Ryder Hesjedal Discussion Thread

[hscoach2]

Ryder, as great as he is, is not top 10 material in the big one. He is not that great. The tour is for the "great ones" which unfortunately Hyder is not, the Giro is not on the level of the tour, for instance, Basso could never win the tour. Look for Ryder to domestique for Vandevelde or for that guy Daniels.

Except for 2010, when he finished 6th, and was likely the 3rd or 4th strongest rider in the last week...and he started that tour not being the protected team leader.

I'm not saying he can win, but I think he has podium potential (whether that can happen after riding the Giro, who knows?), especially in a year with AC missing and AS in questionable form.

Full disclosure: I'm Canadian, and a mountain biker.

 

[BillytheKid]

The Horner discussion reminded me that Ryder was off the front solo going for the Sierra Hill stage of the Cali last year. Ryder impressed me that he hung in the second group on that stage finishing just behind Andy Schleck and Leipheimer after a huge effort off the front solo. That spoke volumes of his ability.

He might of won the stage if he followed the RS attack, but instead Vaughter's wasted the talent.

Winning the Giro of course is even bigger. I wish I would have seen more of it.

 

[vcampbell]

Wow, lots of hardcore Ryder fans here. I wonder if this is becoming a bandwagon.

Do vote for him to win the Tour here. I'd like to see how many forum members really believe he can do a Giro-Tour double, when even Contador couldn't pull it off:

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?t=17310

Looking for similarities between him and last years Contador shows me some stupidity. Why? Contador last year crashed in the first stage, lost many time, then he crashed again, also he rode one of the hardest Giro of all time. Then what are will talking about? This years Giro was way easier, with less attack.
And what happens if I vote there? Nothing. Why can't people believe in him? And if a massive crash comes again, like last year, and many favorites need to abandon? Or in a flat stage the peloton splits and he will be on the front? All of them can happen. In reality he is not a favorite to win, but was he in the Giro? And after we saw, that he can be strong in the moutains, then he can do it, he just need some luck.
Do you think that Voeckler is a top4 GC star? No, but he received 4 mins from the others.

 

[Eusebio Kino]

The Horner discussion reminded me that Ryder was off the front solo going for the Sierra Hill stage of the Cali last year. Ryder impressed me that he hung in the second group on that stage finishing just behind Andy Schleck and Leipheimer after a huge effort off the front solo. That spoke volumes of his ability.

He might of won the stage if he followed the RS attack, but instead Vaughter's wasted the talent.

Winning the Giro of course is even bigger. I wish I would have seen more of it.

Great talent Ryder, he showed it at Sierra last year. Radioshack hammered the field on a tough, tough course. Then he showed great in all races after that. A great talent, but still I would put him behind Nibali,Sammy Sanchez,
Greg Van Avermaet, etc. as far as class. Good luck to him, but what a waste of talent to have him doing domestique duties at this years tour for VandVelde, Martin,and that Danielson guy. Why have your top GC guy waste his time with a smaller race like Il Giro?

 

[rhubroma]

Great talent Ryder, he showed it at Sierra last year. Radioshack hammered the field on a tough, tough course. Then he showed great in all races after that. A great talent, but still I would put him behind Nibali,Sammy Sanchez,
Greg Van Avermaet, etc. as far as class. Good luck to him, but what a waste of talent to have him doing domestique duties at this years tour for VandVelde, Martin,and that Danielson guy. Why have your top GC guy waste his time with a smaller race like Il Giro?

It can't see how they'd "use" him before the pecking order is established, that is what the road dictates.

At first I thought him a bit weird in the Giro interviews, so, so inexpressive. But then his unassuming character started to win me over. Bon chance at the Tour.

 

[Dedelou]

It can't see how they'd "use" him before the pecking order is established, that is what the road dictates.

At first I thought him a bit weird in the Giro interviews, so, so inexpressive. But then his unassuming character started to win me over. Bon chance at the Tour.

I guess they enter the tour with a "multiple" leaders strategy and very soon will know who has to be the man to support. Ryder is the one who now has a GT title to his name and no matter what happens at this year TDF, nobody can't take that away from him.

 

[gustienordic]

I guess you believe Contador's talent is all natural then? Do you really think he was suspended for a near indetectable level of clenbuterol? Oh and AC is not here to prove your point. Arguably Ryder was still on his rise in 2010 and he managed 6 th after AC got popped. He just proved his work is paying dividends.

I am not calling Ryder the winner of le Tour either only that he is a lot more dangerous than he gets credit for and that if he starts the tour at a level he managed for the Giro he is a credible threat for the podium. Further, Garmin has to start the race in support of that chance. Should they hedge their bets? It would be the smart plan to hold either Christian or Tom in reserve for the mountains while measuring Ryder's chances in case Ryder is not as ready as he needs to be. Also with Ryder as leader at least on paper, it might open the door for another to capitalize on opportunity should it present itself.
3rd week of July is still a long way out

Careful on the clinic accusations... but I highly doubt Ryder will go as the protected leader for Garmin Basso is also doing the tour... as a super domestique for Nibbles.

 

[R_Wilki]

Ryder, as great as he is, is not top 10 material in the big one. He is not that great. The tour is for the "great ones" which unfortunately Hyder is not, the Giro is not on the level of the tour, for instance, Basso could never win the tour. Look for Ryder to domestique for Vandevelde or for that guy Daniels.

And the underestimating of Ryder continues. The fact is finished 6th in TdF 2010 with a team that was pretty weak on support after CVV went down. He finished 4th on the Turmalet stage that year behind only the very best riders. This year, wins Giro and also 9th at L-B-L. Plus has a potentially much stronger team around him if he is the GC guy with Tom D, CVV and others.

I peg him for a top 5 this year. It has nothing to do with him comparing him to AC and the TdF double The fact is that the overall field is pretty wide open. Wiggins and Cadel are the only guys that are showing consistency and peak form. Schleck & Menchov have not yet shown they're on form and they mayormaynot truly contend. The rest of the group (Sanchez, Nibali, Van den Broeck, etc) are not that much better than him that the small events that happen over three weeks can't equalize.

No he won't win but he is going to have a lot of doubters eating their words in my opinion.

 

[El Pistolero]

VDB2 is better than Hesjedal.

 

[Pentacycle]

And the underestimating of Ryder continues. The fact is finished 6th in TdF 2010 with a team that was pretty weak on support after CVV went down. He finished 4th on the Turmalet stage that year behind only the very best riders. This year, wins Giro and also 9th at L-B-L. Plus has a potentially much stronger team around him if he is the GC guy with Tom D, CVV and others.

I peg him for a top 5 this year. It has nothing to do with him comparing him to AC and the TdF double The fact is that the overall field is pretty wide open. Wiggins and Cadel are the only guys that are showing consistency and peak form. Schleck & Menchov have not yet shown they're on form and they mayormaynot truly contend. The rest of the group (Sanchez, Nibali, Van den Broeck, etc) are not that much better than him that the small events that happen over three weeks can't equalize.

No he won't win but he is going to have a lot of doubters eating their words in my opinion.

The problem is that Hesjedal hasn´t raced for a month between the Tour and the Giro. He has to ride himself into form, and in the first two TT´s he´ll problaly lose a lot of time. On top of that there is a big possibility of him cracking in the final week due to tiredness, like Contador on the Galibier. He can always surprise, maybe if half of the contenders don´t make it into the third week in peak form. Danielson should be the man for Garmin, he can ride a better 1st and 3rd week, and he can TT much better.

 

[Eusebio Kino]

And the underestimating of Ryder continues. The fact is finished 6th in TdF 2010 with a team that was pretty weak on support after CVV went down. He finished 4th on the Turmalet stage that year behind only the very best riders. This year, wins Giro and also 9th at L-B-L. Plus has a potentially much stronger team around him if he is the GC guy with Tom D, CVV and others.

I peg him for a top 5 this year. It has nothing to do with him comparing him to AC and the TdF double The fact is that the overall field is pretty wide open. Wiggins and Cadel are the only guys that are showing consistency and peak form. Schleck & Menchov have not yet shown they're on form and they mayormaynot truly contend. The rest of the group (Sanchez, Nibali, Van den Broeck, etc) are not that much better than him that the small events that happen over three weeks can't equalize.

No he won't win but he is going to have a lot of doubters eating their words in my opinion.

If Ryder breaks top 5 it will be awesome. Against the best of the best, excluding Contador, awesome stuff. Garmin has an awesome team. It will be fun to watch. Ryder is a smart rider.

 

[Gloin22]

VDB2 is better than Hesjedal.

Possibly, but he never won GT

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Which is exactly why Hesjedal was right to focus on the Giro.

I have been guilty of underestimating Hesjedal in the past, but given how unsuited the Tour route is to him (pulling out a career best TT to win a GC from Joaquím Rodríguez and Ivan Basso is one thing, beating Menchov, Evans and Wiggins over 50km is a completely different matter) and that unlike them he already has a Giro in his legs, top 5? Not convinced.

What you're saying there is, course-adjusted, he is as good as Contador. It is possible to be good at both - see Menchov in '08. But 2008 Menchov > 2012 Hesjedal, and Menchov didn't actually win the Giro. Yes, the Giro was raced timidly, but just as many underrate Hesjedal, saying he will top 5 is overrating him more than those who thought Evans could podium the 2010 Tour if not for injury.

Lower end of the top 10 at best. Especially on this route, Danielson should be Garmin's leader, with Hesjedal having a totally free role like Pellizotti had at Liquigas in '09.

 

[Dedelou]

Which is exactly why Hesjedal was right to focus on the Giro.

I have been guilty of underestimating Hesjedal in the past, but given how unsuited the Tour route is to him (pulling out a career best TT to win a GC from Joaquím Rodríguez and Ivan Basso is one thing, beating Menchov, Evans and Wiggins over 50km is a completely different matter) and that unlike them he already has a Giro in his legs, top 5? Not convinced.

What you're saying there is, course-adjusted, he is as good as Contador. It is possible to be good at both - see Menchov in '08. But 2008 Menchov > 2012 Hesjedal, and Menchov didn't actually win the Giro. Yes, the Giro was raced timidly, but just as many underrate Hesjedal, saying he will top 5 is overrating him more than those who thought Evans could podium the 2010 Tour if not for injury.

Lower end of the top 10 at best. Especially on this route, Danielson should be Garmin's leader, with Hesjedal having a totally free role like Pellizotti had at Liquigas in '09.

Agreed. With a totally free role he can at least show something that will make Garmin proud.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

With all due respect, but when you win the Giro in a battle of seconds against J-Rod, with a guy in 3rd place that didn't even prepare for the GC, it is rather telling. Both within 2 minutes of the winner. Could you imagine this podium at the Tour? Of course not.

Hesjedal made the right move by doing the Giro. And props to him and many congratulations. If only some others were as smart. But even if he hadn't ridden the Giro, i wouldn't peg him for a top 5 spot in the Tour (though i wouldn't think it were impossible), let alone after riding the Giro.

This has nothing to do with underestimating him. There just are plenty of other riders who are better and around his level.

 

[The Hitch]

Last time basso failed this bad at the giro, he came 2nd in the tour. be afraid

 

[karlboss]

Last time basso failed this bad at the giro, he came 2nd in the tour. be afraid

Nope, 4th en la vuelta

 

[cineteq]

Ryder is down, but not out...
http://www.cyclingfans.com/node/5579

 

[Panda Claws]

Damned, and here I was hoping to see what Ryder could do.

He could have been one of the few that won the Giro and then top 10'd in the Tour.

 

[Clemson Cycling]

He should go for the Polka Dots. He is in an ideal position to do it after today

 

[cineteq]

He should go for the Polka Dots. He is in an ideal position to do it after today

There is one minor detail, he's hurt.

 

[webvan]

It's over -> http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/hesjedal-pulls-out-of-the-tour-de-france

Too bad for him and for the Giro+TDF stats...

 

[vcampbell]

Yesterday after he arrived 13 minutes after the winner, I was thinking, that he should abandon, and prepare for Vuelta. I'm not happy now, but now he has got a better chance for a good place there.

 

[Alex III]

Yesterday after he arrived 13 minutes after the winner, I was thinking, that he should abandon, and prepare for Vuelta. I'm not happy now, but now he has got a better chance for a good place there.

I remember him saying not too long ago that the plan for his focus races this year was Giro, TdF, Olympics, Canadian races (Quebec, Montreal).

I wonder if it will change now after this and he goes for the Vuelta... or stick with Quebec/Montreal.

 

[Coramoor]

Yesterday after he arrived 13 minutes after the winner, I was thinking, that he should abandon, and prepare for Vuelta. I'm not happy now, but now he has got a better chance for a good place there.

I think the Canadian races are too important to him, but you never know