Rate the 2024 Tour de France

[Ulle97]

It will be hard to get a Tour better than 2012.

 

[OlavEH]

It will be hard to get a Tour better than 2012.

Worst Tour in the last 20+ years.

 

[Valv.Piti]

Re time limit, I think it was absolutely laughable this year. I think they extended it on three seperate stages. If you can't make the cut, youre out.. simple as. Always leaves a sour taste in my mouth when these rules are extended or even not reinforced because a large group of riders are abusing the system. I think thats a very legitimate critic of the race and the direction of the race. -1 for that!

 

[red_flanders]

How can anyone rate 1-3 this Tour? I am not saying this Tour was incredible but they really think this was close to the level of 2012 Giro or 2012 Tour? This Tour was way better than 2021, 2020, 2019, 2018, 2017, 2016, 2015, 2014. In the last 10 years, only 2 Tours were better...

Things which are criticized without fail, every year, to the point it's usually not worth responding:

• Team and rider tactics
• Course and stage design
• Quality of this year's Tour

 

[Valv.Piti]

Think course and stage design is very much worth discussing/responding to or whatever. Commentators say riders make the race, but fail to also say that the riders cannot make the race without a route to do it on. So it should be the route designer's main objective to actually give the riders reasons to race and a proper course to do that one so they at least can say "well, we did that we had to do, the riders didn't". ASO has been quite successfull lately, but them moaning about boring flat stages mostly falls back on themselves in this year's TdF. People pointed that out quite early, so it was really was not to the surprise of many in here that it panned out the way it did.

Rest of the route was no problem as was evidenced.

 

[red_flanders]

Think course and stage design is very much worth discussing/responding to or whatever. Commentators say riders make the race, but fail to also say that the riders cannot make the race without a route to do it on. So it should be the route designer's main objective to actually give the riders reasons to race and a proper course to do that one so they at least can say "well, we did that we had to do, the riders didn't". ASO has been quite successfull lately, but them moaning about boring flat stages mostly falls back on themselves in this year's TdF. People pointed that out quite early, so it was really was not to the surprise of many in here that it panned out the way it did.

Rest of the route was no problem as was evidenced.

There is no course that someone, usually many someones, won’t complain about. I’m not saying it’s not a topic for discussion, I’m saying that the level of moaning about tactics, course design, and the race overall is way overdone, and often fairly detached from a realistic view of what the teams, riders, or course designers really are trying to accomplish.

 

[Bolder]

Think course and stage design is very much worth discussing/responding to or whatever. Commentators say riders make the race, but fail to also say that the riders cannot make the race without a route to do it on. So it should be the route designer's main objective to actually give the riders reasons to race and a proper course to do that one so they at least can say "well, we did that we had to do, the riders didn't". ASO has been quite successfull lately, but them moaning about boring flat stages mostly falls back on themselves in this year's TdF. People pointed that out quite early, so it was really was not to the surprise of many in here that it panned out the way it did.

Rest of the route was no problem as was evidenced.

The problem, as I see it, is the insistence on sprint stages. If you want big strong riders to push 1500 watts in a bunch sprint, then you just can't have a hard, hilly or "interesting" stage before that. The two are incompatible. Either you say, OK Dylan Groenewegen, we don't have a place for you anymore and someone like Ghirmay is now the minimum climbing level allowed; or you go for kermesse stages to at least give the fans something to see besides a quiet toodle for 150 km. Ofc echelons/crosswinds are something else but that is largely unpredictable until the day of. ,

 

[Netserk]

There is no course that someone, usually many someones, won’t complain about. I’m not saying it’s not a topic for discussion, I’m saying that the level of moaning about tactics, course design, and the race overall is way overdone, and often fairly detached from a realistic view of what the teams, riders, or course designers really are trying to accomplish.

The moaning about the moaning is worse as it's usually without any substantial points. Just moaning.

 

[fbjim]

You & I remember those Tours very differently.

2003 - there was zero contest. The only element of doubt was Lance being Lance and not going full gas
2007 - Rasmussen was dominating quite easily until his holiday antics were revealed to the world
2011 - A fourth rate climber holding yellow for half the race because Evans & Schleck were afraid to go for it because they wanted their teams to have it easy until the final mountain stage.

yeah no.

It is difficult to rate the Tour sometimes because the quality of the GC battle can be very different in-the-moment, versus in retrospect.

I've made this comparison before, but take the 2022 race. Even before the final stage to Hautacam, people were still giving Pogacar a good chance of winning, despite the fact that he did not (and would not) drop Vingegaard on any single stage. Why? Because people remembered 2020 and 2021, and thought he could still destroy the TT, or had another stage like Le Grand-Bornand in him.

Looking at it in retrospect, it obviously was not close, but that doesn't speak to how it was perceived at the time. Just like this year - people thought Vingegaard could pull a Combloux/Granon out of the bag and it didn't happen, and if you look at it coldly, he had, if anything, been looking less and less strong as the race went on - but we all remember the Vingegaard who destroyed Pogacar on Granon/Hautacam/Combloux/Corchevel and thought he still might show up.

Does this mean it's wrong to rate Tours because people "incorrectly" perceived it to be closer than it was? Of course not - this is a subjective poll, and it's fine to rate things on how much you enjoyed them.

 

[red_flanders]

The moaning about the moaning is worse as it's usually without any substantial points. Just moaning.

And the moaning about the moaning about the moaning?

 

[Netserk]

And the moaning about the moaning about the moaning?

You wouldn't expect anything else from a moaner like me.

 

[fbjim]

if you want a stage design moan, i am still mad the one GT stage that i was most excited about last year, the one that i thought had the best parcours and best opportunities to tear up the race, totally sucked.

come on guys. you can't make this one interesting????

 

[tobydawq]

Re time limit, I think it was absolutely laughable this year. I think they extended it on three seperate stages. If you can't make the cut, youre out.. simple as. Always leaves a sour taste in my mouth when these rules are extended or even not reinforced because a large group of riders are abusing the system. I think thats a very legitimate critic of the race and the direction of the race. -1 for that!

Seriously?

If such a whatever thing can cost a whole point, then all Grand Tours would score 0.

 

[tobydawq]

The moaning about the moaning is worse as it's usually without any substantial points. Just moaning.

No it isn't.

 

[fbjim]

Think course and stage design is very much worth discussing/responding to or whatever. Commentators say riders make the race, but fail to also say that the riders cannot make the race without a route to do it on. So it should be the route designer's main objective to actually give the riders reasons to race and a proper course to do that one so they at least can say "well, we did that we had to do, the riders didn't". ASO has been quite successfull lately, but them moaning about boring flat stages mostly falls back on themselves in this year's TdF. People pointed that out quite early, so it was really was not to the surprise of many in here that it panned out the way it did.

Rest of the route was no problem as was evidenced.

frankly i think the solution is just to expand the field and add two more legitimately tiny teams that will be happy to do the breaks.

though as far as problems in the Tour de France goes, "the sprint stages were even more boring than usual" is not high on my list, as i solved this problem in a very simple way: i didn't watch most of the sprint stages

 

[tobydawq]

And the moaning about the moaning about the moaning?

Also terrible.

Only the moaning about the moaning (and the appraisal of the moaning about the moaning) are good.

 

[tobydawq]

frankly i think the solution is just to expand the field and add two more legitimately tiny teams that will be happy to do the breaks.

though as far as problems in the Tour de France goes, "the sprint stages were even more boring than usual" is not high on my list, as i solved this problem in a very simple way: i didn't watch most of the sprint stages

I did the same (apart from the final 20 something kilometers) but that hardly means it shouldn't be considered.

 

[Netserk]

Also terrible.

Only the moaning about the moaning (and the appraisal of the moaning about the moaning) are good.

C'mon, toby. I know you can moan louder than that. MOAN!

 

[fbjim]

I did the same (apart from the final 20 something kilometers) but that hardly means it shouldn't be considered.

i mean, the thing is, that this was pretty much a normal way to follow the Tour de France until relatively recently.

i don't think it's a coincidence that the ASO's current era of experimentation and tweaking with TDF parcours roughly coincides with the beginning of full-stage coverage being the norm (2016, i think?)

 

[tobydawq]

C'mon, toby. I know you can moan louder than that. MOAN!

REPORTED for BAITING!

 

[DarkBlue]

Surely a simple way to reduce the viewer boredom of these flat sprint stages is to add some additional intermediate sprint points, or introduce a totally separate competition like the InterGiro for the intermediate sprints with a decent prize pot - that will at least encourage some riders to get away in a break. The only way to incentivise this is to add a decent cash pot for winning an intermediate sprint, and the intermediate competition.

 

[velaso montador]

Not everyone believes the Tour should be an actual race.

Yet you watch it, what does that make you?

 

[velaso montador]

Ill give this tour a 9/10.

Best competition in ages also less major crashes, Cav win, Girmay, Bardet won in his last Tour. Really good had it all.

Minus was Roglic crash and 2 sprint stages to many besides that the course was really good too. Had it all.

 

[Zoetemelk-fan]

if you want a stage design moan, i am still mad the one GT stage that i was most excited about last year, the one that i thought had the best parcours and best opportunities to tear up the race, totally sucked.

come on guys. you can't make this one interesting????

Yes the riders surely can if state of affairs regarding present situation both GC wise and other competitions, stages up to and stages ahead.

This is the main reason why I have chuckled inwardly with a barely hidden smile when people here on the forum for the last +20 years (also with the old forum before 2009) have set up completely explosive sawtooths profile of inihilating stage designs and it then ends up in, for them, a disappointing no contest.

It is called race logics.

Now I have written it once and for all and am crawling back into the hole again regarding this topic. It's been +15 years since I got over it like a nest of flies, now I can be indulgent.

 

[Izzyeviel]

Yet you watch it, what does that make you?

You misunderstood me. I was giving an answer to someone elses question, its not my belief - which is riders should be trying their best on every stage. Guys who can win several stages should try to do so, not take it easy for 19 stages & wait for the final time trial.