Teams & Riders Tadej Pogačar discussion thread

[johnymax]

He will never beat Roglič on San Luca, that's what's the most important thing in cycling nowadays. Roglič GOAT.

 

[Berniece]

So you are basically saying Froome, MVDP, Boonen and Cancellara are all greater than Pog?

If Pog retires tomorrow, he will be greater than all of them IMO, just due to the phenomenon that is winning the races he did and the way he won them IMO. And I’m not belittling any of the above mentioned riders - but Pog is something else and it’s not about stats. If you put MVDP, Wout and Vingegaard together, they will still have to work really hard to win against Pog, each on their own respective spectrum. Yes, TDF 2022/2023 did happen, but so did 2020 and 2021.

If Pogacar stops tomorrow he definitely isn’t as great as the people I mentioned.

 

[bNator]

If Pogacar stops tomorrow he definitely isn’t as great as the people I mentioned.

Even MVDP? 😢

 

[proffate]

That's how I see my failure to ever bed a supermodel.

Pog is not exactly a classics virgin

 

[ingsve]

Yes, but let's not pretend that the monuments have the same importance as a GT, especially the Tour de France, who is all about for the casual fans(big proportion of cycling fans).

Well, if the discussion is who is the biggest GOAT then the opinions of casual fans shouldn't really have any weight. That should really be up to people in the know and people who know cycling know how hard monuments are to win and at least hold them in higher regard than casual fans would.

 

[Berniece]

Even MVDP? 😢

Oh sorry, yeah better than MVDP today. Not if MVDP win another couple of De Ronde’s, Roubaix’s and MSR

 

[AmRacer]

Oh sorry, yeah better than MVDP today. Not if MVDP win another couple of De Ronde’s, Roubaix’s and MSR

How many classics/monuments/worlds for one GT? And I'd assume TdF GT has more weight than the other two.
And maybe monuments have different weights too.

 

[gregrowlerson]

It has been proven that pog is not the goat.
How about renaming the pog thread "You the man!!!".

Only if he starts playing on the PGA Tour.

 

[gregrowlerson]

No matter how many frauded lombardias or Mickey mouse gravel races he won, he cannot be considered the same level as mercxk. When Pogacar attacks, his style on the bike looks like a frightened small child desperately and frantically trying to show off how good he is to bigger kids, he exudes insecurity and will stop at nothing to terrorise genuinely family men looking for a humble breakaway win. I don't think he can be considered the greatest in an era when we have Van der Poel and remco, let alone to mercxk who won 5 times giro, 5 times Le tour and 7 Sanremo. The biggest races in cycling.

Never won Clasica San Sebastian - ends the conversation right there.

Nevertheless, greatness can be found in the most unlikely of places. For example, there is Mou in Mickey Mouse.

 

[Berniece]

How many classics/monuments/worlds for one GT? And I'd assume TdF GT has more weight than the other two.
And maybe monuments have different weights too.

None, they are equal. But I find it more impressive if a rider really excels in a discipline compared to being the second best at everything.

 

[AmRacer]

None, they are equal. But I find it more impressive if a rider really excels in a discipline compared to being the second best at everything.

We aren't talking about WvA

 

[zekance]

How do you know that? How do you know Merckx would not even be more stronger with the access at all things the riders have today?

A few things we do know, if Merckx was active today:
-no way he is winning GTs with 74kg
-no way he wins 12 times at Milano-Sanremo, Paris - Roubaix and Ronde van Vlaanderen combined if he was a GT rider with let's say 65kg
-no way he is winning sprint stages like he did against sprint trains of today

In concludion, if Merckx rode today he would have to chose a career path of either classic rider or GT rider. My guess is, based on where he is coming from that he would look a lot more like MVDP or WVA and a lot less like a GT rider. Either way he is not winning as much as he did also based on the fact that a lot of his wins came in sprints.

 

[Froome]

A few things we do know, if Merckx was active today:
-no way he is winning GTs with 74kg
-no way he wins 12 times at Milano-Sanremo, Paris - Roubaix and Ronde van Vlaanderen combined if he was a GT rider with let's say 65kg
-no way he is winning sprint stages like he did against sprint trains of today

In concludion, if Merckx rode today he would have to chose a career path of either classic rider or GT rider. My guess is, based on where he is coming from that he would look a lot more like MVDP or WVA and a lot less like a GT rider. Either way he is not winning as much as he did also based on the fact that a lot of his wins came in sprints.

There is advantages and disadvantages between the two eras.

Merckx also has the disadvantage of not benefiting from a lot of things the riders of this era benefit. Better nutrition, better equipment, better training methods, and other things we can't talk here who are certainly more powerful than in that past era.

 

[Samu Cuenca]

Fastest athlete racing today = FART.

At this stage it would be an insult to put him ahead of Merckx and Hinault and a multiple other riders based purely on achievements. The guy's never been a world champion, for instance, and he's not won all 3 GTs. Only having 2 GT titles in total is simply not enough to be considered among the best ever.

He may very well get there (he could already be much closer at the end of this season), and if he doesn't it could possibly be his own fault for not riding more GTs in his peak years (we don't know how long his dominance is going to last. Mou said at least another 4 years, but injuries and bad luck can hit him like it's done for other greats in the past, and new monsters could come enter the scene as well).

 

[Rob5091]

If you've not had enough of the Pogi story, then a long interesting read by Alasdair Fotheringham -
https://www.cyclingnews.com/feature...cenes-of-tadej-pogacars-giro-tour-double-bid/
A couple of quick points by me, no mention of the Tour 2023 & bonking there & the ITT. A quick mention of Pogi's recovery ability which to me has seemed almost "unnatural".

 

[Peyroteo94]

If you've not had enough of the Pogi story, then a long interesting read by Alasdair Fotheringham -
https://www.cyclingnews.com/feature...cenes-of-tadej-pogacars-giro-tour-double-bid/
A couple of quick points by me, no mention of the Tour 2023 & bonking there & the ITT. A quick mention of Pogi's recovery ability which to me has seemed almost "unnatural".

After reading, one has to wonder if Mou was just a pure and funny troll or he had really some inside information. Dude was saying things 3 months ago that no one could know (e.g. Sola as his personal coach).

 

[gregrowlerson]

After reading, one has to wonder if Mou was just a pure and funny troll or he had really some inside information. Dude was saying things 3 months ago that no one could know (e.g. Sola as his personal coach).

I'm a believer. Some inside info I reckon.

 

[tobydawq]

No matter how many frauded lombardias or Mickey mouse gravel races he won, he cannot be considered the same level as mercxk. When Pogacar attacks, his style on the bike looks like a frightened small child desperately and frantically trying to show off how good he is to bigger kids, he exudes insecurity and will stop at nothing to terrorise genuinely family men looking for a humble breakaway win. I don't think he can be considered the greatest in an era when we have Van der Poel and remco, let alone to mercxk who won 5 times giro, 5 times Le tour and 7 Sanremo. The biggest races in cycling.

Worst. Post. Ever.

 

[Berniece]

After reading, one has to wonder if Mou was just a pure and funny troll or he had really some inside information. Dude was saying things 3 months ago that no one could know (e.g. Sola as his personal coach).

He knew some inside stuff but he was also crying for attention and exaggerated things and lied.

 

[Red Rick]

There is advantages and disadvantages between the two eras.

Merckx also has the disadvantage of not benefiting from a lot of things the riders of this era benefit. Better nutrition, better equipment, better training methods, and other things we can't talk here who are certainly more powerful than in that past era.

Merckx benefitted from *** training methods cause he responded best to his own trainimg methods amd others couldnt simply copy him and get the same results

 

[Valv.Piti]

None, they are equal. But I find it more impressive if a rider really excels in a discipline compared to being the second best at everything.

Lmao, how's Pogacar the second best at everything?`

 

[Berniece]

Lmao, how's Pogacar the second best at everything?`

Is he the best GT rider? Is he the best sprinter? Is he the best TT specialist? You might say he’s the best single day rider although there’s a case to be made about MVDP. Maybe on a hilly course but we were stolen out of an actual race with Evenepoel a couple of times now.

 

[Valv.Piti]

Is he the best GT rider? Is he the best sprinter? Is he the best TT specialist? You might say he’s the best single day rider although there’s a case to be made about MVDP. Maybe on a hilly course but we were stolen out of an actual race with Evenepoel a couple of times now.

He is definitely the best classics riders and there can be absolutely no doubt about that even if MVDP is amazing.

He is, by a wide margin, the best stage racer in one week races.

Vingegaard is better at TdF. Would that be the case in the Giro? Not so sure.

 

[Lequack]

What ever happened to @mou anyway?

 

[QueenStagiaire]

Is he the best GT rider? Is he the best sprinter? Is he the best TT specialist? You might say he’s the best single day rider although there’s a case to be made about MVDP. Maybe on a hilly course but we were stolen out of an actual race with Evenepoel a couple of times now.

He is the best at winning races though