Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

[Dazed and Confused]

indeed.
it's not as if Contador isn't attacking. But his attacks are fruitless against the Sky train.

Contador, the doper, is hapless against the Sky train. Nice.

 

[BYOP88]

So Dr. Leinders only worked for 40 days with Sky, I thought it was around 80 in a previous statement. Oh well I guess the next time Brailsford issues a statement it will be 20 days and soon Dr. Leinders will never have worked with Sky. #smokeandmirrors.

 

[sniper]

Infriggingdeed. where do the 40 days come from, when it used to be 80? how is a room full of journos letting him get away with that?

 

[lavieclaire]

again with this bull****. . . .

Take the emotive issue of Sky and Brailsford out of the equation for a moment and read the words you quoted again.

The notion is correct.

 

[BlenJones2]

Its actually Sir David Brailsford. Come on guys, respect

 

[sniper]

looks like the endgame is coming, McQuack announces "no changes", little Richie proudly states they are THE "trend-setters" and Brailsford's comes with this final absolute unrefutable proof - they are less marginal now than before

"So we were doping in the Olympics too? If I'm a doper, if I'm a liar, I'm a liar in my personality through and through. So why didn't I dope the Olympic team for the last 15 years? Have I just decided I'm going to do it with this team? I'm not going to do it over there but I'll cheat here? Full gas. But we've dominated the Olympic games for 15 years. Explain that to me. We didn’t just win at the Olympic games, we dominated them, we smashed it out of the park. More than anyone else has ever done. That level of performance is monumental."

this type of denial sounds familiar, don't it? (Bruyneel/Armstrong/Stapleton/Wiggins):

Bill Stapleton
...think about it for a sec. We're building long-lasting, trusting relationships with people who are spending a lot of money - Coke, Nike, Subaru. If we're f***ing lying, we can kiss it all goodbye. And if we were lying we'd do some stupid stuff to try to cover it up, wouldn't we? Does anybody think for a second that a secret that big wouldn't come out?

answering a question by asking questions.
an absolute give away.

 

[Escarabajo]

Brailsford now has his panties in a wad because fans are laughing at the fraud that is Team Sky. I wonder if he had to pay Bruyneel royalties for using the same lines that joker used a decade ago.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/brailsford-hits-back-at-accusations-and-criticism-of-team-sky

He didn't even respond the question of the comparison with US Postal service:

Team Sky has been criticised for the often clinical, finely calculated way it rides and win many of the sport's biggest stage races. The dominant way they controlled the Tour de France and set up Bradley Wiggins and Chris Froome quickly lead somewhat malicious comparisons to Lance Armstrong's powerful US Postal Service team.

And then he responds with the jumping mountain goats answer which had nothing to do with the calculated way that the US Postal used to control the Tours in the 2000's:

"If people want the entertainment value of riders attacking each other, stopping, attacking each other again and again, then go back to 'old cycling', which will give you the capability to do that," he said.

And now because they have been winning in the Olympics for 15 years they have the right to win the Tour de France in the same way. How do you correlate the two things is beyond my knowledge:

"So we were doping in the Olympics too? If I'm a doper, if I'm a liar, I'm a liar in my personality through and through. So why didn't I dope the Olympic team for the last 15 years? Have I just decided I'm going to do it with this team? I'm not going to do it over there but I'll cheat here? Full gas. But we've dominated the Olympic games for 15 years. Explain that to me. We didn’t just win at the Olympic games, we dominated them, we smashed it out of the park. More than anyone else has ever done. That level of performance is monumental."

What about the answer when you always have to dope if you are a cheater. That is BS. We all know Armstrong and other riders such as Landis, Menchov target races for doping. You don't always have to dope in every race. In fact there could be the cases of riders with nothing to loose since they are close to retirment and stepping up a notch in the doping program. Maybe Manuel Beltran comes to mind. Rogers fits the bill in that respect.

 

[Franklin]

"Of course it was a mistake. Absolutely. But hiring one doctor, who worked for 40 days, does that means we're doping now, are we? How does that work?" he said, using a stream of questions to give his answer.

"If you’re a cheat, you're a cheat, you're not half a cheat. You wouldn't say, 'I'll cheat here but I'm not going to cheat over there; I'll cheat on a Monday but not on a Tuesday.'

So Leinders who was a cheat at Rabobankwas a cheat at Sky too?

How does this logic work?

"So we were doping in the Olympics too? If I'm a doper, if I'm a liar, I'm a liar in my personality through and through. So why didn't I dope the Olympic team for the last 15 years? Have I just decided I'm going to do it with this team? I'm not going to do it over there but I'll cheat here? Full gas. But we've dominated the Olympic games for 15 years. Explain that to me. We didn’t just win at the Olympic games, we dominated them, we smashed it out of the park. More than anyone else has ever done. That level of performance is monumental."

Errrrrrr.... what? They dominated the OS for 15 years? In what paralel universe does this guy live? Their domination started in 2008, that's 5 years ago....

"If I'm a liar and a cheat and if my ethics and morals are all about cheating, if that's what we're doing here, lying to the world and cheating, then surely I'll be doing it in other places in my life. Not just parts.

If we go with this highly questionable amateur-psychologist blahblah I would say that mr. Dave is indeed lying and cheating an awful lot.

And if we look at his memory about the OS he's either delusional or lies to himself as well.

 

[lavieclaire]

....or, if we assume he isn't doping his riders it looks like justifiable anger.

Take your pick.

 

[Franklin]

....or, if we assume he isn't doping his riders it looks like justifiable anger.

Take your pick.

Sorry. You are a bit confused here.

The UK did not dominate the OS in cycling for 15 years.

That statement is absolutely crackpot.

Secondly. If a cheater is a cheater, remains a cheater and will cheat everywhere... how does this work for Leinders? Now this is clearly a case of stupidity on DB's part where he had not thought about his own words, but it does show that his logic is absolutely faulty.

So no, righteous anger has nothing to do with him playing loose and fast with facts and using crazy logic.

 

[Dazed and Confused]

....or, if we assume he isn't doping his riders it looks like justifiable anger.

Take your pick.

or if he doesn't know many of his riders are doping he would look like a hapless clown. There are many options.

Meanwhile, Sky will continue to dominate races in the same fashion as US Postal. Setting records along the way.

 

[thehog]

So Dr. Leinders only worked for 40 days with Sky, I thought it was around 80 in a previous statement. Oh well I guess the next time Brailsford issues a statement it will be 20 days and soon Dr. Leinders will never have worked with Sky. #smokeandmirrors.

It's becoming the new 500 tests.

80 days is now 40. Soon to be 20.

 

[oldcrank]

Brailsford now has his panties in a wad

Actually it seems more like the Clinic has it's collective panties in a wad.
Just saying. I know you were all burned by your hero Lance and want to
lash out at something, anything, everything but I don't think this obsession
with Sky will be good for your mental health in the long term, lads.

 

[MartinGT]

Haha pure gold from the bald one.

 

[blackcat]

Brailsford now has his panties in a wad because fans are laughing at the fraud that is Team Sky. I wonder if he had to pay Bruyneel royalties for using the same lines that joker used a decade ago.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/brailsford-hits-back-at-accusations-and-criticism-of-team-sky

Moose, I dont know if you even have taken drugs, but to my knowledge, you can't recycle the coke that they hoovered their nasal old factories at yellow rose

 

[peloton]

So Dr. Leinders only worked for 40 days with Sky, I thought it was around 80 in a previous statement. Oh well I guess the next time Brailsford issues a statement it will be 20 days and soon Dr. Leinders will never have worked with Sky. #smokeandmirrors.

Hard to keep the story straight...

Leinders joined Sky in the winter of 2010 in a part-time capacity, working 80 days a year for the team. His appointment came less than a year after Team Sky had pledged that it would only employ doctors who had never before worked on professional cycling teams, supposedly in order to ensure that the sins of cycling’s past could have no place in this new team.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/brailsford-vague-on-leinders-investigation

 

[Franklin]

Take the emotive issue of Sky and Brailsford out of the equation for a moment and read the words you quoted again.

The notion is correct.

Actually, I advice you to try to find a few reels about how a guy called Lance Armstrong won races. This was of course long ago, so let me explain.

Lance Armstrong was the best TdF racer ever, he won 7 times, until they took that away. He used the tactic to have his team kill everyone else in the mountain stages by setting up a blistering pace.

Before Lance this tactic was employed by T-Mobile (Riis/Ulrich, also known dopers) and Banesto, the team of Miguel Indurain (the big star at the beginning of the Epoe era)

This is the same as Sky is doing.

Now I think I need to explain cycling mechanics too, as I think it helps you to understand. If I ride in front of you, you need less energy as I do. This is called slipstreaming. Even when climbing, especially at these speeds, sitting in the slipstream is easier. So if your helpers (a team has generally one leader and 7 helpers) manage to drop the other competitors it indicates they are actually stronger than those competitors. This indicates that Sky's racers are a lot stronger than the competition.

Back to history. Prior to the Epo era there were more attacks and the racing was less controlled. There were trains, but they got derailed a lot. This is the tactic Sky is NOT using.

I hope you could follow this so far? If not Youtube can help you understand this beautiful sport.

anyway, the conclusion is that succesful trains are not a sign of clean racing at all. In fact the most succesful cases were based on Blood-doping and Epo. This does not proof Sky is using doping, but it also makes clear that wht mister Brailsford is saying is false. Some would say he's a liar here as he was around when Lance Armstrong won this way.

 

[blackcat]

again with this bull****. . . .

right

golem is full of BS

false dichotomy.

actually he described the 80's, when hinault v rominger v lemond attacking each other, mana a mano a mano on the final HC ascent on the Queen Stage. That WOULD NOT be a false dichotomy, but that is not what he meant.

 

[Franklin]

Hard to keep the story straight...

Now if we go with his brilliant psycho-analysis, what does this say about himself?

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

Brailsford now has his panties in a wad because fans are laughing at the fraud that is Team Sky. I wonder if he had to pay Bruyneel royalties for using the same lines that joker used a decade ago.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/brailsford-hits-back-at-accusations-and-criticism-of-team-sky

The question should be, how many times can I lie in one single interview.

A disgrace.

 

[Franklin]

hinault v rominger v lemond

I think you mean someone else here^^

 

[sniper]

Brailsfraud:
"If you’re a cheat, you're a cheat, you're not half a cheat. You wouldn't say, 'I'll cheat here but I'm not going to cheat over there; I'll cheat on a Monday but not on a Tuesday.'

So Leinders who was a cheat at Rabobank, was a cheat at Sky too?

How does this logic work?

very well exposed.
Daniel Benson, pick this up please.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

Moose, I dont know if you even have taken drugs,

I have never tested positive.

 

[Benotti69]

Its actually Sir David Brailsford. Come on guys, respect

It is only 'Sir' to members of the Brit commonwealth. To the rest of the world he is another DS enabling doping on a pro cycling team.

 

[veganrob]

Wow.How could anyone listen to this guy and not see through his BS. He can hardly answer a question with out another question. He sounds like Lance at the SCA deposition. Don't answer the question, attack the messenger.