Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

[veganrob]

the sport has probably lost millions already in sponsorship due to the golden boy admitting what he done , if this mob ever get under suspicion and proved of wrong doings it will kill the sport for good . if the sponsorship money dries up thats it , the party is over !!

SKY portray themselves as the cleanest team on the planet and i hope they are , but if the day ever comes where its found its all an act , then its bye bye cycling forever cos what sponsors in there right mind want to be connected with a sport that is so drug fuelled .

im a true fan of cycling and i pray it never happens but i just have trouble believing anything is 100% true in this sport anymore .

Oh come on. Buck up little guy. Cycling will survive without Sky.

And BTW, that thing about the sun never setting on the British empire. It is not true

 

[Grandillusion]

agree with you (and Hitch) on this one.

to claim any findings on Wiggins would be a death knell for cycling is absurd. very few outside of Britain (aside from those who follow the sport), know who he is.

My point is that coming fast on the heels of the Armstrong debacle, regardless of the relative fame or otherwise of Wiggins abroad, this story would be huge and the sport would suffer a massive massive blow. Seems obvious to me.

 

[Mellow Velo]

Why the anger?

Take out your frustrations on Dave Brailsford.

He’s the one who hires a Doctor who has a penchant for injecting young men with EPO.

Not me.

Sorry.

No, you have a penchant for injecting old threads with Exaggerated Preposterous Opinion.

 

[thehog]

Getting back to Lienders. It appears Dekker is going to drop a bombshell to the Dutch Cycling Federation on what really went on in the Rabo years. I will be wincing at the detail but will be greatly concerned if Dekker tells if the doping use was widespread and if many people were aware of Leinders role at Rabo.

I’ll reserve judgment on Sky for the time being but it doesn’t look good. Especially in the light of what Froome and Wiggins did last year. Their performances were very unusual to say the least.

 

[Benotti69]

My point is that coming fast on the heels of the Armstrong debacle, regardless of the relative fame or otherwise of Wiggins abroad, this story would be huge and the sport would suffer a massive massive blow. Seems obvious to me.

I doubt it. Festina scandal didn't kill the sport. Wiggins found out to be doping wont kill it either.

Look how many posters in the road racing section of this forum will never discuss doping in cycling and continue to enjoy the sport as if the doping doesn't exist.

Look at the Olympics FFS if ever there was a drug fest it is that, but it grows.

 

[hrotha]

I’ll reserve judgment on Sky for the time being but it doesn’t look good. Especially in the light of what Froome and Wiggins did last year. Their performances were very unusual to say the least.

Hahahaha, oh dear.

 

[thirteen]

My point is that coming fast on the heels of the Armstrong debacle, regardless of the relative fame or otherwise of Wiggins abroad, this story would be huge and the sport would suffer a massive massive blow. Seems obvious to me.

how long have you followed cycling?

 

[red_flanders]

A warning for those attacking the poster instead of arguing the post. Next step will certainly be sanctions, as some of us are not getting the message. This also applies to those who point out "poster not post" when they're talking about someone else, yet attack the poster when it's their turn.

This isn't optional or a suggestion. This is your warning. Please, we can do better than this. Thanks.

 

[Joachim]

I’ll reserve judgment on Sky for the time being

Well, I take my hat off to you. It takes real bravery to change your position like this after having spent so long vehemently asserting as fact that there is a team wide doping programme at Sky and that Wiggins is a client of notorious doping doctor Ferrari.

I'm glad that you are finally seeing the light and aligning with my agnostic position.

Well done. You are a bigger man for it

 

[Grandillusion]

how long have you followed cycling?

You know the answer to that! Always had a "romantic" peripheral interest since first watching LeMond & Hinault years ago, but lost interest when Indurain was crushing.

Fully aware of Festina and rumours over years filtering through on Armstrong.

I'll shut up if it keeps you happy though

 

[shades1]

Oh come on. Buck up little guy. Cycling will survive without Sky.

And BTW, that thing about the sun never setting on the British empire. It is not true

dunno what your 2nd line of comment is about but nevermind that .

i dont think you are quite getting what im trying to say , if the big sponsors pull the plug {and with much more bad publicity they will} the game is over !!

where is the money going to come from to continue ? you ? me ? , this sport does not have stadiums that have paying customers , it does not sell merchandise in the same vain as football .

the damage LA has done already is huge , we are yet to see the repercussions but believe me there are going to be plenty , and if SKY was to be found of similar wrong doings it would have ripple affects through the sport like never been seen before .

 

[Dazed and Confused]

dunno what your 2nd line of comment is about but nevermind that .

i dont think you are quite getting what im trying to say , if the big sponsors pull the plug {and with much more bad publicity they will} the game is over !!

where is the money going to come from to continue ? you ? me ? , this sport does not have stadiums that have paying customers , it does not sell merchandise in the same vain as football .

the damage LA has done already is huge , we are yet to see the repercussions but believe me there are going to be plenty , and if SKY was to be found of similar wrong doings it would have ripple affects through the sport like never been seen before .

Lol, busting Sky will end up being a blip on the radar. The circus will continue.

 

[shades1]

Lol, busting Sky will end up being a blip on the radar. The circus will continue.

well lets hope we never find out , but thats impossible because peoples greed will be the downfall as we have already seen .

then we will see how big "the blip" as you call it takes its toll .

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

Go read his wikipedia page if you don't know his palmares. But he has won sprints over strong fields. To then turn around and lead the peloton up mountains in the TdF is not normal.

why is that not normal? because you think so? it happened in the 70s and 80s as well, which people seme to believe was very clean

 

[Libertine Seguros]

rasmussen was obvious yes. but there are no rasmussens in the current peloton.

Ivaïlo Gabrovski? Oh, sorry, I forgot. You thought he was clean.

26 year old rider with a thin palmares on the road, but with a track background breaks away from a strong peloton on a punchy climb, maintains the breakaway before sprinting away strongly from his fellow escapees from a long way out, riding for Sky.

Surprised G hasn't got it big from this place. Maybe because (on the basis of his win) he rides with some panache and nous and he hasn't called anyone a w*nker yet

As Darryl said, it's January. If he's doing this in April, maybe the TDU will be revisited as the start of something, but in the context of the here and now, it's a rider who showed talent at a young age winning a race against a field of people in the middle of their pre-season training. Hard to judge until we have a wider sample of performances in 2013.

Wiggins being found to be doping would be massive in the UK and probably petty much ruin the sport here (for a period at least) given the links between Sky and Track everything would be implicated, doubt it would be any more significant than any other GT/Tour winner in other places though.

This is why the Leinders deal has to be treated with great care, because while he was nothing to do with BC, the blurred links between Sky and BC mean that if any dirt on Sky actually sticks, it may have the knock-on effect of tarring the whole generation of track stars with the same brush because of the contact with the same individuals as at Sky.

However, while Sky being busted could be a hammer blow to the sport in the UK, it won't destroy the sport in places they love it, rather than places where it's a current fad and needs to entrench itself further before we can say for certain that it's anything more. It also depends how long we go before it happened, of course. It'd be a lot easier to kill the sport in Britain than it would be in Belgium. I doubt that the people who line the roadside in Oudenaarde and the surrounding villages in April would really give a flying one if Wiggins was busted, they'd still turn up and cheer the Classics hardmen on. The Basques will still brave the pouring rain to cheer their guys on, the Dutchmen will still be making idiots of themselves on Alpe d'Huez. In Britain, to all intents and purposes, Team Sky and its personnel are the sport (Cavendish excepted of course). In the rest of Europe, they're just a team that they're finding hard to beat at the moment.

 

[zalacain]

26 year old rider with a thin palmares on the road, but with a track background breaks away from a strong peloton on a punchy climb, maintains the breakaway before sprinting away strongly from his fellow escapees from a long way out, riding for Sky.

Surprised G hasn't got it big from this place. Maybe because (on the basis of his win) he rides with some panache and nous and he hasn't called anyone a w*nker yet

His training around Abergavenny when he was a kid would have made that ride well within his grasp. He was first over the Tourmalet once as well.

 

[Bexon30]

Lol, busting Sky will end up being a blip on the radar. The circus will continue.

Exactly. Shame the clowns just don't get it...

 

[shades1]

Exactly. Shame the clowns just don't get it...

yes your right , all the teams will survive on fresh air and grabbing money off trees when all the sponsors pull out when they are all implicated in supporting drugs .

what a pair u2 are lol .

 

[Libertine Seguros]

yes your right , all the teams will survive on fresh air and grabbing money off trees when all the sponsors pull out when they are all implicated in supporting drugs .

what a pair u2 are lol .

Sky being implicated in supporting drugs ≠ every team being implicated in supporting drugs. The big bucks teams may become fewer, but the sport won't die. Remember, Festina's sales actually went UP after the bust. I'd never heard of Christina Hembo and her watches before she started sponsoring Rasmussen.

 

[Joachim]

...not to mention Saxo bank are still about, despite having a Tour winner stripped of his win, and being owned and managed by a former pro who admitted his TdF win was doped. Cofidis are still about despite several doping scandals.

Sky might have an uber slick media operation, but if they succumbed to a major scandal such as a Wiggins bust, they might pull out but the sport will go on. The GB is still pretty insignificant when it comes to cycling. They might have the current TdF and Olympic TT champion, they might have last year's World Champion and a guy well on his way to being the most successful TdF stage winner ever, but as fans the GB are minnows.

 

[the asian]

...not to mention Saxo bank are still about, despite having a Tour winner stripped of his win, and being owned and managed by a former pro who was also stripped of his win. Cofidis are still about despite several doping scandals.

.

Riis wasn't stripped of his win.

If the sponsors continued after Festina, they will continue after Armstrong and any SKY Bust to happen.
The new found following for Cycling in Britain will stop, and there won't be any British team for a while ( Much like Current Germany), but that's all.

 

[Joachim]

Riis wasn't stripped of his win.

Indeed. edited 3 minutes before you posted, oddly enough

If the sponsors continued after Festina, they will continue after Armstrong and any SKY Bust to happen.
The new found following for Cycling in Britain will stop, and there won't be any British team for a while ( Much like Current Germany), but that's all.

Agreed. However, lets not forget that people love a good scandal. The frenzied activity here anduring the Armstrong saga, and the 28 million viewers of the Armstrong Oprah show (on a totally minority channel) illustrate this nicely.

In fact, you could argue cycling has thrived during the years of biggest scandal.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Riis wasn't stripped of his win.

If the sponsors continued after Festina, they will continue after Armstrong and any SKY Bust to happen.
The new found following for Cycling in Britain will stop, and there won't be any British team for a while ( Much like Current Germany), but that's all.

A cynic might say that we'd see a concurrent rise in another minority cycling nation with a sizable populace, with routes tailored to their stars, in order to replace the British audience that has to all intents and purposes replaced the German audience in similar fashion.

 

[JimmyFingers]

And because he won a stage of the tour down under, a race in which stage wins from riders of gs ability are not uncommon. He has not yet become a contender for the tour de France. Not close.

But it is worth keeping an eye on him considering how vocally upset he was on hearing that udada was investigating lance.

I wouldn't expect anything less...

 

[JimmyFingers]

A cynic might say that we'd see a concurrent rise in another minority cycling nation with a sizable populace, with routes tailored to their stars, in order to replace the British audience that has to all intents and purposes replaced the German audience in similar fashion.

It's safe to say the British audience doesn't really get road racing, despite the millions watching the Olympic event. A bit like say, NFL there's a core of fans who know the intricacies of the calender, and know words like Monuments, hilly classics and puncheur, but mostly the wider audience will watch only the big events, TdF and Olympics. The core will watch everything, and they will go on watching, because they've seen it before, the wider audience will desert in droves and all those new bikes bought will get hung in the garage to collect dust, and the sport will be dismissed as a continental eccentricity once more.

However there is damage to be done to the rest of the sport as well. Clearly the women's side is suffering the most, but the Spanish are struggling to find money to put on some traditional races, and with the backdrop of the Eurozone crisis you can see further money getting pulled from the sport if the scandals continue.

Hence the mantra that the sport got clean in 2006, hence the 'it's all in the past now'. It's not omerta so much as advertising.