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benzwire said:Clemens' legacy is forever tarnished, regardless of the outcome.
JRTinMA said:Not true. Guy was awesome when it was possible to compete without PEDs. PEDs extented his career, that's all. Government didn't belong in this business.
Race Radio said:You do realize legacy is more then just W/L record right?
He will forever be remembered as a doping ******bag
Race Radio said:You do realize legacy is more then just W/L record right?
He will forever be remembered as a doping ******bag
JRTinMA said:Not true. Guy was awesome when it was possible to compete without PEDs. PEDs extented his career, that's all. Government didn't belong in this business.
college said:wrong answer. The final buzzer sounded and guess what. The Rocket got scoreboard. Rocket wins.
Same if Lance went up against the Fed's. So sad to be on the beach brah.
Exactly right. Not to mention that by "extending his career" in such a fasion he's screwing someone else out of a job. Hardly a victimless crime.BullsFan22 said:Even if he didn't use steroids or other illegal means to enhance his pitching when he was in Boston or Toronto, why would it be ok for him to do so in his later years?? See, the problem with some of you guys defending the cheats is that you don't realize that this sort of 'it's ok to dope, just don't get caught...' sends a bad message and it totally ruins the fairness of sport and working hard.
PosterBill said:Man I don't see many parallels in this case and armstrong.
I see more parallels in the Sandusky case then I do the Clemons case. It's almost impossible to defend a client when you have more then 3 eyewitnesses. You can pick apart motive for a few people but you can't pick apart 10. Clemons case only had a couple of sketchy eye witnesses, one of whom gave really poor testimony for the prosecution. I would see a major connection in these cases if the only 2 witnesses were Hamilton and Landis.
For the US cycling world it will only take Hincapie...for the general public it might take a few more which they have. I still bet Jeff Notviksi (SIC) has ulcers over the dismissal of his case...
college said:wrong answer. The final buzzer sounded and guess what. The Rocket got scoreboard. Rocket wins.
Same if Lance went up against the Fed's. So sad to be on the beach brah.
PosterBill said:Man I don't see many parallels in this case and armstrong.
I see more parallels in the Sandusky case then I do the Clemons case. It's almost impossible to defend a client when you have more then 3 eyewitnesses. You can pick apart motive for a few people but you can't pick apart 10. Clemons case only had a couple of sketchy eye witnesses, one of whom gave really poor testimony for the prosecution. I would see a major connection in these cases if the only 2 witnesses were Hamilton and Landis.
For the US cycling world it will only take Hincapie...for the general public it might take a few more which they have. I still bet Jeff Notviksi (SIC) has ulcers over the dismissal of his case...
Race Radio said:You do realize legacy is more then just W/L record right?
He will forever be remembered as a doping ******bag
mwbyrd said:Once again, this all happened under USADA's watch for over 10 years according to their 'letter'.
Race Radio said:Scoreboard? Dude wasted millions and people now think he is scum. Only a feeder fish would call that scoreboard
Feds? Are you referring to the Qui Tam case. Do you really think Wonderboy is going to have "Scoreboard" in that? Or against USADA?
BullsFan22 said:Even if he didn't use steroids or other illegal means to enhance his pitching when he was in Boston or Toronto, why would it be ok for him to do so in his later years?? See, the problem with some of you guys defending the cheats is that you don't realize that this sort of 'it's ok to dope, just don't get caught...' sends a bad message and it totally ruins the fairness of sport and working hard.
As far as Clemens is concerned, I really had no doubt about the outcome. The feds never stood a chance. Knowing our justice system, and how it's been dealing with various, high profile, court cases in the last decade, it wasn't a surprise. In fact, it would have been a shocker had he been found guilty. Money has been ruling our world for many decades now, and generally speaking, if you have the money and the right people and resources around you, you can pretty much get away with anything. I expect the same with the other Texan.
JRTinMA said:Never said it was ok, Roger did what he had to do in a game where the hitters were doped to the gills. It extended his career into the doping era, you would have to be pretty narrow minded to look at Roger and see only a doper. He was one of the most dominating and exciting pitchers in the game, way before he took his first PED.
Hugh Januss said:What makes you think you have any idea when he took his first PED?
JRTinMA said:I realize you tent up every time lance is mentioned but can you keep him out of a clemens thread please.
BotanyBay said:Jury in love. Only Boston fans disliked Clemans.
Race Radio said:I realize you are obsessed with me but even you must see that I did not bring him into this thread.
try to stay on topic and not high jack another thread with your personal vendetta's
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