Teams & Riders Tadej Pogačar discussion thread

[Netserk]

Such a shame to come down with illness, even if a fraction of the risk is down to fatigue.

Now I don’t see him do anything in Glasgow ...

 

[kingjr]

Is he sick? I expected him to crack, but not this badly.

Early during today's stage, German Eurosport commentators speculated about herpes blisters they said they saw yesterday on the side of his mouth, and that he may lose a few % performance-wise. Apparently the latter was confirmed to them by Dirk Tenner, an Ineos team doctor. But again, all speculation.

Tour de France - Tadej Pogacars Leistung von Herpes-Infektion beeinflusst? Teamarzt klärt auf - Eurosport

Tadej Pogacar (UAE Emirates) hat bei der Tour de France 2023 offenbar nicht nur mit Jonas Vingegaard, sondern auch mit einer Herpes-Infektion zu kämpfen.

www.eurosport.de

 

[Miha81]

Such a shame to come down with illness, even if a fraction of the risk is down to fatigue.

Now I don’t see him do anything in Glasgow ...

Is he going there? He has empty schedule after TDF.

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

Is he sick? I expected him to crack, but not this badly.

nah. I think his base is too small after the LBL crash.

Saw something similar with Van der Poel last year after Giro-Tour double and bad prep in the winter because of his back.

It meant Pog was relatively good earlier than expected. And now is just running on empty. It's as he described himself, he was empty at foot of loze even while eating enough. To me that's just going back to the lack of a good base after the LBL crash. They tried to get him ready, it worked, but at the cost of a short peak

 

[CyclistAbi]

In my opinion Pogi wasn't that empty yesterday doing the ITT. Unless we expect a Tour champion must finish 3 minutes ahead of everybody else in a 25km MTT. On top of being the best climber. The bar is just set higher. Currently set at 10 minutes ahead of the rest.

 

[Valv.Piti]

Better skip Worlds now and rest up before the Italian classics. He wont do anything there anyways at this point, I think.

He fought hard, but it wasn't enough. A combination of a hard Tour, heat and most importantly his preparation meant this was never meant to happen this year. Next year will be different, Im sure.

 

[ice&fire]

Not so fun fact: the last Tour winner to reclaim their crown after being beaten (not counting DNFs) was Hinault. I think it's interesting that in the modern era a rider usually either wins once or dominates, and once their reign is interrupted they never win again.

I wonder if Pogacar will be the one to break this cycle. A rider as talented as him can surely bounce back and will continue to dominate races throughout the year. However, history has shown that, as far as the Tour goes, what happened this year is not a setback but rather an end. Personally, I hope not.

Hinault reclaimed his crown after the dude who had beaten him DNF.

 

[Red Rick]

Better skip Worlds now and rest up before the Italian classics. He wont do anything there anyways at this point, I think.

He fought hard, but it wasn't enough. A combination of a hard Tour, heat and most importantly his preparation meant this was never meant to happen this year. Next year will be different, Im sure.

Didn't Quintana get sick in the 2016 Tour before winning the Vuelta?

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Didn't Quintana get sick in the 2016 Tour before winning the Vuelta?

This Tour has been the war of wattages so not easy to recover from. Plus Pogacar has already withdrawn from Vuelta multiply. I totally expect both him and Vinge to take a longer break and come back in the autumn.

 

[Miha81]

Didn't Quintana get sick in the 2016 Tour before winning the Vuelta?

It would be fun Vuelta if he could make late entry in decent shape

 

[Valv.Piti]

Cant see him riding the Vuelta tbh, there's also Ayuso, but would be interesting.

 

[CyclistAbi]

So peaking at spring classics, getting injured, peaking at the Tour. As remember he was and still is way ahead of the rest bar Jonas. Completely emptying himself. Then going to Vuelta? A bit cruel suggestion don't you think?

Then still better to focus on worlds and fall classics. We'll see.

 

[CyclistAbi]

Yeah Ayuso would likely be his biggest problem. At Vuelta.

P.S. Or maybe some underdog.

 

[Devil's Elbow]

Not so fun fact: the last Tour winner to reclaim their crown after being beaten (not counting DNFs) was Hinault. I think it's interesting that in the modern era a rider usually either wins once or dominates, and once their reign is interrupted they never win again.

I wonder if Pogacar will be the one to break this cycle. A rider as talented as him can surely bounce back and will continue to dominate races throughout the year. However, history has shown that, as far as the Tour goes, what happened this year is not a setback but rather an end. Personally, I hope not.

On the other hand, LeMond got screwed by the advent of the EPO era, Indurain retired directly after getting beaten, Armstrong retired directly after his final win* and was too old when he unretired, and Froome had a career-ending crash before he got a chance to reclaim his crown. None of those situations apply to what Pogacar is facing right now. The only other guy who’s won multiple Tours since Hinault’s final one is Contador, and with all due respect Pogacar is on a different level, in addition to not having his career derailed by a doping ban. And then we haven’t even talked about age - he’s comfortably younger than everyone else when they were dethroned (Contador was 28 in 2011 and everyone else was in their 30s). Pogacar will be on his fifth attempt to reclaim his crown when he’s 28, if he doesn’t manage to do so sooner…

 

[Salvarani]

Yeah, Pogacar stayed with Vinge very well for 2 weeks but something is missing now.

Wonder what.

 

[Extinction]

Pog, though, has to burry himse

nah. I think his base is too small after the LBL crash.

Saw something similar with Van der Poel last year after Giro-Tour double and bad prep in the winter because of his back.

It meant Pog was relatively good earlier than expected. And now is just running on empty. It's as he described himself, he was empty at foot of loze even while eating enough. To me that's just going back to the lack of a good base after the LBL crash. They tried to get him ready, it worked, but at the cost of a short peak

Pog though has to burry himself repeatedly to make gains on Vingeggard. At some point it comes with a hefty bill. And payment is devastating. It may be that Vingeggard simply has a superior motor.

 

[Lequack]

Are you implying mechanical assistance?

 

[Extinction]

Are you implying mechanical assistance?

No, if it were to come to that I'd live on cycling memories.

 

[Bolder]

On the other hand, LeMond got screwed by the advent of the EPO era, Indurain retired directly after getting beaten, Armstrong retired directly after his final win* and was too old when he unretired, and Froome had a career-ending crash before he got a chance to reclaim his crown. None of those situations apply to what Pogacar is facing right now. The only other guy who’s won multiple Tours since Hinault’s final one is Contador, and with all due respect Pogacar is on a different level, in addition to not having his career derailed by a doping ban. And then we haven’t even talked about age - he’s comfortably younger than everyone else when they were dethroned (Contador was 28 in 2011 and everyone else was in their 30s). Pogacar will be on his fifth attempt to reclaim his crown when he’s 28, if he doesn’t manage to do so sooner…

Yeah, it seems likely that Pog wins another, although we are don't know if he's peaked already. He was so dominant at ages 20-23. Next year he might try for the Giro just to mix it up a bit.

 

[Trofonios]

Vingegaard's level is just extremely high and his restitution seems incredible, which makes him really strong the 3rd week.

Maybe Pog can beat Vinge if he has a perfect preperation but I'm not sure.

But Pog can do things Vinge can't do, he is more versatile as we all know.

They are both exceptional riders. Just amazing to watch them.

 

[CyclistAbi]

If we consider Vuelta.

Pros are Pogi might win a GT after a two years of drought. Potential to beat some established names in cycling and some names to come. So there would be prestige involved.

Cons. Considering his season so far he likely would find it hard to peak again against such strong field for three weeks. He would likely sacrifice any chance at worlds and fall classics.

We'll see.

 

[Extinction]

Vingegaard's level is just extremely high and his restitution seems incredible, which give him an advantage in the 3rd weeks.

Maybe Pog can beat Vinge if he has a perfect preperation but I'm not sure.

But Pog can do things Vinge can't do, he is more versatile as we all know.

They are both exceptional riders. Just amazing to watch them.

Doesn't matter. Pog is too explosive to have that big deisel engine necessary. Vingegaard is simply superior. And I'm saying this, because his, Vingo's, numbers over 3 weeks can't be matched. You will kill yourself trying to beat him.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

If we consider Vuelta.

Pros are Pogi might win a GT after a two years of drought. Potential to beat some established names in cycling and some names to come. So there would be prestige involved.

Cons. Considering his season so far he likely would find it hard to peak again against such strong field for three weeks. He would likely sacrifice any chance at worlds and fall classics.

We'll see.

He won't recover and build form again for the Vuelta. He's never even tried that. It would mean the 3rd full form peak (first for the spring, second for the Tour). Just focus on autumn classics and maybe trying Giro-Vuelta double at some point of his career.

 

[Poursuivant]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1681716353059758083

View: https://twitter.com/medicinexthings/status/1681716353059758083

 

[Rob5091]

https://cyclinguptodate.com/cycling...d-him-you-are-not-going-home-this-is-the-tour
"Urka Zigart suffered a crash at the Giro Donne, suffering a concussion, and on the same day Tadej Pogacar was dramatically dropped by Jonas Vingegaard on the Col de Marie Blanque, losing over a minute. On that day Tadej Pogacar was in a bad place mentally and his fiancée Urka Zigart talks of how she convinced him to stay in the race on that day.

“He called me after the stage to ask me how it went. I told him it wasn't over. Then he asked me why not, he knows I never quit a race," Zigart said in an interview with NOS. "So he got worried right away. He said: I want to go home. So I told him: you are not going home, this is the Tour." After Zigart was released from the hospital her situation was stable and she began her recovery."

Pogacar's mind has understandably been elsewhere. Today's stage 17 meltdown must be the result of an illness, fatigue or the crash, or maybe a bit of all three. If he's sick, I would not be surprised if he's a DNS later in the Tour. Shame for him, and the team, but there are more races later in the year.