Rank the top 5 cyclists from your country by palmares

[Valanga]

Re:

Strictly speaking, I'm half-Swedish and half-Belgian (though I hardly know Sweden, really). For the former, I'd not know who to list, frankly. I also don't really understand why Sweden doesn't have good cyclists - there are mountains, hills and plenty of sporty people. What's up with that.

They're too busy XC skiing. Even during summer yes.
And although they are sporty people, they're generally not very competitive minded (unlike the Norwegians). And those cyclists that are, go mountainbiking. Road racing is just not very popular.

 

[del1962]

Re: Re:

Strictly speaking, I'm half-Swedish and half-Belgian (though I hardly know Sweden, really). For the former, I'd not know who to list, frankly. I also don't really understand why Sweden doesn't have good cyclists - there are mountains, hills and plenty of sporty people. What's up with that.

Heck the only Swedish cyclists I've heard of is Thomas Löfkvist and Gustav Larsson.

Magnus Backstetd - winner of P-R
The Ludvigsson brothers once looked promising

 

[tobydawq]

Re: Re:

Strictly speaking, I'm half-Swedish and half-Belgian (though I hardly know Sweden, really). For the former, I'd not know who to list, frankly. I also don't really understand why Sweden doesn't have good cyclists - there are mountains, hills and plenty of sporty people. What's up with that.

Heck the only Swedish cyclists I've heard of is Thomas Löfkvist and Gustav Larsson.

Magnus Backstetd - winner of P-R
The Ludvigsson brothers once looked promising

Fredrik Kessiakoff - polkadot wearer and Vuelta TT winner five years ago.

Marcus Ljungqvist - not good but heard of.

 

[del1962]

Re: Re:

Strictly speaking, I'm half-Swedish and half-Belgian (though I hardly know Sweden, really). For the former, I'd not know who to list, frankly. I also don't really understand why Sweden doesn't have good cyclists - there are mountains, hills and plenty of sporty people. What's up with that.

Heck the only Swedish cyclists I've heard of is Thomas Löfkvist and Gustav Larsson.

Magnus Backstetd - winner of P-R
The Ludvigsson brothers once looked promising

Fredrik Kessiakoff - polkadot wearer and Vuelta TT winner five years ago.

Marcus Ljungqvist - not good but heard of.

Probablt Tommy Prim from the 80s podiumed Giro a couple of times and Gösta Pettersson from the 70s, he won Giro and podiumed the tour before my memory banks though

 

[SKSemtex]

Re: Re:

1.Peter Sagan.
2.Anton Tkac
3. Jan Svorada
4. Peter Velits
5. Milan Jurco
6. Erik Baska

If Sagan changes his nationality ( I would not blame him either) shell I crossed him off from Slovak list of historically best Slovak cyclists?

No, because he still would have accomplished a ton while representing Slovakia. I have no idea, did Svorada ever actually ride for Slovakia?

He changed the nationality only in 1996 so yes he was riding WCRR as Slovak.

BTW as far as palmiers are concerned Peter Velits should be right second. Yes, his podium in Vuelta is probably a fluke, but the guy is still 3 times world champion in TTT.

 

[rghysens]

Belgium:

(The most difficult was to judge the palmares of Philippe Thys.)

1) Eddy Merckx
2) Rik Van Looy
3) Philippe Thys
4) Roger De Vlaeminck
5) Freddy Maertens

 

[gunara]

Re:

Susanto
Samai
Fitrianto
Suryadi
Cahyadi

Which Suryadi? :razz:
Nice list btw. I don't have my own since I have no idea how to measure the achievement of the 20th century cyclists, yet you did well by not picking any of them at all.

 

[jaylew]

Re: Re:

Susanto
Samai
Fitrianto
Suryadi
Cahyadi

Which Suryadi? :razz:
Nice list btw. I don't have my own since I have no idea how to measure the achievement of the 20th century cyclists, yet you did well by not picking any of them at all.

Why is the only list that hardly anyone knows one of the few not to mention the nation - I guess to make us try and figure it out. I'll be honest, I've never even heard of one Indonesian cyclist. How popular is the sport there?

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Re:

Belgium:

(The most difficult was to judge the palmares of Philippe Thys.)

1) Eddy Merckx
2) Rik Van Looy
3) Philippe Thys
4) Roger De Vlaeminck
5) Freddy Maertens

Agreed, that's why i gave him more of an "honorable mention", because WWI being smack dab in the middle of his carreer and because it was a complete different era back then, not even close to being a global sport at all.

 

[staubsauger]

1. Joop Zoetemelk
2. Jan Janssen
3. Hennie Kuiper
4. Gerrie Kneteman
5. Erik Breukink
6. Michael Boogerd
7. Jan Raas
8. Steven Rooks
9. Johan Vandevelde
10. Peter Winnen
11. Adrien van der Poel
12. Erik Dekker
+ Tom Dumoulin

Does it really need a German to make a proper hit list of Dutch cycling!?

 

[franic]

Re:

I would think Germany with ullrich or zabel, russia menchov or ekimov (sp)

Berzin!
1 GC at Giro
5 stages at Giro
1 Stage at Tour de France
1 LBL

Also Pavel Tonkov:
1 GC at Giro
7 stages at Giro
2 stages at Vuelta
1 GC at Tour de Suisse
1GC at Romandie

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Russia is impossible because in a different era, Sukhoruchenkov, Barinov and Ivanov would have been much bigger names. Ivanov was 6th in the Vuelta back in the days when Russians were barred from professional contracts, for goodness' sake. Also, who do you count, since in the USSR days you also had people like Aleksandr Averin and Sasha Zinoviev (Ukraine), Aavo Pikkuus (Estonia) and Piotrs Ugrumovs (Latvia - later of course became a star for Latvia in his own right) who built strong banks of results while racing for the USSR. Judging them against the likes of Menchov and Zakarin is nigh on impossible, plus you of course have those like Konyshev and Ekimov whose careers straddle the amateur and professional eras.

 

[staubsauger]

Didn't Ugrumov ride on his Soviet passport until 1996 and represented Russia at the Olympics!? He only became Latvian later which of course makes him an EU citizen nowadays.

 

[Jungle Cycle]

Brasil, i know, nothing compare to extremely more traditional countries;
1- Mauro Ribeiro, 1 Tour stage(my avatar)
2- Murilo Fisher, did everything out there, tour, giro, vuelta, classics, WRC, olympics, with lots of `almost`, road captain and so on...
3- Anesio Argenton (track)
4- Pagliarini
5- Adriato

 

[The Hegelian]

Re:

1. Joop Zoetemelk
2. Jan Janssen
3. Hennie Kuiper
4. Gerrie Kneteman
5. Erik Breukink
6. Michael Boogerd
7. Jan Raas
8. Steven Rooks
9. Johan Vandevelde
10. Peter Winnen
11. Adrien van der Poel
12. Erik Dekker
+ Tom Dumoulin

Does it really need a German to make a proper hit list of Dutch cycling!?

I think Dumoulin gets ahead of Breukink - on the basis of his Giro win alone, but add to that his two 2nd's this year + Itt wins.

 

[movingtarget]

Re: Re:

1. Joop Zoetemelk
2. Jan Janssen
3. Hennie Kuiper
4. Gerrie Kneteman
5. Erik Breukink
6. Michael Boogerd
7. Jan Raas
8. Steven Rooks
9. Johan Vandevelde
10. Peter Winnen
11. Adrien van der Poel
12. Erik Dekker
+ Tom Dumoulin

Does it really need a German to make a proper hit list of Dutch cycling!?

I think Dumoulin gets ahead of Breukink - on the basis of his Giro win alone, but add to that his two 2nd's this year + Itt wins.

You would think. And Breukink should be below Jan Raas who should be fifth or sixth probably.

 

[tobydawq]

Re:

Brasil, i know, nothing compare to extremely more traditional countries;
1- Mauro Ribeiro, 1 Tour stage(my avatar)
2- Murilo Fisher, did everything out there, tour, giro, vuelta, classics, WRC, olympics, with lots of `almost`, road captain and so on...
3- Anesio Argenton (track)
4- Pagliarini
5- Adriato

It's quite astonishing that Fischer has a year-end CQ ranking top 10 to his name.

 

[Pennino]

Re:

Belgium:

(The most difficult was to judge the palmares of Philippe Thys.)

1) Eddy Merckx
2) Rik Van Looy
3) Philippe Thys
4) Roger De Vlaeminck
5) Freddy Maertens

I guess Tom Boonen would be sixth? Quite surprising not to see him here.

 

[drebelo]

Im not really familiared with the cyclist from the latest century but for Portugal I would go with:
Joaquim Agostinho
Rui Costa
Acácio da Silva
José Azevedo
Sérgio Paulinho

 

[Roku]

I'm not russian but i followed a lot russian cycling, especially in my teenage years. For the modern era, i would go with the following:

1. Denis Menchov (2 GT wins, TDF podium + other relevant wins, such as Itzulia, stages in all GT, stages in Dauphiné and Paris-Nice...)
2. Pavel Tonkov (Won Giro d'Italia and placed second in two more, he also podiumed in Vuelta. A bunch of GT stage wins and some other relevant wins).
3. Evgeni Berzin (Won Giro d'Italia)
4. Viacheslav Ekimov (Gold Medal in ITT in Sidney'00 and other lesser but relevant wins, such as De Panne, stage in La Vuelta)
5. Dimitri Konyshev

Zakarin would be a notable mention, not far from Konyshev.

 

[rghysens]

Re: Re:

Belgium:

(The most difficult was to judge the palmares of Philippe Thys.)

1) Eddy Merckx
2) Rik Van Looy
3) Philippe Thys
4) Roger De Vlaeminck
5) Freddy Maertens

I guess Tom Boonen would be sixth? Quite surprising not to see him here.

Definitely not. For 5th and 6th I doubted between Maertens and Van Steenbergen. So Van Steenbergen (3x wc, 1x msr, 2x rvv, 1x p-r, 2x FW,...) is 6th. I also rate Museeuw and Schotte higher than Boonen. Then there are guys like Sylvere Maes and Lucien Buysse who both won the Tour twice (but not much else), Germain Derycke and Walter Godefroot who lack the world title but were certainly no worse one day racers than Boonen (in an era with more competition). So, in my opinion Boonen hovers around somewhere in the lower parts of the top10.

 

[Echoes]

Philippe Thys is more overrated than underrated, actually. WWI did not stop him from winning Lombardy in a controversial way and he benefitted a lot from the lack of competition due to the war itself that killed many riders or stopped many careers. In those old days, I like Cyrille Van Houwaert better but that's because he was iconic as the first Belgian with an international reputation and the first "Flandrian". On these boards I've been bashed for rating Walter Godefroot or Herman Van Springel too high but that's because in my opinion high places in major races though not being equal to victories in any way still mean something and Van Springel or Godefroot had their share of high places beside many major victories.

 

[Flamin]

Re: Re:

Belgium:

(The most difficult was to judge the palmares of Philippe Thys.)

1) Eddy Merckx
2) Rik Van Looy
3) Philippe Thys
4) Roger De Vlaeminck
5) Freddy Maertens

I guess Tom Boonen would be sixth? Quite surprising not to see him here.

Definitely not. For 5th and 6th I doubted between Maertens and Van Steenbergen. So Van Steenbergen (3x wc, 1x msr, 2x rvv, 1x p-r, 2x FW,...) is 6th. I also rate Museeuw and Schotte higher than Boonen. Then there are guys like Sylvere Maes and Lucien Buysse who both won the Tour twice (but not much else), Germain Derycke and Walter Godefroot who lack the world title but were certainly no worse one day racers than Boonen (in an era with more competition). So, in my opinion Boonen hovers around somewhere in the lower parts of the top10.

I don't get how people keep saying this. The level today is 1000 times higher.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Re: Re:

Belgium:

(The most difficult was to judge the palmares of Philippe Thys.)

1) Eddy Merckx
2) Rik Van Looy
3) Philippe Thys
4) Roger De Vlaeminck
5) Freddy Maertens

I guess Tom Boonen would be sixth? Quite surprising not to see him here.

Definitely not. For 5th and 6th I doubted between Maertens and Van Steenbergen. So Van Steenbergen (3x wc, 1x msr, 2x rvv, 1x p-r, 2x FW,...) is 6th. I also rate Museeuw and Schotte higher than Boonen. Then there are guys like Sylvere Maes and Lucien Buysse who both won the Tour twice (but not much else), Germain Derycke and Walter Godefroot who lack the world title but were certainly no worse one day racers than Boonen (in an era with more competition). So, in my opinion Boonen hovers around somewhere in the lower parts of the top10.

I don't get how people keep saying this. The level today is 1000 times higher.

Not the level per se, but the competition is much larger. It's become a global sport, something that still wasn't the case in the 70s. I still stand by my ranking (page 2 or 3). I also rate Boonen higher than Museeuw.

 

[Jungle Cycle]

Re: Re:

Brasil, i know, nothing compare to extremely more traditional countries;
1- Mauro Ribeiro, 1 Tour stage(my avatar)
2- Murilo Fisher, did everything out there, tour, giro, vuelta, classics, WRC, olympics, with lots of `almost`, road captain and so on...
3- Anesio Argenton (track)
4- Pagliarini
5- Adriato

It's quite astonishing that Fischer has a year-end CQ ranking top 10 to his name.

yes.. he has a lot of respect from everyone.. and he "vanish" here..
so much knowledge in a country with so much need of experience and good examples..
i still hope he can find motivation to share his knowladge training, tv or even in a book..