Samuel Sanchez positive for growth hormone

[Forever The Best]

Re:

How many of the riders mentioned tested positive in the buildup to a race that Roche was also riding on the same team?

Kreuziger couldn't race the 2014 TDF due to bio passport irregularities.
So pretty similar with this situation I think.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Re:

How many of the riders mentioned tested positive in the buildup to a race that Roche was also riding on the same team?

Fofonov tested positive in the 2008 Tour, that Roche was riding with him.
Kreuziger was yanked from the 2014 Tour.

And he didn't say anything about riding alongside Mick Rogers. That's Mick Rogers. MICK. ROGERS.

Mick Rogers.

 

[Netserk]

Don't forget Mick Rogers!

 

[kingjr]

I think Mick Rogers deserves a mention.

 

[Forever The Best]

Rogers doesn't fit the criteria roundabout suggested, hence why I didn't mention him. I didn't know about Fofonow though!

 

[bigcog]

It's a pity the Icarus documentary didn't actually show how doping with EPO, HGH, testosterone and beating the tests is actually done which appeared to be the original intention of the film, rather than changing tack and going with the Russian olympics scandal or should have included both.

 

[fmk_RoI]

@verdafjord

Per a) they didn't help develop a test but put a marker in the medicine that the tests looked for to confirm CERA use. The company informed AFLD of the maker not WADA. When the UCI took back testing no one tested postive for CERA for a long time afterwards. The AFLD caught Kohl by retroactively going back on his tests post Tour. There was a video of when the AFLD summoned Beltran for his test, the look on his face was sheer amazement that he asked to be tested. Goes to the UCI don't take testing hat seriously.

There was also a rumour circulating which Ricco confirmed that up to 60 riders tested positive for CERA but the UCI buried the results.

Monday July 27th 2009
'NEW DOPING PRODUCTS USED IN TOUR':
French Anti-Doping Agency President Pierre Bordry, revealed news this morning on the continued fight against doping in the recent Tour de France. Bordry said "We suspect certain riders had blood transfusions," The president of the AFLD has also "convinced that two new EPO products have been used during the Tour, two drugs that are not yet on the market."

The first drug HEMATIDE, another third generation of EPO to maintain hemoglobin levels, yet without CERA’s ID marker which the manafactures install to make it identifiable in testing. Still in clinical phase, the drug, whose introduction is scheduled for 2011, is already on the list of substances banned from World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA).

The second drug AICAR, a product that acts on muscle tissue and helps burn fat. "I was amazed at the leanness of certain riders," says Pierre Bordry. Testing for these two products could be ready by September-October. Needless to say, like CERA EPO last year, positive cases could be reported..

How many times is the marker thing going to be claimed and then disputed before people get the message - there was no marker. Repeating the same lie over and over and over again does not make it true.

 

[thehog]

Re: Re:

How many of the riders mentioned tested positive in the buildup to a race that Roche was also riding on the same team?

Fofonov tested positive in the 2008 Tour, that Roche was riding with him.
Kreuziger was yanked from the 2014 Tour.

And he didn't say anything about riding alongside Mick Rogers. That's Mick Rogers. MICK. ROGERS.

Mick Rogers.

Maybe it's a Spanish thing? Although he did ride for Contador

 

[lartiste]

Interesting enough those peptides are available openly for purchase in my country in EU from the doctor allegedly for labs purposes but content of the web page says it all ... . I have to say that I was not aware of the fact, that such substance is illegal. Other interesting point is that they probably had to come for testing just very short period of time after the application. If I remember correctly and there was no further development it was possible to test positive for GH only if tested within few hours after application.

Regarding Samu - great rider of ending Spanish generation. I liked him, remember several great moments from his career and to be honest never doubt that he is doping as well as majority of the peloton. I pretty do not understand why someone decided to catch him just before his (probably) last race in his career where he would be just fodder nothing more.

And Nicolas Roche is hypocrite of the century .

 

[Kokoso]

Re:

Don't forget Kreuziger, Nicki Sørensen, Bertagnolli, Cristian Moreni, O'Grady, Caucchioli, Fofonov, Valjavec, Mondory, Sylvain Georges, Ventoso, Houanard and Mick freaking Rogers.

What about Kreuziger? I've never heard of him being banned.

 

[ppanther92]

Re: Re:

Don't forget Kreuziger, Nicki Sørensen, Bertagnolli, Cristian Moreni, O'Grady, Caucchioli, Fofonov, Valjavec, Mondory, Sylvain Georges, Ventoso, Houanard and Mick freaking Rogers.

What about Kreuziger? I've never heard of him being banned.

Roman KREUZIGER tested positive through his biological passport in 2011-2012. He was provisionally suspended by the UCI in August 2014 but subsequently cleared by the Czech Olympic Committee in September 2014. UCI and AMA filed an appeal against this decision with the TAS, but dropped the case in June 2015.


Banner for 1 month if you want so.

 

[The Hitch]

So the winner of the 2008 Olympics was doping. Wasn't that one of the years where jv declared there was no more doping in cycling

 

[Benotti69]

Re:

So the winner of the 2008 Olympics was doping. Wasn't that one of the years where jv declared there was no more doping in cycling

Lot of snakeoil sold that year.

Remember his famous line, that the new generation were too cool to dope!

:lol:

 

[pmcg76]

Re: Re:

How many of the riders mentioned tested positive in the buildup to a race that Roche was also riding on the same team?

Fofonov tested positive in the 2008 Tour, that Roche was riding with him.
Kreuziger was yanked from the 2014 Tour.

And he didn't say anything about riding alongside Mick Rogers. That's Mick Rogers. MICK. ROGERS.

Mick Rogers.

Would just like to point out that Roche did not ride the 2008 Tour as suggested. He made his Tour debut with AG2R the following year. Bad enough that the usual idiots post non facts as facts, without one of the best posters doing the same.

When did Roche start writing his column in the Irish Independent and how many peope here actually read it on a regular basis? I know I dont and I highly doubt many others on here do so either, yet everyone seems to know every single word Roche has ever put to paper. I know Kimmage had a massive dig at Roche a few years back for not calling out people so I guess he must be happy with Roche now.

 

[pmcg76]

Re:

So the winner of the 2008 Olympics was doping. Wasn't that one of the years where jv declared there was no more doping in cycling

This comment was already redundant due to Davide Rebellin or did you forget.

I think its fair to say that anyone who takes throwaway comments from JV as fact are certifiable idiots, the way that line keeps getting repeated here just goes to show just how many idiots are actually here.

 

[42x16ss]

Re: Re:

So the winner of the 2008 Olympics was doping. Wasn't that one of the years where jv declared there was no more doping in cycling

This comment was already redundant due to Davide Rebellin or did you forget.

I think its fair to say that anyone who takes throwaway comments from JV as fact are certifiable idiots, the way that line keeps getting repeated here just goes to show just how many idiots are actually here.

The Hitch was quoting it as a shot at Vaughters, not out of any belief in the comments JV made.

 

[42x16ss]

Re: Re:

How many of the riders mentioned tested positive in the buildup to a race that Roche was also riding on the same team?

Fofonov tested positive in the 2008 Tour, that Roche was riding with him.
Kreuziger was yanked from the 2014 Tour.

And he didn't say anything about riding alongside Mick Rogers. That's Mick Rogers. MICK. ROGERS.

Mick Rogers.

Would just like to point out that Roche did not ride the 2008 Tour as suggested. He made his Tour debut with AG2R the following year. Bad enough that the usual idiots post non facts as facts, without one of the best posters doing the same.

When did Roche start writing his column in the Irish Independent and how many peope here actually read it on a regular basis? I know I dont and I highly doubt many others on here do so either, yet everyone seems to know every single word Roche has ever put to paper. I know Kimmage had a massive dig at Roche a few years back for not calling out people so I guess he must be happy with Roche now.

Sure, Roche didn't ride the 2008 Tour, but they were on the same team.

 

[Echoes]

Re: Re:

The Hitch was quoting it as a shot at Vaughters, not out of any belief in the comments JV made.

It still is redundant. Sella tested positive in August that year. If ever that comment is true (because I cannot believe that poster on face value), Vaughters' comment could already have been criticised at that moment.

 

[Blanco]

Re: Re:

How many of the riders mentioned tested positive in the buildup to a race that Roche was also riding on the same team?

Fofonov tested positive in the 2008 Tour, that Roche was riding with him.
Kreuziger was yanked from the 2014 Tour.

And he didn't say anything about riding alongside Mick Rogers. That's Mick Rogers. MICK. ROGERS.

Mick Rogers.

Would just like to point out that Roche did not ride the 2008 Tour as suggested. He made his Tour debut with AG2R the following year. Bad enough that the usual idiots post non facts as facts, without one of the best posters doing the same.

When did Roche start writing his column in the Irish Independent and how many peope here actually read it on a regular basis? I know I dont and I highly doubt many others on here do so either, yet everyone seems to know every single word Roche has ever put to paper. I know Kimmage had a massive dig at Roche a few years back for not calling out people so I guess he must be happy with Roche now.

Why would I need to read all that Nicholas Roche wrote in his columns?! It's completely enough to read what he said about Samu to conclude that he's a hypocritical piece of ***!

 

[The Hitch]

Re: Re:

So the winner of the 2008 Olympics was doping. Wasn't that one of the years where jv declared there was no more doping in cycling

This comment was already redundant due to Davide Rebellin or did you forget.

I think its fair to say that anyone who takes throwaway comments from JV as fact are certifiable idiots, the way that line keeps getting repeated here just goes to show just how many idiots are actually here.

It was not a throwaway comment I was reacting to but an article penned by Vaughters we dug up a few years ago where he said directly that cyclists don't dope anymore. In 2008.

I used to defend him, but anyone with a shred of integrity would have withdrawn themselves from the sport after being proved wrong so many times (thats assuming he actually believed what he was saying)

Its clear by now that Vaughters is running a basic scam where every year he tells people in the US that cycling is clean so that they keep watching (good for business for him). He even tries to coopt people like Landis behind the scenes to make sure they give the same message and dont go to hard after current cycling and make sure they only talk about the big bad past.

Then everytime he gets proved wrong he will just repeat the same thing the next year and ignore the fact that he said the same *** a year earlier.

Because of this scam, we are entitled to take shots at him for it. Now and for ever. If he ever apologises and shows some humility, sure i wont be an *** about it, its not like he killed anyone, but since he's a shameless fraud for now, he gets what he deserves

 

[jens_attacks]

animo the hitch!

 

[jahn]

Re: Re:

So the winner of the 2008 Olympics was doping. Wasn't that one of the years where jv declared there was no more doping in cycling

This comment was already redundant due to Davide Rebellin or did you forget.

I think its fair to say that anyone who takes throwaway comments from JV as fact are certifiable idiots, the way that line keeps getting repeated here just goes to show just how many idiots are actually here.

It was not a throwaway comment I was reacting to but an article penned by Vaughters we dug up a few years ago where he said directly that cyclists don't dope anymore. In 2008.

I used to defend him, but anyone with a shred of integrity would have withdrawn themselves from the sport after being proved wrong so many times (thats assuming he actually believed what he was saying)

Its clear by now that Vaughters is running a basic scam where every year he tells people in the US that cycling is clean so that they keep watching (good for business for him). He even tries to coopt people like Landis behind the scenes to make sure they give the same message and dont go to hard after current cycling and make sure they only talk about the big bad past.

Then everytime he gets proved wrong he will just repeat the same thing the next year and ignore the fact that he said the same **** a year earlier.

Because of this scam, we are entitled to take shots at him for it. Now and for ever. If he ever apologises and shows some humility, sure i wont be an ******* about it, its not like he killed anyone, but since he's a shameless fraud for now, he gets what he deserves

I'm not sure I understand this line of reasoning and how it's different from everyone else in professional cycling saying the sport is clean.

Do you think he should come clean and tell all, destroying the sport and ruining everyone's life whose career is dependent on pro cycling?

Should he stay silent, effectively implying that doping is indeed rife?

 

[pmcg76]

Re: Re:

So the winner of the 2008 Olympics was doping. Wasn't that one of the years where jv declared there was no more doping in cycling

This comment was already redundant due to Davide Rebellin or did you forget.

I think its fair to say that anyone who takes throwaway comments from JV as fact are certifiable idiots, the way that line keeps getting repeated here just goes to show just how many idiots are actually here.

It was not a throwaway comment I was reacting to but an article penned by Vaughters we dug up a few years ago where he said directly that cyclists don't dope anymore. In 2008.

I used to defend him, but anyone with a shred of integrity would have withdrawn themselves from the sport after being proved wrong so many times (thats assuming he actually believed what he was saying)

Its clear by now that Vaughters is running a basic scam where every year he tells people in the US that cycling is clean so that they keep watching (good for business for him). He even tries to coopt people like Landis behind the scenes to make sure they give the same message and dont go to hard after current cycling and make sure they only talk about the big bad past.

Then everytime he gets proved wrong he will just repeat the same thing the next year and ignore the fact that he said the same **** a year earlier.

Because of this scam, we are entitled to take shots at him for it. Now and for ever. If he ever apologises and shows some humility, sure i wont be an ******* about it, its not like he killed anyone, but since he's a shameless fraud for now, he gets what he deserves

That has to be the most pathetic justification I have seen for bringing someone into a thread that is not related to them. Seems more like a childish move to get the approval of the usual peanut gallery.

 

[The Hitch]

Re: Re:

So the winner of the 2008 Olympics was doping. Wasn't that one of the years where jv declared there was no more doping in cycling

This comment was already redundant due to Davide Rebellin or did you forget.

I think its fair to say that anyone who takes throwaway comments from JV as fact are certifiable idiots, the way that line keeps getting repeated here just goes to show just how many idiots are actually here.

It was not a throwaway comment I was reacting to but an article penned by Vaughters we dug up a few years ago where he said directly that cyclists don't dope anymore. In 2008.

I used to defend him, but anyone with a shred of integrity would have withdrawn themselves from the sport after being proved wrong so many times (thats assuming he actually believed what he was saying)

Its clear by now that Vaughters is running a basic scam where every year he tells people in the US that cycling is clean so that they keep watching (good for business for him). He even tries to coopt people like Landis behind the scenes to make sure they give the same message and dont go to hard after current cycling and make sure they only talk about the big bad past.

Then everytime he gets proved wrong he will just repeat the same thing the next year and ignore the fact that he said the same **** a year earlier.

Because of this scam, we are entitled to take shots at him for it. Now and for ever. If he ever apologises and shows some humility, sure i wont be an ******* about it, its not like he killed anyone, but since he's a shameless fraud for now, he gets what he deserves

That has to be the most pathetic justification I have seen for bringing someone into a thread that is not related to them. Seems more like a childish move to get the approval of the usual peanut gallery.

In chronological order:

*JV dopes.
*JV lies about it, makes money and rep, uses rep to rise in the sport.
* JV eventually gets caught lying about some of his lies.
* Negotiates behind the scenes and pretends to come clean.
* Other aspects of JV's story continue to unravel.
* JV continues to lie and break promises.
* years later a poster on an internet form is reminded of JV's lies and makes a throaway comment mocking JV for one of his lies.

Sorry mate but theres something wrong with your view of the world when you think the person making a comment about it is the bad guy and JV isn't.

What is he your father or something that you defend him from any attack? when its deserved as well.

I hate to give you a tutorial to the internet (or life even) but people who *** up and lie can get mocked for it for ever. Thats the price you pay. And its better that way. Teaches future generations that if you act like a slimy prat there might be a very very small price to pay.

As for the motivation you assigned to me, thats just stupid and makes no logical sense. The idea that I pick my opinions in order to please other people is offensive (dont worry im not an sjw so dont care) and more importantly doesn't match at all with my posting history on here.

If I actually did post in order to make people like me I would do it more often. Better yet, I could just go back to twitter, make the same post, and since several of the more popular anti doping people still follow me (tucker, digger, vayer etc), with a bit of luck could get a lot of likes and retweets, if I cared about that ***.

I don't. I just remembered 2 days ago when I made the post, that Samu won the olympics on 2008. I remembered that back then people were trying to sell sport as clean (the Beijing olympics for example) and how could I think about people claiming sport is clean without JV coming to mind, seeing how hard he fought to make himself the centre of the "we made cycling clean" parade for all those years.

Well *** him, the liar. I enjoyed making the little potshot at him, even if he didnt read it, even if no one read it. i will enjoy it again the next time I am reminded of it. If JV doesnt like it he should change and become a better person, or if he gets another chance at life, not cheat and lie to advance his own career. Tough ***. Responsibility is a ***.

 

[mrhender]

Re: Re:

So the winner of the 2008 Olympics was doping. Wasn't that one of the years where jv declared there was no more doping in cycling

This comment was already redundant due to Davide Rebellin or did you forget.

I think its fair to say that anyone who takes throwaway comments from JV as fact are certifiable idiots, the way that line keeps getting repeated here just goes to show just how many idiots are actually here.

It was not a throwaway comment I was reacting to but an article penned by Vaughters we dug up a few years ago where he said directly that cyclists don't dope anymore. In 2008.

I used to defend him, but anyone with a shred of integrity would have withdrawn themselves from the sport after being proved wrong so many times (thats assuming he actually believed what he was saying)

Its clear by now that Vaughters is running a basic scam where every year he tells people in the US that cycling is clean so that they keep watching (good for business for him). He even tries to coopt people like Landis behind the scenes to make sure they give the same message and dont go to hard after current cycling and make sure they only talk about the big bad past.

Then everytime he gets proved wrong he will just repeat the same thing the next year and ignore the fact that he said the same **** a year earlier.

Because of this scam, we are entitled to take shots at him for it. Now and for ever. If he ever apologises and shows some humility, sure i wont be an ******* about it, its not like he killed anyone, but since he's a shameless fraud for now, he gets what he deserves

I'm not sure I understand this line of reasoning and how it's different from everyone else in professional cycling saying the sport is clean.

Do you think he should come clean and tell all, destroying the sport and ruining everyone's life whose career is dependent on pro cycling?

Should he stay silent, effectively implying that doping is indeed rife?

Yep, he is a hero.

Especially when crying on twitter about his budget compared to Sky's.

Or when he hails his team (himself really) as being the «special one»

That aside, i agree that you cant really make any win/win comments (on doping) when being part of the game as long as he has.