Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

[Dear Wiggo]

Sky knows this is an issue. I talked with Yates at the Tour, he was very enthusiastic about Froome and his abilities but when I asked him about what caused his huge leap in form in the 2011 Vuelta he just shrugged, smiled, and said "I have no idea"

I ran into Sean Yates on Alp d'Huez yesterday. Had a nice chat. Froome came up. Sean had not seen the Grappe article but he said many of the same things it said, that he had a huge capacity to train and recover, numbers were stable, etc.

I asked what he thought changed in Froome's training, etc, that led to such huge increase in form after he left Barloworld. Sean said "I have no idea" > He did say Froome used to crash a bunch, always was coming off the bike

Incredible that Sean Yates, employed by Sky as a DS, has no idea that Froome had Bilharzia and that it is now all cleared up, surely?

In your capacity is everything you chat about with these guys "off the record", Race Radio?

 

[red_flanders]

Greg LeMond was a domestique too, just, you know, for comparison with someone (Wiggins) who had such incredible potential to smash the peloton for 6 months straight some time down the track when his recovery is probably 10% less than it was when he was in his mid to late 20s.

And for something more recent, Froome was a domestique also, only recently, in 2012, and earlier in 2011.

Just because you are a domestique does not mean you cannot shine like a friggin beacon of GT potential.

LeMond was brought into the team as the champion that he was. His talent was clear to everyone in Europe at the time, which is why he got the rides and wins he did. He could easily have gone to another team and been the undisputed leader but felt he could learn from Hinault.

No comparison whatsoever to Wiggins.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

LeMond was brought into the team as the champion that he was. His talent was clear to everyone in Europe at the time, which is why he got the rides and wins he did. He could easily have gone to another team and been the undisputed leader but felt he could learn from Hinault.

No comparison whatsoever to Wiggins.

It seems to me that Justinr is saying Wiggo was brought into the team when he was focused fully on the road (2005-2007) as a dom and therefore of course he didn't get great results.

All I am saying is Froome and LeMond provide examples where someone riding as a dom, who also has the ability to smash the peloton in any race they choose, can be doms whilst also showing incredible GT potential.

Wiggo should have shown some potential during his road focus years, regardless of team or role, given he was older and (imo) hence had worse recovery when he stomped the peloton for 6 months straight.

ETA: Porte is another dom example who will probably win a GT down the track.

To wit:

Ok hands up on the focussing only on the track mistake - he did go road only for a couple of years with some smaller teams. But he was trying to do both in the run up to the 2008 games (but as a dom and not a gt contender) something i don't think would work well for anyone.

Wiggo wasn't focusing only on the track, he went to the road, but (apparently) he didn't do any good because:
1. he was doing both road and track focus
2. the teams were smaller
3. he was a dom, not a GT contender

of course it didn't work out.

 

[red_flanders]

It seems to me that Justinr is saying Wiggo was brought into the team when he was focused fully on the road (2005-2007) as a dom and therefore of course he didn't get great results.

All I am saying is Froome and LeMond provide examples where someone riding as a dom, who also has the ability to smash the peloton in any race they choose, can be doms whilst also showing incredible GT potential.

Wiggo should have shown some potential during his road focus years, regardless of team or role, given he was older and (imo) hence had worse recovery when he stomped the peloton for 6 months straight.

ETA: Porte is another dom example who will probably win a GT down the track.

To wit:



Wiggo wasn't focusing only on the track, he went to the road, but (apparently) he didn't do any good because:
1. he was doing both road and track focus
2. the teams were smaller
3. he was a dom, not a GT contender

of course it didn't work out.

I gotcha, was just making a clarifying point. Reason being there is a reason they make some guys domestiques and some guys leaders. The teams know what they have on their hands from medical analysis and performance/training.

Suffice it to say they don't make grupetto scrubs out of guys who they think have potential to win a GT. Ever.

 

[ralphbert]

Froome and kennaugh out of lbl. Hurty throat. What's going on with sky? Trying to avoid tests?

 

[Dear Wiggo]

Froome and kennaugh out of lbl. Hurty throat. What's going on with sky? Trying to avoid tests?

Tenerife is the training ground of L-B-L, apparently. Froome was hitting good numbers in training according to Porte.

Here's the start list:

101 Richie Porte (Aus)
102 Ian Boswell (USA)
103 Nathan Earle (Aus)
104 Joshua Edmondson (GBr)
105 Christopher Froome (GBr)
107 David Lopez Garcia (Spa)
108 Danny Pate (USA)

Kennaugh wasn't originally listed?

 

[Rollthedice]

Froome and kennaugh out of lbl. Hurty throat. What's going on with sky? Trying to avoid tests?

Yes, it's getting really weird. Why fly the man straight from Tenerife and then overnight decide he has some health problems?

 

[SundayRider]

Yes, it's getting really weird. Why fly the man straight from Tenerife and then overnight decide he has some health problems?

Was only yesterday Portal was saying how up for the race he was. Avoiding the passport maybe?

 

[Ferminal]

Let's see if the U23 runner up can finish the race.

 

[ralphbert]

Tenerife is the training ground of L-B-L, apparently. Froome was hitting good numbers in training according to Porte.

Here's the start list:

101 Richie Porte (Aus)
102 Ian Boswell (USA)
103 Nathan Earle (Aus)
104 Joshua Edmondson (GBr)
105 Christopher Froome (GBr)
107 David Lopez Garcia (Spa)
108 Danny Pate (USA)

Kennaugh wasn't originally listed?

Ah sorry, kennaugh and Kiryienka out of Romandie

 

[Lanark]

Was it the Henao case that scared them so much? After that, all went downhill for Sky, they appear too scared to even start in a race now with their main men. They need to get their medical side in order fast, or they can forget about their third Tour.

 

[roundabout]

Have to see how Porte does. Especially next week.

 

[Mellow Velo]

Had to pop in for a look and a laugh.
O course. Must be fear of testing, rather than just an infection.
Stands to reason......................around here.

Yet, Wiggins is starting to show up pretty well.
Certainly, better than predicted.

Bottom line is that it's not going to happen for Sky, or Froome, GT wise, this season.
Nothing going smoothly to plan, rather it's a very rough ride.

Enjoy it for what it is and what it will be: failure.
Enjoy it for the prospect of more open and uncontrolled racing at the Giro and Tour.
No need for yet more pointless and unlikely speculation.

 

[Justico]

Froome and kennaugh out of lbl. Hurty throat. What's going on with sky? Trying to avoid tests?

Try not to be stupid. Or do you think Porte is clean ? He is racing.

There is ton of evidence of Sky doping, not starting races is not one of them.

 

[hfer07]

Froome and kennaugh out of lbl. Hurty throat. What's going on with sky? Trying to avoid tests?

WTF? I mean- can SKY be a bit discrete the least?

 

[sniper]

Try not to be stupid. Or do you think Porte is clean ? He is racing.

There is ton of evidence of Sky doping, not starting races is not one of them.

try to be a bit more creative.
it need not, but it might well be doping related.
sky's internal testing may have spotted irregularities in the values of froome and kennaugh, but not in those of porte, deciding to sideline the first two but not the latter.

also (tin foil hat on):
sky might be getting intel from people at uci about who's gonna be tested, when and where, and who's not. remember: it's a circus.

 

[Nathan12]

try to be a bit more creative.
it need not, but it might well be doping related.
sky's internal testing may have spotted irregularities in the values of froome and kennaugh, but not in those of porte, deciding to sideline the first two but not the latter.

also (tin foil hat on):
sky might be getting intel from people at uci about who's gonna be tested, when and where, and who's not. remember: it's a circus.

This. Remember they don't have the bilharzia excuse anymore either to explain Froome's values, since that story was buried.

 

[Eyeballs Out]

Strange that the team with such unparalled attention to detail seems to be the sickest team in the peloton this season

Perhaps they should hire a doctor

 

[Rollthedice]

Strange that the team with such unparalled attention to detail seems to be the sickest team in the peloton this season

Perhaps they should hire a doctor

Leinders, please come back.

 

[ralphbert]

Try not to be stupid. Or do you think Porte is clean ? He is racing.

There is ton of evidence of Sky doping, not starting races is not one of them.

Being stupid comes naturally to me so I just roll with it. Maybe you can help me out, why fly him from Tenerife the night before if he has a hurty throat?

 

[ralphbert]

Leinders, please come back.

Leinders would give him a fisherman's friend to suck on.

 

[sniper]

Brailsford:
“We’ve also got [Jonathan] Tiernan-Locke who’s not racing, Sergio and his cousin [Sebastian] who’ve gone back to Colombia"
http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/froome-non-starter-in-liege-bastogne-liege

nice euphemism for "we've got some doping-related issues at the moment"

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Strange that the team with such unparalled attention to detail seems to be the sickest team in the peloton this season

Perhaps they should hire a doctor

Remember though, we've been saying for the last two years that it's unbelievable that athletes who are operating so far underweight for such long periods of time are not getting ill, because normally you would be susceptible to illnesses in such a manner (certainly we see that regularly with other teams and other endurance athletes such as runners, Nordic skiers and biathletes). Wiggins never got so much as a cold on his almost unprecedented run of domination in 2012, and Froome had nary a setback in his repeat performance in 2013.

Now, Sky are getting ill. Constantly. Is it that something's changed, or just that they've been very fortunate in the last couple of years and now the amount of time spent at that kind of weight loss program has caught up with them?

 

[Nathan12]

nice euphemism for "we've got some doping-related issues at the moment"

I didn't know Sebastian Henao had gone back to Colombia too?

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

Had to pop in for a look and a laugh.
O course. Must be fear of testing, rather than just an infection.
Stands to reason......................around here.

Yet, Wiggins is starting to show up pretty well.
Certainly, better than predicted.

Bottom line is that it's not going to happen for Sky, or Froome, GT wise, this season.
Nothing going smoothly to plan, rather it's a very rough ride.

Enjoy it for what it is and what it will be: failure.
Enjoy it for the prospect of more open and uncontrolled racing at the Giro and Tour.
No need for yet more pointless and unlikely speculation.

the only point of light in this clinic is probably you. true hilarious to read though

if they want to avoid testing they wouldn't even have put him on lbl startlist of course and then pull him out at the last moment to make it look "fishy"