Teams & Riders Tadej Pogačar discussion thread

[Samu Cuenca]

I was not the one claiming becoming the world's best footballer is somehow easy. Although, on how hard can it really be? To kick a ball.



Might be, then again you might be wrong on this? That is, amongst all the people in the world, you being the one. Throwing an object the furthest. Now don't give me that excuse, on how everybody rides a bike and nobody throws things. It's the opposite. Kids don't start with the ball, to play football, they don't start with a bicycle. Way before all of that they throw things. All of us have done it. At some point in our lives. Throw a rock as far as we could.

Nobody came even close to Čeh. At the same time some of us for sure perfectly capable of beating Pogi. For like a second or two. But still. Much closer, then Čeh.

Those are indeed words.

 

[CyclistAbi]

Yes, I watch athletics so I have seen him.

A fan. Good.

And of course I'm biased

Nothing wrong with that.

but there are tons of books written on cycling, none about freaking discus throwing.

It's way too simple. You pick it up and throw. Why would you write a book about that? And look up what
Discobolus is. The tradition of this sport going thousands of years back.

Your trick about exchanging in Ceh and discus throwing in my phrase doesn't work because nobody (read: much fewer people) cares about discus throwing and it's simply not an interesting enough sport to make its best competitors anywhere near cycling's best in the public eye.

We somehow established already. That popularity of some sport shouldn't really be the main metric here. And the claim, not made by you, on how, if the sport is more popular, on how that makes it harder, to become dominant. This is in my opinion rather moot point. For example in cycling. Having top 3 in GC GT is already majestic. And if you add a million more cyclists into the equation. Not much will change. So in a sport like throwing, selection is made at a very young age. And only the elite is then competing. The rest can never develop enough. They throw way too less to begin with.

Now, I assume you had a similar discussion last year on the forum.discusthrowernews.com but in reverse, so I think I will be putting this down now so it will not become too repetitive for you.

No. But i supported both Kozmus and Čeh. When they won Slovenian sportsmen of the year award. Due to their sport achievements and at that point being the best. Out of all male Slovenians competing in some sport.

 

[shadowrider]

After the Emirates team selections for the Giro and the Tour.....
As I have often mentioned. Almeida did the wrong choice to leave Lefevere or not to go to another team than Emirates (or Jumbo). I predicted that he would end as a "domestique" of Pogacar. And so it happened, or at least from the Tour 24. Our Portuguese friends in particular reacted very irritated to this. Almeida is a fantastic allrounder. But just a little too weak in climbing and time trial to compete with the best. Or to be played as the leader. I guess they'll admit that now. Almeida will become an exellent helper. Ayuso risks the same. Although he is a better climber and time trialist than Almeida, and still very young. But I expected better from him in climbing during last season. Working for Pogacar at the age of 22 is ok. But from 2025 he should be the leader at one of the Grand Tours, and able to win. Otherwise, his career will go in the same direction as Almeida's.

 

[Froome]

After the Emirates team selections for the Giro and the Tour.....
As I have often mentioned. Almeida did the wrong choice to leave Lefevere or not to go to another team than Emirates (or Jumbo). I predicted that he would end as a "domestique" of Pogacar. And so it happened, or at least from the Tour 24. Our Portuguese friends in particular reacted very irritated to this. Almeida is a fantastic allrounder. But just a little too weak in climbing and time trial to compete with the best. Or to be played as the leader. I guess they'll admit that now. Almeida will become an exellent helper. Ayuso risks the same. Although he is a better climber and time trialist than Almeida, and still very young. But I expected better from him in climbing during last season. Working for Pogacar at the age of 22 is ok. But from 2025 he should be the leader at one of the Grand Tours, and able to win. Otherwise, his career will go in the same direction as Almeida's.

It was also a big mistake almeida leave quick step, because he was improving so much there. He even was winning races in quick step.

 

[Lequack]

 

[AmRacer]

It was also a big mistake almeida leave quick step, because he was improving so much there. He even was winning races in quick step.

Almeida didn't want babysitt Remco.

 

[Froome]

Almeida didn't want babysitt Remco.

Now he will "babysitt" at least pogacar, and let's see if he will not "babysitt", in the future ayuso and yates. Let's not forget yates did podium in the last Tour.

He was improving a lot in quick step, and he could had been in the Tour france, in 2022 and 2023 with freedom for the GC if he had stayed on quick step. Remco wasn't and is not going to every race.

 

[Peyroteo94]

I think it was a terrible move to ride Giro-Tour this year... The route is perfect for him and Wout will not be in the Tour to help Vingegaard. A shame for me, now all 3 GT's (bar crashes) have a obvious winner prior to the race.

 

[Elos Anjos]

After the Emirates team selections for the Giro and the Tour.....
As I have often mentioned. Almeida did the wrong choice to leave Lefevere or not to go to another team than Emirates (or Jumbo). I predicted that he would end as a "domestique" of Pogacar. And so it happened, or at least from the Tour 24. Our Portuguese friends in particular reacted very irritated to this. Almeida is a fantastic allrounder. But just a little too weak in climbing and time trial to compete with the best. Or to be played as the leader. I guess they'll admit that now. Almeida will become an exellent helper. Ayuso risks the same. Although he is a better climber and time trialist than Almeida, and still very young. But I expected better from him in climbing during last season. Working for Pogacar at the age of 22 is ok. But from 2025 he should be the leader at one of the Grand Tours, and able to win. Otherwise, his career will go in the same direction as Almeida's.

It was also a big mistake almeida leave quick step, because he was improving so much there. He even was winning races in quick step.

Now he will "babysitt" at least pogacar, and let's see if he will not "babysitt", in the future ayuso and yates. Let's not forget yates did podium in the last Tour.

He was improving a lot in quick step, and he could had been in the Tour france, in 2022 and 2023 with freedom for the GC if he had stayed on quick step. Remco wasn't and is not going to every race.

Glad you let us know about your important ouevre.

I'm again baffled by the arrogance that users display regarding all they don't know regarding what goes on between teams and riders and their contracts. Almeida was/is the best person in the world to judge about his choices and development and he chose UAE.

Still, after his podium in the Giro we now see the off-season fairy tale of "Almeida was better at Quickstep". By UAE throwing all their cards in the Tour this is apparently evidence that Almeida has permanently become a domestique...Spanish and Portuguese media frame the question more evenly, underlining the excitement that is being in the Tour.

And even though in August and September we saw a Tour and Giro winner working for Kuss, we are still witnessing these lazy and sloppy thinking that riders with GC capabilities like Almeida and Ayuso are either unquestioned leaders or domestiques.

 

[Salvarani]

Now he will "babysitt" at least pogacar, and let's see if he will not "babysitt", in the future ayuso and yates. Let's not forget yates did podium in the last Tour.

He was improving a lot in quick step, and he could had been in the Tour france, in 2022 and 2023 with freedom for the GC if he had stayed on quick step. Remco wasn't and is not going to every race.

I guess it is different when you think you are better than your leader... in comparison to when you know the leader is better.

 

[Froome]

I guess it is different when you think you are better than your leader... in comparison to when you know the leader is better.

I think he never thought he was better than Remco, because clearly is not, not even now or in the past.

 

[Salvarani]

I think he never thought he was better than Remco, because clearly is not, not even now or in the past.

He finished 2nd in the Giro and 9th in the Vuelta. What were Remcos GC-results in the GTs this season?

 

[Froome]

He finished 2nd in the Giro and 9th in the Vuelta. What were Remcos GC-results in the GTs this season?

He finished 3rd in the Giro, against weak competition even after crashes or covid of guys like tao hart, remco, vlasov.

Remco already won a GT, unfortunately he had bad luck with covid in the Giro when he was in the lead.

I'm not the biggest fan of Remco, but he clearly is better than almeida in everything. Grand tours, one week races, one day races, Remco has better results in everything.

 

[SHAD0W93]

He finished 3rd in the Giro, against weak competition even after crashes or covid of guys like tao hart, remco, vlasov.

Remco already won a GT, unfortunately he had bad luck with covid in the Giro when he was in the lead.

I'm not the biggest fan of Remco, but he clearly is better than almeida in everything than almeida. Grand tours, one week races, one day races, Remco has better results in everything.

And he was also really sick in the Vuelta and without that he finishes 4th or 5th.

 

[AmRacer]

He finished 3rd in the Giro, against weak competition even after crashes or covid of guys like tao hart, remco, vlasov.

Remco already won a GT, unfortunately he had bad luck with covid in the Giro when he was in the lead.

I'm not the biggest fan of Remco, but he clearly is better than almeida in everything than almeida. Grand tours, one week races, one day races, Remco has better results in everything.

How would you rate the competition at the Vuelta Remco won? If you compare with Alemdias 3rd place Giro.

 

[Froome]

How would you rate the competition at the Vuelta Remco won? If you compare with Alemdias 3rd place Giro.

The competition also wasn't that great in the vuelta 2022, but Remco won the race, almeida didn't won the Giro this year, or any GT until now.

 

[AmRacer]

The competition also wasn't that great in the vuelta 2022, but Remco won the race, almeida didn't won the Giro this year, or any GT until now.

But those who finished at first and second are great riders. Neither Remco or Almeida have finished ahead of them.

 

[Froome]

But those who finished at first and second are great riders. Neither Remco or Almeida have finished ahead of them.

I disagree. I don't think the level presented by roglic and thomas on this year's Giro was superior to the level presented by Mas and roglic(before his crash) in the vuelta 2022.

I think Remco could had been superior to the level presented by roglic and thomas in the Giro, but he had some bad luck, but bad luck it's part of the race, roglic deserved to win even if things could had been different with Tao and Remco in the race until the end.

 

[AmRacer]

I disagree. I don't think the level presented by roglic and thomas on this year's Giro was superior to the level presented by Mas and roglic(before his crash) in the vuelta 2022.

I think Remco could had been superior to the level presented by roglic and thomas in the Giro, but he had some bad luck, but bad luck it's part of the race, roglic deserved to win even if things could had been different with Tao and Remco in the race until the end.

Yeah, Rogla had bad luck. Remco had bad luck. Who else had bad luck?
Bad luck is part of the sport, crashes, illnesses.... I agree with that.

Almeida finished ahed of Remco twice, due to bad luck. At least one time.
Remco and Almeida are best of the rest. Neither of them have finished ahead of
G, Rogla, Poggi and Jonas. Yet.
Don't think G will reach same level next year.

 

[Froome]

Yeah, Rogla had bad luck. Remco had bad luck. Who else had bad luck?
Bad luck is part of the sport, crashes, illnesses.... I agree with that.

Almeida finished ahed of Remco twice, due to bad luck. At least one time.
Remco and Almeida are best of the rest. Neither of them have finished ahead of
G, Rogla, Poggi and Jonas. Yet.
Don't think G will reach same level next year.

Remco already finished ahead of roglic in the vuelta 2022.

That's true that Remco on the vuelta of this year disappointed, but like i said, let's not forget that he already won a GT, almeida not. Remco also showed in the vuelta 2022 a level superior to the best level almeida achieved in grand tours.

My ranking in terms of grand Tours at the moment is:

1-vingegaard
2-pogacar
3-roglic
4-Remco

After this four, we have 6/7 guys with a similar level, in my opinion.

 

[Oldermanish]

Now he will "babysitt" at least pogacar, and let's see if he will not "babysitt", in the future ayuso and yates. Let's not forget yates did podium in the last Tour.

He was improving a lot in quick step, and he could had been in the Tour france, in 2022 and 2023 with freedom for the GC if he had stayed on quick step. Remco wasn't and is not going to every race.

Pogacar races like a grown human. He hasn't needed much babysitting since he got on a bike and appears happy most of the time. He has few tantrums and is generous with his sportsmanship.

 

[VayaVayaVaya]

Not courageous to attempt the double?

Stopped reading after that.

Pogacar knows deep inside that he will not win the Tour if he goes to the Giro. He will not have pressure of winning in the Tour, if he wins the Giro. The pressure will be all on vingegaard and on roglic(because he never won and he is 34).

It's not an attempt. It's a smart choice of somebody that doesn't want a third year without winning a GT. Do you really think he believes so much in winning the double, when he can't win just the Tour?

I don’t see how this is so controversial. I am a huge Pogi fan and do not think less of him for it, but he is clearly hedging next season. I would say it is more “courageous” of Remco and Roglic to go all in on the Tour given the long odds of them winning it. That doesn’t make me think less of Pogi for it, though, and I definitely think he could pull the double off.

Also, this quote from a recent article is pretty funny:

“I know myself well now, if nothing goes wrong in my head, I can do all three grand tours if I want. You don’t know until you try,” he said. “This is a good year to do 100 percent in Giro and 100 percent in Tour. I think it can be super good, or it can be just not so good.”

I know I can do it. You don’t know until you try. It can be super good. It can be not so good.

 

[Salvarani]

I don’t see how this is so controversial. I am a huge Pogi fan and do not think less of him for it, but he is clearly hedging next season. I would say it is more “courageous” of Remco and Roglic to go all in on the Tour given the long odds of them winning it. That doesn’t make me think less of Pogi for it, though, and I definitely think he could pull the double off.

Also, this quote from a recent article is pretty funny:

“I know myself well now, if nothing goes wrong in my head, I can do all three grand tours if I want. You don’t know until you try,” he said. “This is a good year to do 100 percent in Giro and 100 percent in Tour. I think it can be super good, or it can be just not so good.”

I know I can do it. You don’t know until you try. It can be super good. It can be not so good.

Cool, dont agree.

 

[acm]

Remco already finished ahead of roglic in the vuelta 2022.

Actually he didn't. Because Roglič didn't finish that Vuelta.

 

[SHAD0W93]

Actually he didn't. Because Roglič didn't finish that Vuelta.

Who’s fault was that when he was already behind Evenepoel?