Riis on Contador's & Schleck's Relative Strength

[mr. tibbs]

Nor did Riis know whether Schleck’s attack on the Port de Bales would have been successful, had his chain not come off. “I’m not sure because Contador was on his way back to Andy,” said Riis. “To be honest, I don’t really see one of them [as being] stronger than the other on the climbs.”

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/riis-preaches-calm-in-aftermath-of-schlecks-disappointment

While I would have like to have seen Contador wait, I think it's a bit disingenuous to suggest that Schleck is stronger. Not even Riis did that, but a lot of posters on the forum are.

Schleck didn't lose the Tour over this. He would have needed at least an additional minute over Contador to even have a chance in the TT, and, as Riis points out, Contador was on his way back up when Schleck dropped his chain. The attack wasn't sticking, and the two riders are, at best, even in the mountains.

Sorry to create another thread for this, but the idea that Schleck is stronger and/or will now lose the Tour over this has kind of invaded every thread on the subject. So one stone: several birds.

Word.

 

[hrotha]

Agreed. Furthermore, I don't see why the point was brought up at all in a discussion about whether or not Contador should have waited.

Andy needs lots of time. About the only tactic that could work would be attacking right from the base of the Tourmalet and going all out for the whole climb until he breaks. Not sure who that "he" would refer to though.

Well, that, or Riis could finally try something different tomorrow, instead of his usual "wait for x kilometer in stage y and see if that works out somehow".

 

[scribe]

Agreed. Furthermore, I don't see why the point was brought up at all in a discussion about whether or not Contador should have waited.

Andy needs lots of time. About the only tactic that could work would be attacking right from the base of the Tourmalet and going all out for the whole climb until he breaks. Not sure who that "he" would refer to though.

Well, that, or Riis could finally try something different tomorrow, instead of his usual "wait for x kilometer in stage y and see if that works out somehow".

It's time to go ahead and move away from this debate. The tour is over. Everyone knows this. AS cannot replace that time and he was trying to build on it to give AC a run in the ITT. Nothing is changing the decisive outcome today.

 

[The Hitch]

As was mentioned by others, i think Riis words are partialy influenced by his being upset that the Schlecks are leaving him.

 

[boardhanger]

About Time

............im glad that the race is now spiced up. With actual malice now comming to the fore. This handbags at 10 paces style of racing is over. All men for themselves. A.C saying he didn't see it ?? Yeah right. You did see it, you made the decision to attack. I neither agree nor disagree with your decision. Yet it shows you're concerned about A.S Bring on the mountains lets race no friends style. Enough of the chit-chat A.C has no morals when it comes to racing. The Spanish will banned together time and time again to keep one of their own in the lead as history has proven time and time again. Lets get it on.

p.s isn't it great to see racing other than the last climb style which was so dominant the past decade?

 

[131313]

Word.

Word indeed.

When he loses 3 minutes in the final TT, this will be forgotten. Except for the fact that he may lose second place to Menchov.

Then we can talk about what a bad guy the Russki is for stealing second from the nice English-speaking white dude.

 

[131313]

It's time to go ahead and move away from this debate. The tour is over.

The tour was over when AS didn't attack early enough to actually gain time. He needed another 1:30 minimum today, and there was no way he was going to get that today.

Even if he did shift his bike better, he'd have put no time on AC today.

 

[scribe]

Word indeed.

When he loses 3 minutes in the final TT, this will be forgotten. Except for the fact that he may lose second place to Menchov.

Then we can talk about what a bad guy the Russki is for stealing second from the nice English-speaking white dude.

yeah. That's when Contador goes ahead and 'wins' this again. Sort of like celebrated victory twice.

 

[scribe]

The tour was over when AS didn't attack early enough to actually gain time. He needed another 1:30 minimum today, and there was no way he was going to get that today.

Even if he did shift his bike better, he'd have put no time on AC today.

Well. Congratulations on the win! Maybe Shrek can work harder next year to beat Contador.

 

[greenhulk]

............im glad that the race is now spiced up. With actual malice now comming to the fore. This handbags at 10 paces style of racing is over. All men for themselves. A.C saying he didn't see it ?? Yeah right. You did see it, you made the decision to attack. I neither agree nor disagree with your decision. Yet it shows you're concerned about A.S Bring on the mountains lets race no friends style. Enough of the chit-chat A.C has no morals when it comes to racing. The Spanish will banned together time and time again to keep one of their own in the lead as history has proven time and time again. Lets get it on.

p.s isn't it great to see racing other than the last climb style which was so dominant the past decade?

Great post on all accounts!

 

[Eyeballs Out]

If the Tour was already over it's all the more disappointing that he didn't wait

Schleck's last attack today was very well timed but doomed to failure really with the descent to come and everyone chasing behind. There didn't really seem to be a plan once he'd run out of Saxos

 

[boardhanger]

A.C will not take 1.30 outa A.S in this timeTrial. I garrantee it. A.S has improve immensly this year compared to last. A.C on the other hand seems to have slipped.

 

[jaylew]

If the Tour was already over it's all the more disappointing that he didn't wait

Schleck's last attack today was very well timed but doomed to failure really with the descent to come and everyone chasing behind. There didn't really seem to be a plan once he'd run out of Saxos

Have to agree with this. Good timing in the sense that he caught AC napping but it was WAY too late.

 

[boardhanger]

If the Tour was already over it's all the more disappointing that he didn't wait

Schleck's last attack today was very well timed but doomed to failure really with the descent to come and everyone chasing behind. There didn't really seem to be a plan once he'd run out of Saxos

Well saxo did get rid of Navvaro and the rest of Astana. That was the plan I think.

 

[scribe]

If the Tour was already over it's all the more disappointing that he didn't wait

Schleck's last attack today was very well timed but doomed to failure really with the descent to come and everyone chasing behind. There didn't really seem to be a plan once he'd run out of Saxos

I am not sure what the race status was like up the road, but AC showed that a lead can be maintained if not built during a run-in finish. If someone was up the road that Shrek could have grabbed onto ahead of AC, there is no reason to think he couldn't have held onto it.

 

[scribe]

Well saxo did get rid of Navvaro and the rest of Astana. That was the plan I think.

They didn't exactly get rid of Vino, but that didn't really much matter to the outcome of today anyhow.

 

[mr. tibbs]

A.C will not take 1.30 outa A.S in this timeTrial. I garrantee it. A.S has improve immensly this year compared to last. A.C on the other hand seems to have slipped.

Schleck lost 40 seconds to Contador in the 9km prologue. The final TT is 52km. I don't think that bodes well for Schleck.

 

[erader]

Well. Congratulations on the win! Maybe Shrek can work harder next year to beat Contador.

i certainly hope AS doesn't quit like you do. holy cow man .

erader

 

[scribe]

Schleck lost 40 seconds to Contador in the 9km prologue. The final TT is 52km. I don't think that bodes well for Schleck.

Shrek had better worry more about his podium finish at this point. Contador is far and away the winner. Amazing what a moment in a stage of a 3 week race can bring.

 

[scribe]

i certainly hope AS doesn't quit like you do. holy cow man .

erader

You really think he is coming back??

 

[greenhulk]

Schleck lost 40 seconds to Contador in the 9km prologue. The final TT is 52km. I don't think that bodes well for Schleck.

You really can't go on prologue in terms of evaluating 3 week performance. It's certainly not uncommon to be blocked up first day before long race.

 

[boardhanger]

Schleck lost 40 seconds to Contador in the 9km prologue. The final TT is 52km. I don't think that bodes well for Schleck.

A rain soaked prolouge at the begining of the TDf. Yet up untill todays mechanical he was 31 seconds ahead....mmmmh that makes 71 seconds???

 

[jaylew]

I am not sure what the race status was like up the road, but AC showed that a lead can be maintained if not built during a run-in finish. If someone was up the road that Shrek could have grabbed onto ahead of AC, there is no reason to think he couldn't have held onto it.

No chance. Think about it, Scribe:

SS, AC, DM, and everyone else waits. Andy takes FOREVER to fix his change. He rejoins even further up the mountain. Even if he does launch a succesfull attack immediately after rejoining the group that just waited (extremely doubtful), there is even less time to put any real distance on the group before the descent. Even if you don't believe that AC was about to be right on his wheel, Vino was certainly there. With any tiny gain he would have gotten, there is absolutely no way he stays away from a motivated Vino/Sanchez led-group on the descent. He was already caught on the descent by Vino, and anyone he would have caught would have only sat on.

No time was ever going to be made up by Schleck today. The seconds he lost are another story.

 

[Obeeone]

AC has to win a stage.. and/or completely ace the ITT and this will be behind him. I still feel he was/is waiting for the Tourmalet...

 

[scribe]

No chance. Think about it, Scribe:

SS, AC, DM, and everyone else waits. Andy takes FOREVER to fix his change. He rejoins even further up the mountain. Even if he does launch a succesfull attack immediately after rejoining the group that just waited (extremely doubtful), there is even less time to put any real distance on the group before the descent. Even if you don't believe that AC was about to be right on his wheel, Vino was certainly there. With any tiny gain he would have gotten, there is absolutely no way he stays away from a motivated Vino/Sanchez led-group on the descent. He was already caught on the descent by Vino, and anyone he would have caught would have only sat on.

No time was ever going to be made up by Schleck today. The seconds he lost are another story.

The discussion above was whether AS could have built on and maintained a lead without his mechanical. I think he could have assuming he got onto one of the guys up the road. The point was not about him re-attacking if the crew had waited for him to get back on his bike to race.