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Rough Attempt at an All-Time Ranking

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So it's just you, yet you don't see why it doesn't go without saying?
I’m surprised it doesn’t go without saying that expressing surprise that it doesn’t go without saying implies the alteration of a previously held belief (e.g., the belief that surely no one would argue Valverde’s consistently good results would make him greater than cyclists like Froome with superior peak seasons) based on new evidence (e.g., reading the shocking number of posts advocating for Valverde’s position as greatest of the 21st century), with “that’s just me” reinforcing the newfound realization that the belief does not in fact go without saying. But that’s just me. :)
 
I’m surprised it doesn’t go without saying that expressing surprise that it doesn’t go without saying implies the alteration of a previously held belief (e.g., the belief that surely no one would argue Valverde’s consistently good results would make him greater than cyclists like Froome with superior peak seasons) based on new evidence (e.g., reading the shocking number of posts advocating for Valverde’s position as greatest of the 21st century), with “that’s just me” reinforcing the newfound realization that the belief does not in fact go without saying. But that’s just me. :)
:p

That said, I don't think Froome had better seasons than Valverde, necessarily (okay, a Grand Tour double probably beats him). But Valverde has won the CQ Ranking five times so his huge amount of points is not a cumulation of many mediocre seasons, it's many top-notch seasons.
 
:p

That said, I don't think Froome had better seasons than Valverde, necessarily (okay, a Grand Tour double probably beats him). But Valverde has won the CQ Ranking five times so his huge amount of points is not a cumulation of many mediocre seasons, it's many top-notch seasons.

CQ Ranking, and other rankings, are a lot based on quantity ahead of quality.

Froome's best seasons?
2013: Tour de France, Dauphine, Romandie, Criterium International, Oman
2017: Tour de Fraance & Vuelta a Espana double

Valverde's best on CQ? It's 2014
Wins: San Sebastian, Fleche Wallonne, GP Indurain, Roma Maxima, Vuelta a Murcia, Vuelta a Andalucia

Do these matchup? No they don't.
 
:p

That said, I don't think Froome had better seasons than Valverde, necessarily (okay, a Grand Tour double probably beats him). But Valverde has won the CQ Ranking five times so his huge amount of points is not a cumulation of many mediocre seasons, it's many top-notch seasons.
Which of Valverde's seasons were better than any of Froome's Tour winning seasons? Or to ask in a different way, how would you rank the best seasons of Valverde? 2006, 2008, 2009, 2015, 2017 & 2018 are clearly the best (even if he scored the most points in 2014), but what order?
 
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Which of Valverde's seasons were better than any of Froome's Tour winning seasons? Or to ask in a different way, how would you rank the best seasons of Valverde? 2006, 2008, 2009, 2015, 2017 & 2018 are clearly the best (even if he scored the most points in 2014), but what order?
The night may be an hour longer but I'm not going to spend it ranking his seasons.

I will concede that he never had a better season than Froome's 2013 and 2017, or probably 2015 or 2016.

My post was more a criticism of his total being an accumulation of 20 seasons of a journeyman (which I realise was never quite said).
 
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Valverde also was #1 in the UCI Points/ProTour rankings 5 times. That's like winning a football league, not finishing 4th like earlier suggested.
It's not like winning a football league at all. Teams are specifically playing to win their league. Cyclists are not riding with the goal to finish first in overall rankings in points (It's possible icing on the cake, that's all).
 
CQ Ranking, and other rankings, are a lot based on quantity ahead of quality.

Froome's best seasons?
2013: Tour de France, Dauphine, Romandie, Criterium International, Oman
2017: Tour de Fraance & Vuelta a Espana double

Valverde's best on CQ? It's 2014
Wins: San Sebastian, Fleche Wallonne, GP Indurain, Roma Maxima, Vuelta a Murcia, Vuelta a Andalucia

Do these matchup? No they don't.
Yes they do.
Valverde 2014:
11 wins (Fleche Wallonne, San Sebastian, Spanish RR, Vuelta stage, Andalucia GC + 3 stages, Murica, Roma Maxima and GP Indurain).
Other noticeable results: 3rd at Vuelta GC, 4th at the Tour, 3rd at the WC RR, 2x2nd at the Monuments, 3rd at Strade.

Froome 2013:
13 wins (Tour GC + 3 stages, Dauphine GC + stage, Romandie GC + stage, Criterium International GC + stage, Oman GC + stage, Tirreno stage)
Other noticeable results: 2nd at Tirreno GC.

I'll give Froome the edge, but not very much. Valverde's season is also damn good. But Valverde had better seasons than this, like 2015 and 2018. His 2017 level was probably the highest he's ever had, it's a pitty about that crash.
 
Yes they do.
Valverde 2014:
11 wins (Fleche Wallonne, San Sebastian, Spanish RR, Vuelta stage, Andalucia GC + 3 stages, Murica, Roma Maxima and GP Indurain).
Other noticeable results: 3rd at Vuelta GC, 4th at the Tour, 3rd at the WC RR, 2x2nd at the Monuments, 3rd at Strade.

Froome 2013:
13 wins (Tour GC + 3 stages, Dauphine GC + stage, Romandie GC + stage, Criterium International GC + stage, Oman GC + stage, Tirreno stage)
Other noticeable results: 2nd at Tirreno GC.

I'll give Froome the edge, but not very much. Valverde's season is also damn good. But Valverde had better seasons than this, like 2015 and 2018. His 2017 level was probably the highest he's ever had, it's a pitty about that crash.
It really isn't close. Tour GC > Valverde's 11 wins put together (by quite a lot actually), 3 Tour stages + Dauphiné and Romandie GCs + second at Tirreno ≈ Valverde's seconds, thirds and fourths, and then we still have Froome's lower-tier wins to account for. If we disregard small races (and that's pretty reasonable imo), the gap only gets bigger. There's simply no way for a season that has Flèche Wallonne as its biggest win to compete with a season with a Tour win that has good supporting results.
 
I've said it before, but Palmares wise Fiorenzo Magni has to be one of the most underrated riders.
3 Giro wins and 3 RVV wins in a row , at least one top 3 result in every monument that he ever raced (he never raced lbl), multiple stage wins in both the Giro and the Tour. All that while racing in a stacked era that featured multiple atgs.
And a rider who became more famous for a GT he finished second in. Truly the Fignon of his time.
 
And Valverde's points totals were boosted by points given for pre-season friendlies played at home (Murcia, Andalucia, Valencia etc)
Nope. Only World/ProTour races counted in the first 3 seasons he won. The formula changed in 2015 to include all races, but he also won the separate WorldTour ranking that year, too.
Only in 2018 was he #1 in UCI Points but not the WorldTour; Valverde was 3rd that year.
 
I've said it before, but Palmares wise Fiorenzo Magni has to be one of the most underrated riders.
3 Giro wins and 3 RVV wins in a row , at least one top 3 result in every monument that he ever raced (he never raced lbl), multiple stage wins in both the Giro and the Tour. All that while racing in a stacked era that featured multiple atgs.
Plus he's the subject of probably the coolest photos in all of cycling... that's got to be worth another monument win.
 
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Here's an overview of the countries in the top 170, each time with the top 3. Italians have the advantage of a GT and many (semi-)classics in their own country.

41x Italy: Coppi, Bartali, Moser
32x Belgium: Merckx, De Vlaeminck, Van Looy
23x France: Hinault, Anquetil, Jalabert
18x Spain: Valverde, Induráin, Contador
9x Netherlands: Zoetemelk, Raas, Janssen
7x Switzerland: Cancellara, Rominger, Kübler
6x Germany: Zabel, Ullrich, Altig
4x UK: Froome, Cavendish, Wiggins
4x Luxembourg: Frantz, Gaul, Faber
3x Ireland: Kelly, Roche, Martin
3x Colombia: Quintana, Herrera, Bernal
3x Australia: Evans, Anderson, McEwen
3x Norway: Kristoff, Hushovd, Boasson Hagen
2x Slovenia: Roglič, Pogačar
2x Denmark: Sørensen, Fuglsang
2x Russia: Menchov, Tonkov
2x Portugal: Agostinho, Costa
1x Slovakia: Sagan
1x USA: LeMond
1x Kazachstan: Vinokourov
1x Poland: Kwiatkowski
1x Moldova: Tchmil
1x Ecuador: Carapaz
 
Here's an overview of the countries in the top 170, each time with the top 3. Italians have the advantage of a GT and many (semi-)classics in their own country.

41x Italy: Coppi, Bartali, Moser
32x Belgium: Merckx, De Vlaeminck, Van Looy
23x France: Hinault, Anquetil, Jalabert
18x Spain: Valverde, Induráin, Contador
9x Netherlands: Zoetemelk, Raas, Janssen
7x Switzerland: Cancellara, Rominger, Kübler
6x Germany: Zabel, Ullrich, Altig
4x UK: Froome, Cavendish, Wiggins
4x Luxembourg: Frantz, Gaul, Faber
3x Ireland: Kelly, Roche, Martin
3x Colombia: Quintana, Herrera, Bernal
3x Australia: Evans, Anderson, McEwen
3x Norway: Kristoff, Hushovd, Boasson Hagen
2x Slovenia: Roglič, Pogačar
2x Denmark: Sørensen, Fuglsang
2x Russia: Menchov, Tonkov
2x Portugal: Agostinho, Costa
1x Slovakia: Sagan
1x USA: LeMond
1x Kazachstan: Vinokourov
1x Poland: Kwiatkowski
1x Moldova: Tchmil
1x Ecuador: Carapaz
Embarrassing representation from the U.S.
 

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