will be interesting to see if Sagan can beat Valverde's points tally by the end of his career.
Valverde has most points on PCS not because of his wins, but because of his gigantic list of podium places and top-10's. Valverde is most versatile and most consistent, but the best? No, not in my opinion. I value wins over placings and I bet many others feel the same.
Exactly. He's the best cyclist, but not the best winner. Although he's still a pretty prolific winner.
 
Mar 22, 2011
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Consider points : 1. Achievement in most important races. 2. If he is the Best in all time.

1. Contrador (TDF is most prestious races. Best GTer in the era.7 GT)
2. Cancellera (Close to best Classic rider all the time. Best TTer in the era. 7 Momentum)
3. Boonen (Close to best Classics all time. WC + 7 Momentum)
4. Valverde (Too many riders in similar quality... This decade, there are nabili and evans)

Valverde
Vuelta a España General classification (2009)
Liège–Bastogne–Liège (2006, 2008, 2015)

Boonen
Tour de France Points classification (2007)
World Road Race Championships (2005)
Tour of Flanders (2005, 2006, 2012)Paris–Roubaix (2005, 2008, 2009, 2012)

Cancellera
Paris–Roubaix (2006, 2010, 2013)Milan–San Remo (2008)Tour of Flanders (2010, 2013, 2014)
Olympic & WC in ITT

Contador
Tour de France General classification (2007, 2009)
Giro d'Italia General classification (2008, 2015)
Vuelta a España General classification (2008, 2012, 2014)
 
May 20, 2015
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1)Contador
2)Cancellara
3)Boonen
4)Valverde

First goes to AC no doubt best GT rider of the last 10 years such a classy rider will be remembered and missed by all the sports lovers.
Boonen and Cancellara are pretty equal in the Classics to me but i'd put Cancellara first because of his versatility.
Concerning Valverde, i have huge respect for his achievements and he's a great rider but s*** how can you be such a conservative rider, he never made something that will be remembered by people such as PR 2010-2012,ADH 2011, Fuente De 2012 ... I cant put him higer.
 
Jul 8, 2016
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Valverde's podiums in each Grand Tour are to be commended. He deserves far more credit than say Contador who won each grand tour 3 times.
 
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LaFlorecita said:
DFA123 said:
Valv.Piti said:
Its pretty sad to see the most talented, most versatile and most consistent rider getting snubbed on this forum. Contador over Valverde, no problem, but Boonen? Man, I have a hard time with people placing him over Valverde. I think there is a world's difference between those two, especially lately.
I think the objective stats (procycling) say it all. Valverde is the best cyclist by a landslide. Emotional reasoning will lead for people going for their favourite riders and those who win their favourite races or those who have a style they prefer, but objectively Valverde is the best cyclist - if not perhaps the best winner. Will be interesting to see if Sagan can beat Valverde's points tally by the end of his career.
Valverde has most points on PCS not because of his wins, but because of his gigantic list of podium places and top-10's. Valverde is most versatile and most consistent, but the best? No, not in my opinion. I value wins over placings and I bet many others feel the same.
And yet, he has more wins than Cancellara and Contador, only beaten by Boonen who is/was a sprinter. Sure, he doesn't win TdF, but I think what he is doing, just this year at 35 years, deserves an incredibly amount of respect. Ardennes + Giro + Tour? Contador at this peak of his powers in 2011 (I think that was the most dominant Contador) couldn't finish higher than 5th in the Tour while being the sole leader on that horrific Saxo squad. And Valverde won F-W, controlling the race up Huy against what seemed like junior riders compared to him, won a stage and finished on the podium of the Giro and is now a luxury domestique for Quintana while still riding GC. Incredibly.
 
Not sure why people are comparing the palmares of each rider, to find the best. The procycling stats ranking is basically already doing that, and in a much more objective way. Surely the discussion is about whether reasons outside the palmares should count towards who is the greatest cyclist. Otherwise it just turns into a 'who is your favourite rider' thread, and then choosing races and results to support that.

Stylewise all four riders are very different and you could make a case for any of them, likewise in terms of talent and fulfilling their potential the most. Or you could discuss how tough the opposition was in the races they won, and also did they fail against the best.

Just listing the palmares though is a bit redundant. Procycling ranking pretty much has that sewn up with a formula more objective than any of us.
 
Jul 8, 2016
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I also find it funny people put Boonen above Contador when Boonen himself said Contador was the biggest talent he had ever seen :D
 
Jul 29, 2012
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LeSensei said:
I also find it funny people put Boonen above Contador when Boonen himself said Contador was the biggest talent he had ever seen :D
Not true, he said piti and Contador are the greatest talents.
 
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DFA123 said:
Not sure why people are comparing the palmares of each rider, to find the best. The procycling stats ranking is basically already doing that, and in a much more objective way. Surely the discussion is about whether reasons outside the palmares should count towards who is the greatest cyclist. Otherwise it just turns into a 'who is your favourite rider' thread, and then choosing races and results to support that.

Stylewise all four riders are very different and you could make a case for any of them, likewise in terms of talent and fulfilling their potential the most. Or you could discuss how tough the opposition was in the races they won, and also did they fail against the best.

Just listing the palmares though is a bit redundant. Procycling ranking pretty much has that sewn up with a formula more objective than any of us.
Do you mean the same ranking that gives points for 8th place on a stage in 2.1 races?
 
Apr 27, 2014
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Contador: one the GREATEST stage racer ever.
Boonen: GREAT one day racer and good sprinter.
Cancellara: GREAT time trialist, GREAT one day racer and good domestique.
Valverde: very good stage racer, GREAT one day racer.
Although the most consistent of them is Valverde, and my favourite rider of the moment; Contador is the one who will be REMEMBER in 50 and more years, meanwhile the other three will be forgotten sooner or later.
My list would be:

1-Contador
2-Valverde
3-Cancellara
4-Boonen

I dont even think that Cancellara and Boonen should be compared with Valverde and Contador, because they are almost non factors in Grand Tours, which are the most important races of the year, especially Le Tour, although Im sure a lot of people wont agree with me.
 
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Red Rick said:
DFA123 said:
Not sure why people are comparing the palmares of each rider, to find the best. The procycling stats ranking is basically already doing that, and in a much more objective way. Surely the discussion is about whether reasons outside the palmares should count towards who is the greatest cyclist. Otherwise it just turns into a 'who is your favourite rider' thread, and then choosing races and results to support that.

Stylewise all four riders are very different and you could make a case for any of them, likewise in terms of talent and fulfilling their potential the most. Or you could discuss how tough the opposition was in the races they won, and also did they fail against the best.

Just listing the palmares though is a bit redundant. Procycling ranking pretty much has that sewn up with a formula more objective than any of us.
Do you mean the same ranking that gives points for 8th place on a stage in 2.1 races?
Yes. Some people will say winning the odd race is all that counts; others will say accumulating loads of top 10s is more impressive. Usually to support whoever is their favourite rider. These rankings systems strike a balance. They are objective and not swayed by favourites or emotion.

Interestingly, whichever of these rankings you look at - despite all having different formulas - they basically all end up with pretty similar standings.
 
Jul 8, 2016
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Miburo said:
LeSensei said:
I also find it funny people put Boonen above Contador when Boonen himself said Contador was the biggest talent he had ever seen :D
Not true, he said piti and Contador are the greatest talents.
How about half true then?
 
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Valv.Piti said:
And yet, he has more wins than Cancellara and Contador, only beaten by Boonen who is/was a sprinter. Sure, he doesn't win TdF, but I think what he is doing, just this year at 35 years, deserves an incredibly amount of respect. Ardennes + Giro + Tour? Contador at this peak of his powers in 2011 (I think that was the most dominant Contador) couldn't finish higher than 5th in the Tour while being the sole leader on that horrific Saxo squad. And Valverde won F-W, controlling the race up Huy against what seemed like junior riders compared to him, won a stage and finished on the podium of the Giro and is now a luxury domestique for Quintana while still riding GC. Incredibly.
Obviously Valverde has more wins than Contador but Contador's are generally of a higher quality. That should also be taken into account.
 
Jul 13, 2010
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LeSensei said:
Lord Stanley said:
I just made this, what do you think?

Putting Wiggins above Nibali, up there with Contador and Valverde is an insult to these three, in my opinion.
Without the track record he is nowehere near close to them of course.

Anyway my ranking (without the excel formula) would be:
Contador
Cancellara
Valverde
Boonen
 
May 26, 2012
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IMHO Valverde is the best rider in this era simply because of his consistency and versatility. After 20-30 years everybody will remember Valverde as (probably the last) rider who could win GT, 1 week stage race, monuments, classics, simply everything. Rider who is climber, puncher, sprinter...and he is winning from january to october, he has much more racing days than any other big name in peloton. Contador used to be the best GT rider (by far) for few years, now the best GT rider is Froome, in future it could be Quintana...there will be riders with similar palmares like Contador's, but rider like Valverde is not born in every generation. He is one of his kind...And he is 36 years old and he is still not declining!
 
Aug 31, 2012
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Lord Stanley said:
I just made this, what do you think?

Without thinking too deeply about it, I like the values you assign to the various results, except for track. That's a sensible scheme to evaluate a rider's palmares in my view.
 
SeriousSam said:
Lord Stanley said:
I just made this, what do you think?

Without thinking too deeply about it, I like the values you assign to the various results, except for track. That's a sensible scheme to evaluate a rider's palmares in my view.
You think WC and Olympic TT should carry the same value as the respective road races?
Also, finishing 2nd in a monument is worth less than a winning a stage in Poland or Eneco?

It basically looks like a very simplified version of the procycling or cq rankings - with some track stuff thrown in.
 
Talent:

1) Valverde
2) Boonen
3) Cancellara
4) Contador

Results:

1) Contador
2) Cancellara
3) Boonen
4) Valverde

Contador has incredible endurance, but when it comes to short, explosive efforts, he's pretty bad. Meanwhile Boonen has demonstrated great sprinting ability as well as great endurance. Similarly, Cancellara has great endurance, shown by his TTing ability, and he's also decent at anerobic efforts, shown by results such as his 4th place on the pan flat 2011 WC, where he nearly beat Greipel in the sprint. And I don't think there's any need to explain why I've said Valverde is the most talented.

However, grand tour wins are simply the biggest thing you can achieve in cycling, and Contador has nearly won as many GTs as Canc or Boonen have monuments. And while Valverde is so consistent and has won so much, at the end of the day, he's only won 3 monuments and 1 Grand Tour, which is very poor considering his immense talent.

Fwiw, I think Nibali and Cavendish should also be included in a thread like this, considering what they've already achieved. They're most likely going to add a lot more results before the end of their careers as well, while the four in this thread are fairly old and towards the end of their careers
 

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