Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

[Benotti69]

Why would you need to pull riders for doping related reasons if you were protected? Or are we now saying that Sky aren't protected?

Doping can go wrong. See PDM

And why, Benotti, would you need to pull riders for fear of dope tests, when you are always telling us that the dope tests don't work/aren't enforced? Or are we now saying that they do work?

Did i say fear of dope testing? Dont think so. Bad blood, bad PEDs, bad doctoring plenty of reasons for doping to go wrong. plenty of examples in the sport too.

I've no objection to people presenting interesting and challenging questions about Sky, but maybe you should get your stories straight before accusing others.

"never tested positive"...you should get some wrist band thing going....

Just saying...

Just like the Armstrong fans were always jus sayin........

 

[Benotti69]

Oli Cookson has a 4 year contract with Sky.

No conflict of interest at all.........

http://www.gazzetta.it/Ciclismo/29-04-2014/cookson-figlio-presidente-uci-oliver-brian-sergio-henao-team-sky-80544217918.shtml

 

[wansteadimp]

However, their explanations for Froome's withdrawals fall flat. For example, he's out with a stomach virus and then comes back 3 days later killing the field. He's either killing the field with a stomach virus still in his system, making it more shocking, or they're lying about the stomach virus.

Or your making up the stomach virus, mild chest infection for LBL and bad back for Tirreno.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/10791833/Chris-Froome-targets-Tour-of-Romandy-after-withdrawing-from-Liege-Bastogne-Liege.html

 

[BigChain]

i actually can't work out what you mean...

i'm not referring to their doping programme...I am, as per red flanders above, very surprised that they overlook such basics as sharing confined spaces with ill people whilst all the while eschewing nutella, bringing their own pillows and exploring their inner chimp...

you might even call it....unbelievable ;-)

Everyone knows that it's not possible to catch colds or viruses in airports, train stations, walking around on the streets, from your friends over coffee, from your family. Never in the history of evolution have people been struck down by viruses at the same time or over an extended 3 month period. One of the reasons the Roman Army was so successful in conquering Europe was they never got colds or viruses. They were on a program of marginal gains. Worked for them, works for SKY. So SKY must be doping because everyone is getting sick at the same time, a phenomenon which is completely unheard of.

 

[the sceptic]

I have to check with Benotti but I doubt the Roman Army was cleans.

 

[autologous]

Of course it's suspicious. It's not like the common cold or a virus is contagious. Getting sick for 2 or more weeks is just unheard of in the normal populace. Colds and viruses never spread like wild fire. That's just a lie propagated by SKY. And let's face it, pro riders at the peak of their fitness have the best immune systems known to science. They never get sick. And if they do get sick and then start training 800 to 1,000 ks again and get sick again they're just whimps. Yep, all of them are doping.

Everyone knows that it's not possible to catch colds or viruses in airports, train stations, walking around on the streets, from your friends over coffee, from your family. Never in the history of evolution have people been struck down by viruses at the same time or over an extended 3 month period. One of the reasons the Roman Army was so successful in conquering Europe was they never got colds or viruses. They were on a program of marginal gains. Worked for them, works for SKY. So SKY must be doping because everyone is getting sick at the same time, a phenomenon which is completely unheard of.

wow, your point wasn't clear the first time so you just had to repeat yourself?

If it happens all the time, surely you must be able to rattle off 5 or 6 or 10 dominant cycling teams that have gone through this amount of withdrawals due to various "illnesses".

I know your list must be 50 or 60 long, but just give us a few - to save yourself some time maybe just limit it to the teams that were trumpeting their levels of cleanliness and hand washing and risk avoidance and their use of custom pillows as reasons why they were so dominant.

Or, if you've got nothing, you could just repeat yourself again.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

wow, your point wasn't clear the first time so you just had to repeat yourself?

If it happens all the time, surely you must be able to rattle off 5 or 6 or 10 dominant cycling teams that have gone through this amount of withdrawals due to various "illnesses".

I know your list must be 50 or 60 long, but just give us a few - to save yourself some time maybe just limit it to the teams that were trumpeting their levels of cleanliness and hand washing and risk avoidance and their use of custom pillows as reasons why they were so dominant.

Or, if you've got nothing, you could just repeat yourself again.

Of the 50 to 60 teams that you list, could you put an asterisk next to the ones who have publicly bragged about their ability to wash their hands, and how that differentiates them from the teams they are dominating at the time?

At least this time it's dribs and drabs pre-race, rather than half the team in the first few days of a GT ala 2010 Vuelta.

 

[BigChain]

wow, your point wasn't clear the first time so you just had to repeat yourself?

If it happens all the time, surely you must be able to rattle off 5 or 6 or 10 dominant cycling teams that have gone through this amount of withdrawals due to various "illnesses".

I know your list must be 50 or 60 long, but just give us a few - to save yourself some time maybe just limit it to the teams that were trumpeting their levels of cleanliness and hand washing and risk avoidance and their use of custom pillows as reasons why they were so dominant.

Or, if you've got nothing, you could just repeat yourself again.

Gee whiz. I thought the whole point of the Clinic forum was to repeat yourself ad nauseam with puerile argument with no facts. I am however, in case you didn't get the point, facetiously suggesting that illness is a credible reason why SKY have so many riders off their game. I don't doubt for one minute that some of the team members will be doping.

 

[the sceptic]

Oli Cookson has a 4 year contract with Sky.

No conflict of interest at all.........

http://www.gazzetta.it/Ciclismo/29-04-2014/cookson-figlio-presidente-uci-oliver-brian-sergio-henao-team-sky-80544217918.shtml

Dont forget the picture

 

[Dear Wiggo]

Dont forget the picture

And the Jaguar advertisement:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CIYSzKBqowI

 

[red_flanders]

Or your making up the stomach virus, mild chest infection for LBL and bad back for Tirreno.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/10791833/Chris-Froome-targets-Tour-of-Romandy-after-withdrawing-from-Liege-Bastogne-Liege.html

No! No way!

 

[gooner]

Oli Cookson has a 4 year contract with Sky.

No conflict of interest at all.........

http://www.gazzetta.it/Ciclismo/29-04-2014/cookson-figlio-presidente-uci-oliver-brian-sergio-henao-team-sky-80544217918.shtml

He was with them before Brian went for the presidency. What's he meant to do? Leave the role he got because of Brian succeeding in his campaign.

Come on. He's more than entitled to work in the sport.

We have other things to criticise Sky with Leinders and so on but now Oli Cookson is added to it.

I'm convinced some people are now looking for a story.

 

[Archibald]

Doping can go wrong. See PDM

so much for his reading Tyler's book, unless he skipped the part about the bad bag...


pehaps their doctors aren't that good - not hiring docs who've previous experience in certain areas may well be backfiring on them?

 

[stutue]

Doping can go wrong. See PDM

Did i say fear of dope testing? Dont think so. Bad blood, bad PEDs, bad doctoring plenty of reasons for doping to go wrong. plenty of examples in the sport too.

Righto. So....not pulling riders for fear of testing because tests don't work , and even if they did Sky are protected by the UCI.

Therefore Sky are pulling a whole bunch of riders because of an unspecified 'doping error', even though some of the riders seem to have been affected at different times and for different lengths of time.

Ok

never tested positive"...you should get some wrist band thing going....

Why the nasty little snarky comments? (And a strawman)

 

[bobbins]

He was with them before Brian went for the presidency. What's he meant to do? Leave the role he got because of Brian succeeding in his campaign.

Come on. He's more than entitled to work in the sport.

We have other things to criticise Sky with Leinders and so on but now Oli Cookson is added to it.

I'm convinced some people are now looking for a story.

He did only get the job because of who his dad is but I think that's as far as it goes. He was an unemployed amateur bike rider riding for an f grade spanish team living in spain. He has a secondary language which I guess is what they needed. He's worked with a mate of mine and is a decent hard working bloke by all accounts.

 

[martinvickers]

He was with them before Brian went for the presidency. What's he meant to do? Leave the role he got because of Brian succeeding in his campaign.

Come on. He's more than entitled to work in the sport.

We have other things to criticise Sky with Leinders and so on but now Oli Cookson is added to it.

I'm convinced some people are now looking for a story.

Now? As in 'not before'?

Really??

 

[Netserk]

He was with them before Brian went for the presidency. What's he meant to do? Leave the role he got because of Brian succeeding in his campaign.

Come on. He's more than entitled to work in the sport.

We have other things to criticise Sky with Leinders and so on but now Oli Cookson is added to it.

I'm convinced some people are now looking for a story.

I'm convinced some people do their best not to see the story

 

[gooner]

Now? As in 'not before'?

Really??

True. That has been the case for sometime.

Loved how this came back up like a magic wand when this fact has been known for a considerable time.

I'm convinced some people do their best not to see the story

What story is that? You mean Oli Cookson, who was with Sky before his father ran for the presidency.

 

[Netserk]

It was a general comment, not related to Oli.

 

[gooner]

It was a general comment, not related to Oli.

Fair enough and there's other things to discuss on Sky that are more appropriate and warrant further attention.

Not directed at yourself but what do people want on this by flagging it up? Do they want him out of the cycling?

I find it unacceptable for people if they want this to happen when the person in question has never been embroiled in doping in the past.

 

[Catwhoorg]

What story is that? You mean Oli Cookson, who was with Sky before his father ran for the presidency.

People want a (supposedly) decent hardworking guy could be terminated because his father changes jobs.

Now that's actually the situation where I live (the 'right to work' state of Georgia, where you can be terminated for any (or no) reason except discrimination against a protected category.

Rightly that goes against EU and UK employment law.


Plus it wasn't a secret during his run.
Why is it an issue all of a sudden now ?



I understand the potential for a conflict of interests, but all you can do is declare them and do the right thing (and be seen to be doing the right thing).

 

[Benotti69]

He was with them before Brian went for the presidency. What's he meant to do? Leave the role he got because of Brian succeeding in his campaign.

Come on. He's more than entitled to work in the sport.

We have other things to criticise Sky with Leinders and so on but now Oli Cookson is added to it.

I'm convinced some people are now looking for a story.

You dont see a conflict of interest?

Hmmm, wanna buy some snakeoil, it cures all ills.............

 

[Benotti69]

Righto. So....not pulling riders for fear of testing because tests don't work , and even if they did Sky are protected by the UCI.

Therefore Sky are pulling a whole bunch of riders because of an unspecified 'doping error', even though some of the riders seem to have been affected at different times and for different lengths of time.

Ok

Keep up with the pulling riders for fear of testing argument i never made.

It is ok to be a Sky fan, really, not need to come here to try and justify it. Enjoy your rapha gear, ride like Wiggins, Froome (or not if dont want your elbows taken off by a passing vehicle) and be happy.


Some Sky fans really think Sky invented the sport and that every sky do or experience is the 1st time it has happened. Illness to multiple riders with a small team of doctors is never down to natural causes. If it was the doctors are off the Simpsons, "Hi everybody.."

A team that leaves no stone unturned, manages the details down to the last iota has riders dropping like flies!! Doping.

 

[Mellow Velo]

Keep up with the pulling riders for fear of testing argument i never made.

It is ok to be a Sky fan, really, not need to come here to try and justify it. Enjoy your rapha gear, ride like Wiggins, Froome (or not if dont want your elbows taken off by a passing vehicle) and be happy.


Some Sky fans really think Sky invented the sport and that every sky do or experience is the 1st time it has happened. Illness to multiple riders with a small team of doctors is never down to natural causes. If it was the doctors are off the Simpsons, "Hi everybody.."

A team that leaves no stone unturned, manages the details down to the last iota has riders dropping like flies!! Doping.

You are referring to bunches of riders falling sick at the same time, during races.
Not what is happening here.

 

[TailWindHome]

It takes a special type of loon to believe that Cookson's son being at Sky gives them some sort of special influence.

You know, more than the 30 years worth of connections within British Cycling and the Sky set up.

Passing messages to Brailsford via Oli


*chuckle*