Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

[thehog]

Do Aussie sports institutes have an incentive that's results based ?...Ie Ausie athletes do well in international competition better funding is attracted...they perform less than competitive funding could be cut/ frozen?
IF that's the case then there's a conflict of interest and doping has an incentive. Yes there are risks, yes they will take great care to separate ( plausible deniability) any knowledge of doping by an institute and the Government equally has incentive NOT to catch dopers cus its bad PR when it happens on there watch.
Not singling out Australia here, but that pattern of state supported institute has a long history..GDR, Russia....State University teams etc and so on.
I'm not singling any persons out here just showing how a very clear conflict of interest is set up.

Christ. The AIS was (is) a cess pit of drugs. Along with the state institutes. Never seen so much doping in my life. Financed with government money as well.

I was long gone but google the Mark French affair. What you read was the norm.

The roadies went to Adelaide and Italy but the trackies were well adept.

 

[sartoris]

Let's go back to the topic !!!!! Sky are a shameless bunch of dopers.

 

[Mrs John Murphy]

But you are wrong. Really.

You are free to believe that Contador is riding clean. You are also free to believe in fairies, unicorns and the lost city of Atlantis. That doesn't however, mean that any of these things are actually true or really exist.

However, it is very sweet to think that after everything that has happened in cycling and all the stories that are coming out about doping, that you think that Contador is clean. I can't decide though if this makes you very naive, delusional or very stupid.

 

[Darryl Webster]

Let's go back to the topic !!!!! Sky are a shameless bunch of dopers.

Actually there is a relevance..BC funding is much the same maybe some small differences the BC set and funding system fully has an incentive for doping..with Sky,s involvement an even bigger one.
As with most things, follow the money. Follow the motive.

 

[Kender]

Do Aussie sports institutes have an incentive that's results based ?...Ie Ausie athletes do well in international competition better funding is attracted...they perform less than competitive funding could be cut/ frozen?
IF that's the case then there's a conflict of interest and doping has an incentive. Yes there are risks, yes they will take great care to separate ( plausible deniability) any knowledge of doping by an institute and the Government equally has incentive NOT to catch dopers cus its bad PR when it happens on there watch.
Not singling out Australia here, but that pattern of state supported institute has a long history..GDR, Russia....State University teams etc and so on.
I'm not singling any persons out here just showing how a very clear conflict of interest is set up.

not sure about Australia, but that's kinda the case in New Zealand. The funding comes from SPARC which is a government organisaton, but separate from the antidoping agency "Drug Free Sport NZ". a certain amount is set aside by SPARC to fund high performance sports. The funding high performance sport is divided based on projected success at the olympics. Sports like rowing and cycling where NZ do well get a larger slice.

However, as Drug Free Sport NZ is not afiliated with any 1 sport there is no reason to cover up doping and their funding is separate from the performance based funding from SPARC. having said that, i've been unable to find a sanctions list like some of the other ADA's around the world have which is a little disapointing


Any performance based incentive can provide motivations for coaches and athletes to enhance their performance. That money doesn't have to come from a government organisation. This is true of ALL professional sports. After all, the better you perform the more money you can get on your next contract, or from your next sponsor

 

[simo1733]

Kerrison is not coaching cycling. He is TRANSFORMING coaching cycling, taking it to a new level. Given the level at which this transformation is happening, I'd call it an order of magnitude change.

Why did Kerison not take British swimming to another level?

 

[sartoris]

You are free to believe that Contador is riding clean. You are also free to believe in fairies, unicorns and the lost city of Atlantis. That doesn't however, mean that any of these things are actually true or really exist.

However, it is very sweet to think that after everything that has happened in cycling and all the stories that are coming out about doping, that you think that Contador is clean. I can't decide though if this makes you very naive, delusional or very stupid.

Settle down. I'm gonna say it again. Contador is clean. Whether you believe it or not is completely irrelevant. And you spend a lotta time round ere. Get a life. No hard feelings. Just a friendly free piece of advice.

 

[the big ring]

Why did Kerison not take British swimming to another level?

Because they don't ride bikes, clearly.

Actually what he said was: when I got to cycling, the coaching was a mess - adhoc and unstructured. We fixed that all up.

http://www.cyclesportmag.com/features/tim-kerrison-the-man-behind-bradley-wiggins’-tour/

“One of the surprising things not just to me, but to others who came in to the professional team from the British system, was the absence of coaching structures,” he says. “Teams invest a lot in riders but don’t do a lot to develop those riders to get the most out of their potential. That was surprising. From the outset we said that we’d have a coaching structure, and develop a coaching group to get the most out of our riders. We have a good coaching group now, and most riders have one-on-one tailored coaching.”

Oh god. For real? Only most riders? So no different to any other team then?

Kinda weird when you consider Rogers had been training with Aldo Sassi at Mapei - you know, where Cadel Evans is trained. You know, the guy that won the Tour in 2011?

 

[acoggan]

explain the physiological foundation of someone generating more of their 4 minute IP power from aerobic vs anaerobic power. acoggan wouldn't.

Fixed your post for you.

 

[the big ring]

Fixed your post for you.

Who can tell the difference?

 

[sittingbison]

Do Aussie sports institutes have an incentive that's results based ?...ie Aussie athletes do well in international competition better funding is attracted...they perform less than competitive funding could be cut/ frozen?...I'm not singling any persons out here just showing how a very clear conflict of interest is set up.

... the BC set and funding system fully has an incentive for doping..with Sky,s involvement an even bigger one.
As with most things, follow the money. Follow the motive

Spot on Darryl. All the talk during the Olympics was the under performance of the swimmers, and "woe is me if we are not careful the Govt funding will be cut". Because the Govt funding has only one purpose - buying gold. And Sky funding TeamSky has only a single purpose, buying a TdF win for a British rider - and they even placed a time limit (which they beat) lol.

Talk about incentives.

 

[I Watch Cycling In July]

Since we have a few irate Aussies in this thread.... Can anyone remember the story about the cyclist who got busted and claimed his coach was doping him? maybe 10 years ago, or 15? All I can remember is he was quite young, around 20, appeared at the presser with his dad to admit PED use and point the finger. Can't remember if he was a track rider or roadie but I think track....maybe at about commonwealth games level? Always wondered if he was at the AIS.

Krebs cycle cracks me up with his getting all ****y about people pointing the finger at the AIS. If they're as clean as you say mate, they have a PR problem big time. Cause the rumors have well and truly reached this side of the ditch. Fark, even my mum has head the rumors.

 

[the big ring]

OT post - let's not clog this one eh?

 

[I Watch Cycling In July]

OT post - let's not clog this one eh?

Deleted it.

Righto, sky......Vaughters called Brailsford on his BS in that friendly chat a few days ago. Sky's policy of employing no known dopers was absolutely an enforcement of Omertà. Brailsfords comments after landis talked made it clear they were not going to look into the claims about their rider propely. Then sky smashes the tour and stacks the podium. Half the team could hang to near the end of climbs. Sorry for getting side tracked but what exactly is left to discuss about sky? Carry on!

 

[acoggan]

Who can tell the difference?

krebs cycle, for one.

 

[Mrs John Murphy]

Settle down. I'm gonna say it again. Contador is clean. Whether you believe it or not is completely irrelevant. And you spend a lotta time round ere. Get a life. No hard feelings. Just a friendly free piece of advice.

I'm not the one trolling a forum claiming that Sky are dirty as the day is long while all Spanish riders are clean.

 

[Zam_Olyas]

Johan Bruyneel ‏@JohanBruyneel

If u take the time to watch "The road to glory", u will understand why @bradwiggins and @chrisfroome came in 1 and 2 in the Tour de France!

 

[the big ring]

Johan Bruyneel ‏@JohanBruyneel

If u take the time to watch "The road to glory", u will understand why @bradwiggins and @chrisfroome came in 1 and 2 in the Tour de France!

There's a glowing endorsement.

 

[Zam_Olyas]

There's a glowing endorsement.

Yep, the best and it is free.

 

[Benotti69]

There's a glowing endorsement.

the backslapping continues.

 

[OnePercenter]

Johan Bruyneel ‏@JohanBruyneel

If u take the time to watch "The road to glory", u will understand why @bradwiggins and @chrisfroome came in 1 and 2 in the Tour de France!

Oh god.

Did anyone actually watch this? I could only handle 5 minutes before I threw up with the infantile banality of what was breathlessly proclaimed as Brailsford's genius.

There was a piece that was described as giving a behind the scenes look at Sky's innovative management and attention to detail. Brailsford literally drew some flow charts on a whiteboard (I'm not joking) and then they had a group discussion (I'm still not joking) about his idea that to have a winning tour team you need 1. Talent 2. Coaching 3. Tactics.

It was like watching a management workshop from The Office.

Seriously.

That's what was presented as the kind of amazing innovation behind Sky's dominance. The groundbreaking idea that to win races you need good fit riders who know how to ride.

 

[Don't be late Pedro]

That's what was presented as the kind of amazing innovation behind Sky's dominance. The groundbreaking idea that to win races you need good fit riders who know how to ride.

A mainstream programme about Team Sky made for Sky TV. What exactly were you expecting?

It was like watching a management workshop from The Office.

More like Alan Partridge I would say.

 

[OnePercenter]

Christ. The AIS was (is) a cess pit of drugs. Along with the state institutes. Never seen so much doping in my life. Financed with government money as well.

I was long gone but google the Mark French affair. What you read was the norm.

The roadies went to Adelaide and Italy but the trackies were well adept.

Doping at the AIS has a long and (in)glorious history

http://www.canberragym.com.au/canbe...rra-brisbane-defend-link-with-banned-trainer/

 

[OnePercenter]

A mainstream programme about Team Sky made for Sky TV. What exactly were you expecting?

Concentrated on the riding rather than try to present comically unconvincing reasons for dramatic lifts in performance.

They should have called it Road To Paris : UK Edition.

 

[Don't be late Pedro]

Concentrated on the riding rather than try to present comically unconvincing reasons for dramatic lifts in performance.

They should have called it Road To Paris : UK Edition.

Which episode was this? I have only seen the first one and that was pretty much all about Cav.