Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

[Dear Wiggo]

And publishing blood profiles? Definitely.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

And letting Kimmage be on board from Day 1 at the Tour?

Definitely.

 

[sittingbison]

Sorry, merging this with the sky thread, I cant really see the point in another one ATM

cheers
bison

 

[Trudgin]

Oh and when Sky go full *** at the Tour. I hope the Spanish forces rise to match them. Isn't Valverde and Rodriguez aiming for the Tour this year? Or don't Katusha have an invite? Throw in Samu and I can see them all helping Contador. It'd also be nice to have Andy Schleck fire like he's never done before in the Tour.

Wiggins and Froome are different creatures. Froome is the insane mentally challenged one who doesn't notice how absurd he is. Wiggins in the petty jealous kind who cannot stand rivalry. I hope they clash and bring this whole circus down around them. Will make for some entertaining viewing. Also having their respective missus at the others throat might do well.

I hope the bickering of both the riders and their WAG's go off on one another and the Spanish return supreme...

But they need to find the secret elixir first before that can happen..

 

[will10]

Oh yes, why are Sky winning and better than everyone else? Well, they do happen to have more money than most other teams. And, even Vaughters says they're particularly adept at recruiting the riders they need to fit into their team structure.

From his Twitter feed tonight:

Key is Sky buys guys to be workers that are outright talents. I can think of 8-9 they have that have higher earning than my #1

dont get me wrong, a precious few other teams have similar budgets, but are as good at recruiting.

I respect their model a lot. Even though I still hate the fact we lost Wiggo.

their final climb tactics are very intelligent and neuter explosive climbers. But you need 3-4 €600,000+ domestiques to make work.

No doubt I'll get abuse from the blinkered Sky haters who will always bleat on about them doping, just because they're winning. Like others have said, some things look suspicious, but each time someone brings up some "evidence" that they're doping (usually based on performance observations), it gets countered, which then releases the forum venom-spitters.

I've a lot of time and respect for Jonathan Vaughters.

But he is taking us for fools with these comments. Guys like Froome, Cataldo, David Lopez - these guys were not 'outright talents'. They showed very little until joining Sky. was Richie Porte, as a climber at least. Froome has made arguably the biggest jump in performance in the sport in years. Neither I don't even know where to start with Rogers these days.

Someone pointed out the US Postal recruitment policy and I think they're bob on with that - Postal did sign guys who had been leaders at other teams, had got very good results. Heras, Azevedo, Popovych. Sky have signed several good domestiques who now look like they could ride for top 3 on their own, unheard of prior to them joining Sky.

Seeing Uran and Henao up there is not unusual IMO. But I really am uncomfortable seeing who they're working for ride as he does.

 

[Trudgin]

Is the future of cycling (until UKPS are found out) to "PULL A PEREIRO" get out there in a break away and try to get as much time as possible without completely killing yourself so that you can continue on and finish the race?

I see everything getting pulled back by that Sky train. I know I'm saying the same thing again and again but it is so depressing.

 

[Gavatron]

One thing I don't understand about the whole Sky thing is how they are getting away with it. The "allowable retardation" is a hint I realise but why?

I'm someone who has cycled for years but only become passionate about cycle racing in maybe the past six years. So I missed Festina and other scandals and Armstrong had retired first time before I watched my first full TdF.

But I discovered the Clinic very early on and so realised what he was.

So why are we going through it all again so soon? How come Sky seem to have been given the nod to do what they like?

 

[Dear Wiggo]

so why are we going through it all again so soon? How come sky seem to have been given the nod to do what they like?

$$$ ...

 

[SundayRider]

I don't have full access to this article (subscription needed) but someone might http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/sport/cycling/article3710176.ece?CMP=OTH-gnws-standard-2013_03_10

 

[pascoa341]

This is from memory (read it this morning) so someone correct me if I'm wrong:

Article says little new. It's basically about Leinders involvement with Sky and the fact that when he was doctor at Rabobank multiple people have confessed about drugs on that team as well as Rasmussen's claim that Leinders administrated the bloodbags for him. Shame it's not a bit more critical (in the paper edition it's beneath a larger article noting 'Sky rules the cycling world again' , but good nonetheless that at least suspicions are mentioned in mainstream media.

Actually the larger article was the more interesting. In it Richie Porte is quoted of say how impressed he is with Sky after coming from Saxo. Saxo are said to be more traditional and 'Jim Kerrison's' training methods are revolutionary. Particularly interesting was his argument that 'riders from other teams cannot believe how hard we train'...

The cynic in me is then reminded of how Armstrong to a large extent won his tours by being able (using PED in training) to train harder than anyone else... Or maybe cyclists at other teams are just lazy and just not willing to work hard enough to achieve 'marginal gains'.

 

[Contadoraus Schlecks]

Who is the new "Dark Helmet"?

Wiggins can be tall version of dark helmet. Chris can be his loyal Froomemog

 

[Lanark]

First (small) rumblings from the peloton. Article in Dutch newspaper De Volkskrant this morning about the dominance of Sky. The story asks the question if, outside of having good riders, there is another explanation behind their succes. Froome says there is no secret, Brailsford confirms this, although he adds that they ''train different and better than the rest.''

Nico Verhoeven says 'that's the same thing the Italian teams in the 90's said'.

The implication is clear.

 

[Bernie's eyesore]

Does anybody have access to the full list of which stage wins each rider is going to be given this year in order to be kept happy? MY guesses are,

Catalunya- Uran
Pais Vasco- Henao
Trentino_Cataldo
Norway- Boasson Hagen
Bayern Rundfahrt- Thomas
Romandie- Kiryienka?
Switzerland- JTL?
Poland- Lopez
USA Pro Challenge- Dombrowski

Obviously, Froome already has the Dauphine wrapped up with the three Grand Tours going to Wiggins, Froome and Henao. Porte will have to make do with Paris Nice for now sadly.

 

[taiwan]

I've a lot of time and respect for Jonathan Vaughters.

But he is taking us for fools with these comments. Guys like Froome, Cataldo, David Lopez - these guys were not 'outright talents'. They showed very little until joining Sky. was Richie Porte, as a climber at least. Froome has made arguably the biggest jump in performance in the sport in years. Neither I don't even know where to start with Rogers these days.

Someone pointed out the US Postal recruitment policy and I think they're bob on with that - Postal did sign guys who had been leaders at other teams, had got very good results. Heras, Azevedo, Popovych. Sky have signed several good domestiques who now look like they could ride for top 3 on their own, unheard of prior to them joining Sky.

Seeing Uran and Henao up there is not unusual IMO. But I really am uncomfortable seeing who they're working for ride as he does.

Right, the domestiques they hire performed similar roles on previous teams. A few were from Movistar/Caisse for instance, and doing the same thing, so that's one other team with access to quality domestiques off the bat

 

[Don't be late Pedro]

Seeing Uran and Henao up there is not unusual IMO. But I really am uncomfortable seeing who they're working for ride as he does.

That is a very worrying thing to me. I pegged Henao as a future top 5 GT rider. To see Uran and Henao dropping some of the best climbers and then dropping of is understandable but all the other Sky riders seem to have left them behind in their wake with their new found climbing ability.

I want to give Sky a chance but things are getting a bit silly now...

 

[SundayRider]

“How many teams are doing 25 minutes of threshold training at altitude? Do they look at our strength? We do our jobs. We’re professional,” he said. “Everyone used to laugh at us when we started to ride our trainers after the stages. Now 90 percent of the peloton is doing it. We’re trend-setters.” Richie Porte.

 

[Lanark]

“How many teams are doing 25 minutes of threshold training at altitude? Do they look at our strength? We do our jobs. We’re professional,” he said. “Everyone used to laugh at us when we started to ride our trainers after the stages. Now 90 percent of the peloton is doing it. We’re trend-setters.” Richie Porte.

Funny how 90% of the peloton does it now, yet the Sky domination only gets bigger.

 

[Bernie's eyesore]

Funny how 90% of the peloton does it now, yet the Sky domination only gets bigger.

Do the other teams take their own pillows with them though?

 

[hrotha]

“How many teams are doing 25 minutes of threshold training at altitude? Do they look at our strength? We do our jobs. We’re professional,” he said. “Everyone used to laugh at us when we started to ride our trainers after the stages. Now 90 percent of the peloton is doing it. We’re trend-setters.” Richie Porte.

How much BS in one single statement.

Warming down? We warmed down in PE class at school when we were like 11 years old. Or, well, we were told to. We rarely saw the need for that malarkey

Doing intervals? Training at altitude?

Being professional?

That's just insulting.

 

[BigBoat]

One thing I don't understand about the whole Sky thing is how they are getting away with it.

The simple answer is they can still dope without being caught! Just not the the level seen 10 years ago. They can still take small transfusions of their own blood. They can also use IGF-1 or HGH without any real risks of going positive.

So why are we going through it all again so soon? How come Sky seem to have been given the nod to do what they like?

This is just how it is in cycling and other sports (other sports especially).

 

[mattghg]

Unlimited access... does Mat get the sack of he doesn't talk to Walsh?

They have to make him talk to Walsh, for their own sakes.

 

[SundayRider]

How much BS in one single statement.

Warming down? We warmed down in PE class at school when we were like 11 years old. Or, well, we were told to. We rarely saw the need for that malarkey

Doing intervals? Training at altitude?

Being professional?

That's just insulting.

Didn't Tyler (in his book) use the term 'being professional' as pretty much code for doping. When he went to Europe he was quite green, after a few years he became fully professional.

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

Nico Verhoeven says 'that's the same thing the Italian teams in the 90's said'.

The implication is clear.

That is a big one.

 

[Benotti69]

Do the other teams take their own pillows with them though?

OPQS were 'spectacurlarly professional' at 1 TdF and brought their own pillows and mattresses.

AG2R brought a bath in the bus. How pro is that?

Obviously the wrong type of pillows, mattresses and bath otherwise they would've won the TdF

Wont the language and abuse from Wiggins be fun when it all comes out.

Remember Festina, Op Puerto, USPS, etc etc .....it always comes out.....always.

 

[Arnout]

Even Rabobank brought their own beds (including pillows!) and cooks during the Tour. They also had doping riders. It didn't help.

But times change, of course.