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Team Ineos (Formerly the Sky thread)

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Re: Sky

TheSpud said:
Tim Booth said:

That gun certainly has started smoking more now ...

Assuming this is true, it's hard to see how they can wriggle out of this. They ordered the patches, they lied about ordering the patches, and then it would seem that they forced the supplier to lie about their delivery to help cover it up.
 
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Latest from Matt Lawton - the testosterone patches company "fully complied" with requests from both UKAD and the GMC

Which rather begs the question as to how/why the GMC has managed to establish that that Team Sky lied about the delivery - but UKAD somehow failed to do so...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/sportsnews/article-5455969/Fit-4-Sport-insists-fully-complied-inquiry.html

"The medical supplier at the centre of the testosterone patches controversy at Team Sky and British Cycling insists it has fully co-operated with the authorities...the company insisted on Friday it had complied with requests from the GMC and UK Anti-Doping. 'We have been asked by the GMC not to comment on the current investigation, like we were told not to comment on the UKAD investigation in 2017,' said a statement from the company. 'We have fully co-operated with both UKAD and GMC.' "
 
Re:

Wiggo's Package said:
Latest from Matt Lawton - the testosterone patches company "fully complied" with requests from both UKAD and the GMC

Which rather begs the question as to how/why the GMC has managed to establish that that Team Sky lied about the delivery - but UKAD somehow failed to do so...

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/sportsnews/article-5455969/Fit-4-Sport-insists-fully-complied-inquiry.html

"The medical supplier at the centre of the testosterone patches controversy at Team Sky and British Cycling insists it has fully co-operated with the authorities...the company insisted on Friday it had complied with requests from the GMC and UK Anti-Doping. 'We have been asked by the GMC not to comment on the current investigation, like we were told not to comment on the UKAD investigation in 2017,' said a statement from the company. 'We have fully co-operated with both UKAD and GMC.' "

Fully cooperates generally means they have done what is required of them by law. This is likely different depending on who comes knocking on the door.
 
Re: Sky

I don't think anything has changed other than UKAD couldn't link the testosterone to any riders and now GMC have followed on from were UKAD ended. The story was originally Freeman accidentally ordered Testosterone iirc because he couldn't do it online, so would telephone his order through and a similar sounding product got misheard as Testosterone. That story rapidly turned into the testosterone was received in error, rather than ordered in error. Now GMC are saying Freeman did order testosterone, which is in effect what Freeman originally said happened by accident over the phone order.
It all depends on if the testosterone was an ordering error or Freeman really ordered it and the covering letter was to cover his traces as the order was opened by other staff I believe.
 
Re: Sky

samhocking said:
I don't think anything has changed other than UKAD couldn't link the testosterone to any riders and now GMC have followed on from were UKAD ended. The story was originally Freeman accidentally ordered Testosterone iirc because he couldn't do it online, so would telephone his order through and a similar sounding product got misheard as Testosterone. That story rapidly turned into the testosterone was received in error, rather than ordered in error. Now GMC are saying Freeman did order testosterone, which is in effect what Freeman originally said happened by accident over the phone order.
It all depends on if the testosterone was an ordering error or Freeman really ordered it and the covering letter was to cover his traces as the order was opened by other staff I believe.

Who said that?
 
From the company name 'Fit 4Sport' I'm presuming this company specialise in supplying pharmaceutical products to sports people and organisations...

Now, i know there are genuine medical uses for testosterone, but not in sport. As far as I'm aware, synthetic testosterone in any variant is banned outright in every regulated and controlled sport worldwide.

So it begs the question, why was this product even available from Fit 4Sport in the first place....if it's for illegitimate use, then why do British Cycling have such a company as part of the supply chain...
 
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Re: Sky

samhocking said:
I don't think anything has changed other than UKAD couldn't link the testosterone to any riders and now GMC have followed on from were UKAD ended. The story was originally Freeman accidentally ordered Testosterone iirc because he couldn't do it online, so would telephone his order through and a similar sounding product got misheard as Testosterone. That story rapidly turned into the testosterone was received in error, rather than ordered in error. Now GMC are saying Freeman did order testosterone, which is in effect what Freeman originally said happened by accident over the phone order.
It all depends on if the testosterone was an ordering error or Freeman really ordered it and the covering letter was to cover his traces as the order was opened by other staff I believe.

The phone call excuse (Brailsfraud's fingerprints all over that, again) is undermined by the GMC having now found evidence that Sky ordered the testo patches. "Evidence" very much suggests a paper trail not a garbled phone call

"Sportsmail understands a General Medical Council investigation into Dr Richard Freeman, the former Team Sky and British Cycling doctor, has obtained evidence that suggests testosterone patches were ordered - despite Sky previously claiming they had been sent by mistake"

And your theory conveniently ignores Team Sky's subsequent cover up:

"Later, a request was made to the company in Oldham asking them to send an email saying the package had been sent in error"

For balance Michael Rasmussen knows where it's at:

"@MRasmussen1974

Testosteron patches delivered to the national training center 7 years ago. I guess we only have to wait for another 3 years until It’s revealed who actually used them. #10years #statuteoflimitation #NoBStalk #Teamsky #Iknownothing"
 
Re: Sky

Bronstein said:
samhocking said:
I don't think anything has changed other than UKAD couldn't link the testosterone to any riders and now GMC have followed on from were UKAD ended. The story was originally Freeman accidentally ordered Testosterone iirc because he couldn't do it online, so would telephone his order through and a similar sounding product got misheard as Testosterone. That story rapidly turned into the testosterone was received in error, rather than ordered in error. Now GMC are saying Freeman did order testosterone, which is in effect what Freeman originally said happened by accident over the phone order.
It all depends on if the testosterone was an ordering error or Freeman really ordered it and the covering letter was to cover his traces as the order was opened by other staff I believe.

Who said that?

indeed sam...who said that as I'm not sure you do rc?
 
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Amazing to think that the person taking the orders at Fit4Sport didn't quote Freeman's garbled pronunciation back at him to ensure no mistake was made. They must have been sending the wrong stuff out on a daily basis!

And anyway, can anyone think of a medical product a pro cycling team might order that sounds like testosterone...?
 
Re:

Wiggo's Package said:
Amazing to think that the person taking the orders at Fit4Sport didn't quote Freeman's garbled pronunciation back at him to ensure no mistake was made. They must have been sending the wrong stuff out on a daily basis!

And anyway, can anyone think of a medical product a pro cycling team might order that sounds like testosterone...?

You're closing in, Sherlock. I can smell it. :lol: :lol: :lol:
 
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Re: Re:

Alpe73 said:
Wiggo's Package said:
Amazing to think that the person taking the orders at Fit4Sport didn't quote Freeman's garbled pronunciation back at him to ensure no mistake was made. They must have been sending the wrong stuff out on a daily basis!

And anyway, can anyone think of a medical product a pro cycling team might order that sounds like testosterone...?

You're closing in, Sherlock. I can smell it. :lol: :lol: :lol:

There's certainly a strong smell, eh

Cow ***? Pig ***? No it's...
 
Re: Sky

pastronef said:
https://twitter.com/stevechapman65/status/970304453839671296

“The committee gathered information about senior personnel who doped as cyclists and then allegedly lied about that, including to Parliament. Sources say a separate study into that alleged cheating, cover-ups and an ongoing culture of omertà “
Who are these personnel? Are they seriously going to have a study into whether a third rate Australian pro took some disco biscuits in the 80s?
 
Re: Sky

Parker said:
pastronef said:
https://twitter.com/stevechapman65/status/970304453839671296

“The committee gathered information about senior personnel who doped as cyclists and then allegedly lied about that, including to Parliament. Sources say a separate study into that alleged cheating, cover-ups and an ongoing culture of omertà “
Who are these personnel? Are they seriously going to have a study into whether a third rate Australian pro took some disco biscuits in the 80s?

yes maybe Sutton, Knaven investigation about what they did as cyclists. dont know. it could be a bomb as it could be not so bad
we´ll see tomorrow
 
Re: Sky

pastronef said:
Parker said:
pastronef said:
https://twitter.com/stevechapman65/status/970304453839671296

“The committee gathered information about senior personnel who doped as cyclists and then allegedly lied about that, including to Parliament. Sources say a separate study into that alleged cheating, cover-ups and an ongoing culture of omertà “
Who are these personnel? Are they seriously going to have a study into whether a third rate Australian pro took some disco biscuits in the 80s?

yes maybe Sutton, Knaven investigation about what they did as cyclists. dont know. it could be a bomb as it could be not so bad
we´ll see tomorrow
What a Dutch rider did or didn't do on a Belgian team is no business of UK parliament.
 
Re: Sky

Parker said:
pastronef said:
Parker said:
pastronef said:
https://twitter.com/stevechapman65/status/970304453839671296

“The committee gathered information about senior personnel who doped as cyclists and then allegedly lied about that, including to Parliament. Sources say a separate study into that alleged cheating, cover-ups and an ongoing culture of omertà “
Who are these personnel? Are they seriously going to have a study into whether a third rate Australian pro took some disco biscuits in the 80s?

yes maybe Sutton, Knaven investigation about what they did as cyclists. dont know. it could be a bomb as it could be not so bad
we´ll see tomorrow
What a Dutch rider did or didn't do on a Belgian team is no business of UK parliament.
we're not out of the EU yet ;)
 
Re: Sky

Parker said:
pastronef said:
Parker said:
pastronef said:
https://twitter.com/stevechapman65/status/970304453839671296

“The committee gathered information about senior personnel who doped as cyclists and then allegedly lied about that, including to Parliament. Sources say a separate study into that alleged cheating, cover-ups and an ongoing culture of omertà “
Who are these personnel? Are they seriously going to have a study into whether a third rate Australian pro took some disco biscuits in the 80s?

yes maybe Sutton, Knaven investigation about what they did as cyclists. dont know. it could be a bomb as it could be not so bad
we´ll see tomorrow
What a Dutch rider did or didn't do on a Belgian team is no business of UK parliament.

Well, actually, yes it is.

The context is the culture at Team Sky. Whether or not they implemented their much vaunted ZTP proactively, or whether it was just employed to the bare minimum and only after being exposed. In other words, it is important to know in order to determine the actual culture at Sky rather than the one they presented.

We already know the answer. Brailsford himself was arrested and questioned in relation to St David of Miller's doping. He knew full well what the doping culture was. He knew full well the likely histories of the Team staff he employed.
 
Re: Sky

macbindle said:
Well, actually, yes it is.

The context is the culture at Team Sky. Whether or not they implemented their much vaunted ZTP proactively, or whether it was just employed to the bare minimum and only after being exposed. In other words, it is important to know in order to determine the actual culture at Sky rather than the one they presented.
No it isn't. Sky are free to employ who they like. Whether a private company has stuck to its own internal recruitment guidelines is not a matter for Parliament.
 
It wasn't an investigation into the legality of Sky's actions. It was an investigation into the whole culture of doping in sport. There are no laws against doping in sports but that does not mean that an investigation is outside the remit of parliamentary select comittees.

How do you think laws change, or get created????

There would never be any action against Sky as a result of the DCMS, just recommendations for legislative change. That is why Brailsford was perfectly free to lie through his teeth at the hearing. which he did with his usual aplomb.
 

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