So what happens if Contador wins by 39 seconds or less?

[El Pistolero]

You might want to check you math before you tell other to check their math. Contador won the TT by 31 seconds, the same as Andy's lead before the chain incident. Contador wins the GC by 39 seconds the same as Andy lost in the Chain incident.

Yes, and Contador lost 73 seconds when he was held back because of Frank's crash. And all of a sudden Cancellara starts to increase his tempo big time with Andy in his wheel.

What's your point?

Andy had bad luck, but so did Contador... You could say this year's Tour was won by a prologue. Guess who rode like total crap like he didn't care that prologue?

It's really simple to me:

Andy: Very good climber + average time trial specialist = he lost the Tour
Alberto: Very good climber + excellent time trial specialist = he won the Tour

 

[Escarabajo]

Actually, take away "chaingate" and they're tied to the second. Interesting.

You would have to look at the prologue time by the rules I believe.

But we don't have those times in such detail.

 

[henryg]

You might want to check you math before you tell other to check their math. Contador won the TT by 31 seconds, the same as Andy's lead before the chain incident. Contador wins the GC by 39 seconds the same as Andy lost in the Chain incident.

I stand corrected on the math. They would have been tied but then AC would not have gifted the stage on the Tourmelet to AS. How many seconds do we award in our fantasy TdF unwritten rules calculations for that?

 

[Escarabajo]

...
We don't want to see who is the luckiest over three weeks, but who is the strongest bike rider. Imagine if you went to a track and field race and they set mountain lions on the track and whoever was "luckiest" got through? It becomes something different than a race--which is supposed to be the simple measure of who is fastest, strongest, and has the most endurance. I still don't think we have an answer for this Tour De France on who that was, as I think Schleck looked tougher in the mountains and obviously Alberto in the TTs, but I think I'm in the minority there.

So tell me why they put cobbles in the Tour then?

Luck, luck, luck.

 

[VoidSix]

I stand corrected on the math. They would have been tied but then AC would not have gifted the stage on the Tourmelet to AS. How many seconds do we award in our fantasy TdF unwritten rules calculations for that?

None. Because Alberto couldn't drop Schleck on the Tourmalet regardless. So they would've finished with the same time even if Contador had taken the stage win as he probably could've.

 

[VoidSix]

So tell me why in the "hell" they put cobbles in the Tour the?

Luck, luck, luck.

Cobbles are anything but luck. Riding cobbles is definitely a skill some riders possess (such as Fabian).

 

[Steel4Ever]

So tell me why they put cobbles in the Tour then?

Luck, luck, luck.

Either that or SKILL, SKILL, SKILL.

Oh those Shrek Bros.!

They really do have crappy bike handling skills.

 

[jazzcyclist]

FYI, the tie breaker in stage races is the sum of the extra fractions of seconds accumulated in the time trials.

 

[VeloGirl]

"So what happens if Contador wins by 39 seconds or less?"

He wins.

 

[Comeback 2011]

Real cycling fans know it's a hard sport with no such ridiculous unwritten rules.

Actually precisely the opposite is true. Real cycling fans know about the sporting rules and how it often plays apart in the racing.

I'm not going to cry for fans of Alberto because I'm an Armstrong fan, and we have to put up with a lot worse. My advice is grow a thicker skin.

 

[Cerberus]

Yes, and Contador lost 73 seconds when he was held back because of Frank's crash. And all of a sudden Cancellara starts to increase his tempo big time with Andy in his wheel.

What's your point?

Andy had bad luck, but so did Contador... You could say this year's Tour was won by a prologue. Guess who rode like total crap like he didn't care that prologue?

My point was he should check his math before telling other to check their math, you can tell it's my point because that's what I wrote. Ultimatly what happened happened and I've more or less chosen to stay out of the forum debate about it.

 

[Escarabajo]

FYI, the tie breaker in stage races is the sum of the extra fractions of seconds accumulated in the time trials.

Thanks for the information. I bet the Tour de France organization will never give us those numbers.

 

[El Pistolero]

Cobbles are anything but luck. Riding cobbles is definitely a skill some riders possess (such as Fabian).

Yes, you'll never win an important cobbled classic without the skill for it, but luck also plays a big role.

Paris-Roubaix would be a very boring race if they had to wait for everyone that had a mechanical.

And that's why you DON'T put cobbled stages in a Grand Tour.

 

[Cerberus]

I stand corrected on the math. They would have been tied but then AC would not have gifted the stage on the Tourmelet to AS. How many seconds do we award in our fantasy TdF unwritten rules calculations for that?

I'm not playing fantasy TdF, I don't know what would have happened since I, unlike some apparently, don't own a crystal ball.

 

[Comeback 2011]

I stand corrected on the math. They would have been tied but then AC would not have gifted the stage on the Tourmelet to AS. How many seconds do we award in our fantasy TdF unwritten rules calculations for that?

But Alberto tried to drop AS on that stage and couldn't. He tried to win that stage.

 

[El Pistolero]

My point was he should check his math before telling other to check their math, you can tell it's my point because that's what I wrote. Ultimatly what happened happened and I've more or less chosen to stay out of the forum debate about it.

My bad, it sounded like you were saying Andy should have won.

 

[Escarabajo]

Either that or SKILL, SKILL, SKILL.

Oh those Shrek Bros.!

They really do have crappy bike handling skills.

Ok I'll give you skill. But the Luck element has to be greater for this stage than for any other of the stages. I really don't want probabilities on this issue now.

Thanks.

 

[VoidSix]

Actually precisely the opposite is true. Real cycling fans know about the sporting rules and how it often plays apart in the racing.

I'm not going to cry for fans of Alberto because I'm an Armstrong fan, and we have to put up with a lot wore. My advice is grow a thicker skin.

Totally agree here. Bike racing is almost entirely based on unwritten rules: ride as a group, exchange pulls, yellow jersey team must drive the peloton to catch breaks, don't attack your own teammate after he attacks, let the break survive if they aren't a threat to the GC, etc.

Many of the riders who win stages in the Tour De France would never, ever win a stage without those unwritten rules. It makes cycling what it is. Remove them and it's just another endurance sport--one with ridiculous clothing that invalidates third world contenders with enormous training and equipment costs, no less.

 

[Escarabajo]

Totally agree here. Bike racing is almost entirely based on unwritten rules: ride as a group, exchange pulls, yellow jersey team must drive the peloton to catch breaks, don't attack your own teammate after he attacks, let the break survive if they aren't a threat to the GC, etc.

Many of the riders who win stages in the Tour De France would never, ever win a stage without those unwritten rules. It makes cycling what it is. Remove them and it's just another endurance sport--one with ridiculous clothing that invalidates third world contenders with enormous training and equipment costs, no less.

Somehow I feel like you are talking to yourself.

 

[henryg]

In the end the what ifs are meaningless because they are all numbers pulled out of peoples butts. In different circumstances the riders all would have behaved differently and no one knows what the results would have been.

The fact is that given different circumstances for his last 5 grand tours Contador adapted his tactics and performance in a way that got him a victory every time. End of story. What if Armstrong had not come out of retirement last tour? What if Astana had not got uninvited from one years Tour? What if FC had not got a stage neutralized or Andy had not dropped his chain?

You can only reliably know the results of what actually happened not what they would have been if something had been different.

 

[Polyarmour]

What if Andy's chain had fallen off during the time trial and not during the mountain stage? What would the "unwritten rules" require Alberto to do then? Same mechanical, same amount of time lost etc. Does anybody seriously think Alberto should stop his TT bike in the middle of the road and wait?

 

[XasTandem]

If Contador had waited for Andy, he wouldn't have lost that 39 seconds ...

If Andy has waited for Contador when he got stuck behind Frank's crash on Stage 3, Contador wouldn't have lost 1:13 ...

If Contador hadn't waited for Andy when he crashed on Stage 2, he would have lost many minutes ...

If my aunt had balls, she'd be my uncle ...

Contador has won the Tour as fairly as anyone ever has. Get over it.

 

[lagartija]

But Alberto tried to drop AS on that stage and couldn't. He tried to win that stage.

no not really, he even said he put in a move to let andy know he was feeling good and that he was there...............berto looked better than andy on the tormalet......had he sprinted from 50 mtr out nothing andy could have done, and he would have lost a few seconds on the run in

 

[RedheadDane]

Answer to OP:
He's winning by 39 seconds! End of story, goodnight!

 

[Comeback 2011]

no not really, he even said he put in a move to let andy know he was feeling good and that he was there

Pretty funny explanation. Yeah sure.