Teams & Riders Tadej Pogačar discussion thread

[Red Rick]

Remco didn't win what he need and Jonas didn't win what he needed, same with Froglic, and Mathieu cut his season short, so I think Velo d' Or should be a comfortable win after yet another Lombardia. Its impossible for me to argue for any of the other riders outside of Vingegaard.

Think Pog should get it, but will understand if MvdP gets it.

Weird how it feels wildly different to me now the WC recency bias has faded

 

[The fridge in the blue trees]

Ok works too, but if you win Milano-Sanremo, Roubaix, the WC and arrive second in Flanders... then you're really allowed to do nothing at all the rest of the season.
Of course he should have gone to Paris-Tours tomorrow and win that to make it clear. Doesn't matter, whoever is rider of the season, Pogacar still is the best rider.

 

[gunara]

Couldn't watch the race live. But like Toby said, all hail The King.

 

[Elos Anjos]

Simply the best. Ride on Pogi.

 

[hayneplane]

Even Merckx never won Flanders and Lombardia in the same season to put some perspective on how special this is.

 

[proffate]

Pog will be strong but it's one thing to beat a record in a standalone, high-intensity effort and it's another thing to ride it after 200 km of racing (ok, maybe Pog did a long training ride before but still it's hard to simulate racing intensity).

He went one second slower on the strava segment today

 

[QueenStagiaire]

He went one second slower on the strava segment today

He would have taken KOM on one of the descent segments but Masnada was one second faster today, Fausto simply too good, but he‘s beaten Masnada‘s 2021 KOM on the plateau section after the Ganda KOM.

 

[proffate]

I agree. To me Pog was the rider of the season. Both have 2 monuments. MVP has a WC gold, which obviously eclipses most single achievements but Pog's all season excellence is a strong argument (I mean TdF runner-up, WC bronze, wins in PN, Fleche, Amstel are big results).

What you're describing is why he's winning UCI and pcs on points. But Flanders was Pog's biggest result and the only one that could really be considered a top level victory. Yeah Lombardia is technically a monument, but the least contested one due to its place in the calendar and because of competing with the TDF to be the climbers' big target. If I were Pog I would trade some of this year's quantity for quality. But as a fan I enjoy seeing him in action many times a year and not just a handful of days in July.

 

[Salvarani]

What you're describing is why he's winning UCI and pcs on points. But Flanders was Pog's biggest result and the only one that could really be considered a top level victory. Yeah Lombardia is technically a monument, but the least contested one due to its place in the calendar and because of competing with the TDF to be the climbers' big target. If I were Pog I would trade some of this year's quantity for quality. But as a fan I enjoy seeing him in action many times a year and not just a handful of days in July.

"Least contested"... how?

Lombardia had way more great riders compared to Ronde. Ronde is a much more "specific" type of race and for the classics specialists.

Lombardia is more unpredictable and could become more of a tactical race. A wide range of riders could realistically win. That Pog delivered as the main favorite just speaks more to his greatness than anything else.

That he won the Ronde is just incredible. That he won both Ronde and Lombardia in the same season is just crazy.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

What you're describing is why he's winning UCI and pcs on points. But Flanders was Pog's biggest result and the only one that could really be considered a top level victory. Yeah Lombardia is technically a monument, but the least contested one due to its place in the calendar and because of competing with the TDF to be the climbers' big target. If I were Pog I would trade some of this year's quantity for quality. But as a fan I enjoy seeing him in action many times a year and not just a handful of days in July.

Wut? You had almost all the strongest climbers in the world here except Vingegaard, who had 2 GTs in his legs so understandably was gassed. If anything the field here was among the strongest in one-day races this year.

 

[Panda Claws]

What you're describing is why he's winning UCI and pcs on points. But Flanders was Pog's biggest result and the only one that could really be considered a top level victory. Yeah Lombardia is technically a monument, but the least contested one due to its place in the calendar and because of competing with the TDF to be the climbers' big target. If I were Pog I would trade some of this year's quantity for quality. But as a fan I enjoy seeing him in action many times a year and not just a handful of days in July.

Who is Lombardia really missing? Vingegaard?
I think people tend to undervalue Lombardia because climbers that are perceived to have a limited one-day racing pedigree tend to win it. Of course, this ignores that many of these climbers haven't bothered trying in other monuments or are simply not well-suited to other monuments.

Sure you could get Van der Poel and Van Aert in there but it's far from a given that they would be able to do well in it.

"Least contested"... how?

Lombardia had way more great riders compared to Ronde. Ronde is a much more "specific" type of race and for the classics specialists.

Lombardia is more unpredictable and could become more of a tactical race. A wide range of riders could realistically win. That Pog delivered as the main favorite just speaks more to his greatness than anything else.

That he won the Ronde is just incredible. That he won both Ronde and Lombardia in the same season is just crazy.

This Ronde Van Vlaanderen was rather impressive though because the current top specialists (Van Aert and Van der Poel) were both beaten AND are also incredibly good in other races. There have been years with an overall weaker field (like when Terpstra won) or the years were Devolder won and Boonen was basically the only worldbeater there (when he tried other races).

 

[Salvarani]

Who is Lombardia really missing? Vingegaard?
I think people tend to undervalue Lombardia because climbers that are perceived to have a limited one-day racing pedigree tend to win it. Of course, this ignores that many of these climbers haven't bothered trying in other monuments or are simply not well-suited to other monuments.

Sure you could get Van der Poel and Van Aert in there but it's far from a given that they would be able to do well in it.


This Ronde Van Vlaanderen was rather impressive though because the current top specialists (Van Aert and Van der Poel) were both beaten AND are also incredibly good in other races. There have been years with an overall weaker field (like when Terpstra won) or the years were Devolder won and Boonen was basically the only worldbeater there (when he tried other races).

Of course, when you single out one year that may be the case.

But I think the point that I made still stands, which you speak of also.

 

[hayneplane]

What you're describing is why he's winning UCI and pcs on points. But Flanders was Pog's biggest result and the only one that could really be considered a top level victory. Yeah Lombardia is technically a monument, but the least contested one due to its place in the calendar and because of competing with the TDF to be the climbers' big target. If I were Pog I would trade some of this year's quantity for quality. But as a fan I enjoy seeing him in action many times a year and not just a handful of days in July.

Paris Roubaix is a wonderful race but that is easily the least contested race in terms of crossover talent and has many more winners that never won any other monuments that any of the other 4 monuments.

 

[Netserk]

Paris Roubaix is a wonderful race but that is easily the least contested race in terms of crossover talent and has many more winners that never won any other monuments that any of the other 4 monuments.

Indeed. Yet it's the Queen of the Classics.

 

[Pantani_lives]

Pogacar now has five monuments, and he's only just turned twenty-five. Only five riders have won five monuments since the year 2000: Boonen, Cancellara, Bettini, Gilbert and Pogacar. If he continues like this who knows how many he can win. However I doubt whether he can win all five of them.

 

[Valv.Piti]

Ronde van Vlaanderen is year after year the race that attracts the best riders in the world out of the 5 monuments. The greatest race, and in my opinion, the race the crowns the best one day racer.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Pogacar now has five monuments, and he's only just turned twenty-five. Only four riders have won five monuments in this century: Boonen, Cancellara, Gilbert and Pogacar. If he continues like this who knows how many he can win. However I doubt whether he can win all five of them.

Also Pogacar has now 7 big wins (5 monuments + 2 GTs). It's one of the best results of this century alongside an elite group of riders: Cancellara, Contador, Froome and Nibali. In this group only Teddy & the Shark won both GTs and monuments.

EDIT: Boonen & Bettini have 8 (WC/OG included).

 

[Salvarani]

Indeed. Yet it's the Queen of the Classics.

Probably because it is the most brutal race for the body to endure. It is the allure of the spectacle and pure chaos that often happens. It is a great watch.

 

[Gigs_98]

So, who was the last rider to win RVV and Lombardia in the same season?

 

[hayneplane]

So, who was the last rider to win RVV and Lombardia in the same season?

Rik Van Looy 1959. The only ever time until today.

 

[jmdirt]

Way to TAKE the race Tadej!

Get a gap with skill and hold it to the line with legs...LOVE IT!

 

[Lequack]

Such a gutsy ride, chapeau. Classy and entertaining way to win for the third time. One of the greatest.

 

[Savant12]

Great victory by Pog. What should he do next year? Go for the Tour victory with a Vingo Tour-focused race program or just carry on as usual and race what he wants?

 

[Nick2413]

Great victory by Pog. What should he do next year? Go for the Tour victory with a Vingo Tour-focused race program or just carry on as usual and race what he wants?

I’d go for a Giro Vuelta double with a similar spring program to the extent possible. At least cash in on one GT and still target a bunch of monuments. He’ll probably stick to Tour for sponsors etc but it’s a roll of the dice that Vingegaard has misfortune.

He should start doing PR and keep plugging at MSR to get all 5 monuments. A 3rd Tour win is less important and in this age racking up more diverse palmares is a better use of time, anybody can come along next year and be the new world beater.

 

[Elos Anjos]

Great victory by Pog. What should he do next year? Go for the Tour victory with a Vingo Tour-focused race program or just carry on as usual and race what he wants?

YES.