Team Astana's shameful legacy

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keeponrollin said:
Indeed.

I'm sure for his 2nd term as President he'll be relentlessly pursuing exactly the same issues he failed to fix from his first term. :rolleyes: ;)
Yes, bringing credibility back to the UCI and his manifesto looks truly amazing:

• Rebuild trust in the UCI – OK, ummm are you sure about this? Froome, Menchov?
• Transform anti-doping in cycling – In house and swept under the rug.
• Grow cycling across the globe – Out of China and extra races into Britain, good job, I say old chap.
• Develop women’s cycling – By not giving them minimum wage but telling them what to wear.
• Overhaul elite road cycling – By putting cameras on bikes and handing over TV rights to Sky TV.
• Strengthen cycling’s credibility and influence within the Olympic Movement – By allowing the Russians to dope like crazy and give the British athletes a pass on blood tests.
 
thehog said:
Yes, bringing credibility back to the UCI and his manifesto looks truly amazing:

• Rebuild trust in the UCI – OK, ummm are you sure about this? Froome, Menchov?
• Transform anti-doping in cycling – In house and swept under the rug.
• Grow cycling across the globe – Out of China and extra races into Britain, good job, I say old chap.
• Develop women’s cycling – By not giving them minimum wage but telling them what to wear.
• Overhaul elite road cycling – By putting cameras on bikes and handing over TV rights to Sky TV.
• Strengthen cycling’s credibility and influence within the Olympic Movement – By allowing the Russians to dope like crazy and give the British athletes a pass on blood tests.

Awww.

Give the guy a break. Only 1.5* of this years GTs were won by Dopers.

* We'll find out in 10 years time if this number needs to be adjusted up to 2.
 
DirtyWorks said:
Yay!

Vino has set up his on CIRC. Come speak with me on doping problems in cycling, then we drink.

Vinokourov did manage a joke about his situation. "I heard that I made a transfusion with my father's blood," Vinokourov said. "That's absurd, I can tell you that with his blood, I would have tested positive for vodka."
http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/road/2007/tour07/news/?id=/news/2007/jul07/jul25news5
 
Aug 15, 2012
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It's pretty easy... Doping sanction? Your done. No riding and no support staff position. Make it retroactive and things get cleaner very quickly.
 
Sep 20, 2011
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Hugh Januss said:
It never ceases to amaze me how some can single out 1 team or 1 rider as "the biggest crook, worst doper" whatever. You better get with Foxxy because the biggest crook in cycling is named Chris Horner. Seriously though, this story names riders from Astana, Lampre, and Katusha and what you get from it is Astana is utter scum? The biggest thing that I take away from this investigation is that it shows BMC, Sky, Saxo etc. must be working with someone other than Ferrari, oh yeah and Horner too. I guess that Ferrari doesn't have the market cornered as he once did.
Astana = mafia = crooks. I didn't say worst doper and it's exactly that example your entire argument is build upon. Classy.

But anyway, Nibali and Aru will be next and all the cycling fans can say they never saw it c0o0o0o0o0ming bcuz Vino said they had nothing to hide.
 
Der Effe said:
Astana = mafia = crooks. I didn't say worst doper and it's exactly that example your entire argument is build upon. Classy.

But anyway, Nibali and Aru will be next and all the cycling fans can say they never saw it c0o0o0o0o0ming bcuz Vino said they had nothing to hide.
Originally Posted by Der Effe View Post
About time this team full of utter scum and home of the biggest crook in the history of cycling, Vinokourov, get what they deserve.
Interested to hear why you think Vino is a bigger crook than Armstrong, Riis, or Hein and Pat just for a few examples. If Vino is in fact the "biggest crook in the history of cycling" there has got to be a knifes edge of difference, so what is it that you perceive as putting Vino over the top as compared to all the other crooks in the history of cycling? Did he dope to win the TDF as many times as Indurain or Armstrong? Did he even dope to win the TDF as many times as Landis? Or did he dope to win the TDF exactly as many times as Tyler and his twin put together?:rolleyes:
 
Jun 30, 2012
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Astana probably accounted for some huge share of the increase in UCI turnover since 2008. Hard to turn away your best customer when your are trying to grow the business.

Mind you with the oil price on the rocks KZH may not be the future money spinner it once was. Astana may have timed it just right, win the Tour (ignoring the Johan/Lance/ Bertie mess to one side) and then leave cycling behind.
 
Apr 16, 2014
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Hugh Januss said:
Interested to hear why you think Vino is a bigger crook than Armstrong, Riis, or Hein and Pat just for a few examples. If Vino is in fact the "biggest crook in the history of cycling" there has got to be a knifes edge of difference, so what is it that you perceive as putting Vino over the top as compared to all the other crooks in the history of cycling? Did he dope to win the TDF as many times as Indurain or Armstrong? Did he even dope to win the TDF as many times as Landis? Or did he dope to win the TDF exactly as many times as Tyler and his twin put together?:rolleyes:
imo, it would be a tough call to place Vinokourov over Armstrong as the biggest crook in cycling. but it would be interesting to hear Der Effe's argument in favor of it. maybe a clinic poll? and include names of McQuaid, Verbruggen and you name it in the poll...

Hein Verbruggen was someone i had to look up. i wasn't following cycling when he was UCI president but i remebered reading news about his name and issues with Lance. Verbruggen was emphatic in his opinion that Lance was the biggest crook in the history of cycling and he (Hein) at the same time, vehemently and repeatedly, in a manner reminiscent of Clinton lying about Lewinsky, denied knowing anything about Lance's doping during his term as UCI pres. i googled for the article and found something a bit more recent in Feb 14. interesting to read Verbruggen in the Telegraph from a year ago - posting it in case Der Effe missed it:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/othersports/cycling/lancearmstrong/10524376/Lance-Armstrong-has-an-agenda-made-my-life-a-misery-says-former-UCI-president-Hein-Verbruggen.html

i can relate to Der Effe's angst and desire to see his candidate for biggest crook, Vino, taken down - that's exactly how i felt about Lance after TdF 2009. but as we see, getting Lance was not as big a remedy as hoped, not that it wasn't a significant step in the right direction.

Vino and it sounds like Nibali as well, won't go away quietly. It's a mess -heads will roll. Cookson might mean well, but moving forward as quickly as many here would like and living up to promises for a cleaner sport is complicated with dirty secrets and consequences on all sides. Nibali hinted as much when he said there is more to this, not that he would name names, well, right now, anyway.

i'm feeling sufficiently cynical by now and no names will surprise me, even my favorite(s). but i sure will be depressed if Aru is included, as Der Effe mentions.:(
 
Jul 11, 2013
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My view is, that Astana is dirty to the very core...
Why?

Well for me -Vino is the answer.. He showed HOG the door!!
Someone able to do that, combined with his own "legacy" is bound to push and cross boundaries.. Why on earth should an expert like Vino suddenly become saint??? And why is all his crappy riders doping, getting caught for trying to get a place in his top-doped a-team... Ludicrous!!

He is not the only bad guy here, but he is certainly one playing the game to the max.... Only he seems, unlike Riss to have no qualms over throwing employees under the bus.. That is one of the main reasons he has problems today imo... Look at how the Riis camp is protecting Roman K....

Vino doesn't give a ****.. And he says they have nothing too hide..
Of course they don't, for everyone with half a brain it is pretty obvious what is and has gone on for the last decade plus some...

He is just so blatantly obvious, and doesn't even care...
 
Hugh Januss said:
Interested to hear why you think Vino is a bigger crook than Armstrong, Riis, or Hein and Pat just for a few examples. If Vino is in fact the "biggest crook in the history of cycling" there has got to be a knifes edge of difference, so what is it that you perceive as putting Vino over the top as compared to all the other crooks in the history of cycling? Did he dope to win the TDF as many times as Indurain or Armstrong? Did he even dope to win the TDF as many times as Landis? Or did he dope to win the TDF exactly as many times as Tyler and his twin put together?:rolleyes:
Yeah, didn't dope enough to win the TdF. Must be an okay guy then.

lol
 
mrhender said:
....

He is just so blatantly obvious, and doesn't even care...
Because neither his revenue provider nor the UCI want clean-ish racing. Vino is the embodiment of the UCI.

He is so direct that fans that pretend the sport has a shred of integrity are mad at the guy for 'ripping the band-aid off quickly.'.

The guy is brilliant. He is beating the UCI at their own maze of rules so badly they cannot blacklist the guy. It pleased me to see him make the sport's administrators out to be the joke they are.

Vino 4ever!
 
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