Roger Clemens Trial

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benzwire said:
Clemens' legacy is forever tarnished, regardless of the outcome.
Not true. Guy was awesome when it was possible to compete without PEDs. PEDs extented his career, that's all. Government didn't belong in this business.
 
Aug 13, 2009
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JRTinMA said:
Not true. Guy was awesome when it was possible to compete without PEDs. PEDs extented his career, that's all. Government didn't belong in this business.
You do realize legacy is more then just W/L record right?

He will forever be remembered as a doping ******bag
 

college

BANNED
Jun 10, 2012
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Race Radio said:
You do realize legacy is more then just W/L record right?

He will forever be remembered as a doping ******bag
wrong answer. The final buzzer sounded and guess what. The Rocket got scoreboard. Rocket wins.
Same if Lance went up against the Fed's. So sad to be on the beach brah. ;)
 
JRTinMA said:
Not true. Guy was awesome when it was possible to compete without PEDs. PEDs extented his career, that's all. Government didn't belong in this business.
Even if he didn't use steroids or other illegal means to enhance his pitching when he was in Boston or Toronto, why would it be ok for him to do so in his later years?? See, the problem with some of you guys defending the cheats is that you don't realize that this sort of 'it's ok to dope, just don't get caught...' sends a bad message and it totally ruins the fairness of sport and working hard.

As far as Clemens is concerned, I really had no doubt about the outcome. The feds never stood a chance. Knowing our justice system, and how it's been dealing with various, high profile, court cases in the last decade, it wasn't a surprise. In fact, it would have been a shocker had he been found guilty. Money has been ruling our world for many decades now, and generally speaking, if you have the money and the right people and resources around you, you can pretty much get away with anything. I expect the same with the other Texan.
 
Aug 13, 2009
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college said:
wrong answer. The final buzzer sounded and guess what. The Rocket got scoreboard. Rocket wins.
Same if Lance went up against the Fed's. So sad to be on the beach brah. ;)
Scoreboard? Dude wasted millions and people now think he is scum. Only a feeder fish would call that scoreboard

Feds? Are you referring to the Qui Tam case. Do you really think Wonderboy is going to have "Scoreboard" in that? Or against USADA?
 
Feb 4, 2012
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BullsFan22 said:
Even if he didn't use steroids or other illegal means to enhance his pitching when he was in Boston or Toronto, why would it be ok for him to do so in his later years?? See, the problem with some of you guys defending the cheats is that you don't realize that this sort of 'it's ok to dope, just don't get caught...' sends a bad message and it totally ruins the fairness of sport and working hard.
Exactly right. Not to mention that by "extending his career" in such a fasion he's screwing someone else out of a job. Hardly a victimless crime.
 
Jun 15, 2012
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Man I don't see many parallels in this case and armstrong.

I see more parallels in the Sandusky case then I do the Clemons case. It's almost impossible to defend a client when you have more then 3 eyewitnesses. You can pick apart motive for a few people but you can't pick apart 10. Clemons case only had a couple of sketchy eye witnesses, one of whom gave really poor testimony for the prosecution. I would see a major connection in these cases if the only 2 witnesses were Hamilton and Landis.

For the US cycling world it will only take Hincapie...for the general public it might take a few more which they have. I still bet Jeff Notviksi (SIC) has ulcers over the dismissal of his case...
 
Aug 13, 2009
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PosterBill said:
Man I don't see many parallels in this case and armstrong.

I see more parallels in the Sandusky case then I do the Clemons case. It's almost impossible to defend a client when you have more then 3 eyewitnesses. You can pick apart motive for a few people but you can't pick apart 10. Clemons case only had a couple of sketchy eye witnesses, one of whom gave really poor testimony for the prosecution. I would see a major connection in these cases if the only 2 witnesses were Hamilton and Landis.

For the US cycling world it will only take Hincapie...for the general public it might take a few more which they have. I still bet Jeff Notviksi (SIC) has ulcers over the dismissal of his case...
Wow! PosterBill hits it out of the park!

The Sandusky case is good analogy, after all lance was named after a pedophile
 
May 19, 2012
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college said:
wrong answer. The final buzzer sounded and guess what. The Rocket got scoreboard. Rocket wins.
Same if Lance went up against the Fed's. So sad to be on the beach brah. ;)
Good Lord? You wouldn't happen to read your boys facebook page?

http://www.facebook.com/lancearmstrong

Dave McClintock Sue their asses Lance. I know organizations like theirs have been historically immune to suits, but if anyone has a case to make them accountable for basing such high-impact decisions on hard irrefutable evidence, it's you.

The comments of the Kool Aid drinkers are quite embarrassing.

Who's running the day to day operations of the cult these days?
 
Apr 7, 2009
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PosterBill said:
Man I don't see many parallels in this case and armstrong.

I see more parallels in the Sandusky case then I do the Clemons case. It's almost impossible to defend a client when you have more then 3 eyewitnesses. You can pick apart motive for a few people but you can't pick apart 10. Clemons case only had a couple of sketchy eye witnesses, one of whom gave really poor testimony for the prosecution. I would see a major connection in these cases if the only 2 witnesses were Hamilton and Landis.

For the US cycling world it will only take Hincapie...for the general public it might take a few more which they have. I still bet Jeff Notviksi (SIC) has ulcers over the dismissal of his case...
Hmm....dopers convicting dopers. Sound familiar???

Once again, this all happened under USADA's watch for over 10 years according to their 'letter'. Who's going to take responsibility for letting it happen?
 
Aug 13, 2009
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mwbyrd said:
Once again, this all happened under USADA's watch for over 10 years according to their 'letter'.
Really, How does that work? WADA was only in charge of testing lance for 6 months of his first career and 2 years of his second. How do you come up with 10?

If you want to blame someone for ignoring the obvious the UCI is your best bet
 
Race Radio said:
Scoreboard? Dude wasted millions and people now think he is scum. Only a feeder fish would call that scoreboard

Feds? Are you referring to the Qui Tam case. Do you really think Wonderboy is going to have "Scoreboard" in that? Or against USADA?
I realize you tent up every time lance is mentioned but can you keep him out of a clemens thread please.
 
BullsFan22 said:
Even if he didn't use steroids or other illegal means to enhance his pitching when he was in Boston or Toronto, why would it be ok for him to do so in his later years?? See, the problem with some of you guys defending the cheats is that you don't realize that this sort of 'it's ok to dope, just don't get caught...' sends a bad message and it totally ruins the fairness of sport and working hard.

As far as Clemens is concerned, I really had no doubt about the outcome. The feds never stood a chance. Knowing our justice system, and how it's been dealing with various, high profile, court cases in the last decade, it wasn't a surprise. In fact, it would have been a shocker had he been found guilty. Money has been ruling our world for many decades now, and generally speaking, if you have the money and the right people and resources around you, you can pretty much get away with anything. I expect the same with the other Texan.
Never said it was ok, Roger did what he had to do in a game where the hitters were doped to the gills. It extended his career into the doping era, you would have to be pretty narrow minded to look at Roger and see only a doper. He was one of the most dominating and exciting pitchers in the game, way before he took his first PED.
 
JRTinMA said:
Never said it was ok, Roger did what he had to do in a game where the hitters were doped to the gills. It extended his career into the doping era, you would have to be pretty narrow minded to look at Roger and see only a doper. He was one of the most dominating and exciting pitchers in the game, way before he took his first PED.
What makes you think you have any idea when he took his first PED?
 
Hugh Januss said:
What makes you think you have any idea when he took his first PED?
Roger was recently on trial for perjury. In that trial the prosecution established a timeline related to their belief that Clemens used performance enhancing drugs. You have the obvious body changes as well and of course much has been written about the "beginning" of the steroid era.
 
Aug 13, 2009
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JRTinMA said:
I realize you tent up every time lance is mentioned but can you keep him out of a clemens thread please.
I realize you are obsessed with me but even you must see that I did not bring him into this thread.

try to stay on topic and not high jack another thread with your personal vendetta's

Thanks
 
BotanyBay said:
Jury in love. Only Boston fans disliked Clemans.
I'm not sure who this Clemans is but I will take your word for it that he/she is disliked here.

Regarding Clemens, any "dislike" if thats what it really is in sport, was washed away with two World Series wins. He was given standing ovations upon many of his later returns to town. In fact, in todays Globe is an article suggesting he belongs in the Hall, hardly a sentiment of dislike and shared by many. He belongs in the Hall because he was an incredible pitcher before PEDs came into play.

As far as Jury in love, well you have that wrong too. The prosecution failed because their star witness was not credible. Hey that sounds familiar to another recent case...

http://www.boston.com/sports/touching_all_the_bases/2012/06/roger_clemens_1.html
 
Race Radio said:
I realize you are obsessed with me but even you must see that I did not bring him into this thread.

try to stay on topic and not high jack another thread with your personal vendetta's

Thanks
Hey, I see you how you turned around obsession on me, good one Race! You responded and kept it going and you know better, just curb your obsession and keep it in the LA thread, k?
 

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