Tejay Van Garderen Discussion Thread

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Jul 1, 2009
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"I'd rather die drunk, broke at 34 and have people at a dinner table talk about me than live to be rich and sober at 90 and nobody remembered who I was." - Whiplash

Tejay, you don't get that many shots to win the Tour. Come on man! Podium? Nobody remembers you. Take risk, win or lose - immortal.
 
Aug 9, 2009
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Re: Tejay Van Garderen

DBotero said:
Impressed by TVG today,still there.He needs to keep fighting and at the end he might be on the podium in Paris.
Wishful thinking. He's destined to be 5th behind Valverde and G.
 
Aug 31, 2012
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What's with all the disapproval for TJ? He's doing the right figh to accomplish his objective of making it onto the podium of the Tour de France.

"I knew Sky had a really strong team and they were going to kind of neutralise all the dangerous guys, so when they were jumping I just sat behind Sky to make sure that they could pull them back. Hopefully those guys keep doing that so they can waste a few of their bullets, and then in the third week they might pay the price.

"There were a few guys that I needed to mark, guys who are close to me on time, and I feel like I did a pretty good job staying close to them, and staying within my limits. So, yeah, it’s all going to plan.
 
Jun 24, 2015
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SeriousSam said:
What's with all the disapproval for TJ? He's doing the right figh to accomplish his objective of making it onto the podium of the Tour de France.
You don't see him do anything, like maybe attack. You see him on the printouts of the stage results and then you realise he's in the tour. Same goes for his team.
 
Re: Tejay Van Garderen

Tejay looked good today, responded well when others attacked. Strong. Defensive, yes, but it's not his job to attack Froome. He sits in second place, he can let others burn themselves with attacks against Froome and solidify his podium chances a little more everyday.
 
Jul 1, 2009
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SeriousSam said:
What's with all the disapproval for TJ? He's doing the right figh to accomplish his objective of making it onto the podium of the Tour de France.
Because you don't get to be 2nd DURING the TdF that easily or often. Every year is different. Next year you miss out on a cross wind stage. You have a mechanical that loses you minutes. You may crash in May during preparation. You get ill, have a bad day... New talented riders come along. Older talented riders return/focus. The future is NOW.

But his goal is racing for third. That's our best from the USA now? That's who we are now? Not getting 3rd, RACING for 3rd. It's. Totally. Demoralizing. May I remind you (not the movie version, the real one):

"Americans love to fight. All real Americans love the sting and clash of battle. When you were kids, you all admired the champion marble shooter, the fastest runner, the big-league ball players and the toughest boxers. Americans love a winner and will not tolerate a loser. Americans play to win all the time. That's why Americans have never lost and will never lose a war. The very thought of losing is hateful to Americans." - Patton
 
Re: Re:

Psalmon said:
SeriousSam said:
What's with all the disapproval for TJ? He's doing the right figh to accomplish his objective of making it onto the podium of the Tour de France.
Because you don't get to be 2nd DURING the TdF that easily or often. Every year is different. Next year you miss out on a cross wind stage. You have a mechanical that loses you minutes. You may crash in May during preparation. You get ill, have a bad day... New talented riders come along. Older talented riders return/focus. The future is NOW.

But his goal is racing for third. That's our best from the USA now? That's who we are now? Not getting 3rd, RACING for 3rd. It's. Totally. Demoralizing. May I remind you (not the movie version, the real one):

"Americans love to fight. All real Americans love the sting and clash of battle. When you were kids, you all admired the champion marble shooter, the fastest runner, the big-league ball players and the toughest boxers. Americans love a winner and will not tolerate a loser. Americans play to win all the time. That's why Americans have never lost and will never lose a war. The very thought of losing is hateful to Americans." - Patton
Second place is not good. The Great Alberto Contador :p
 
Tejay sure is hanging in there but dude you have to make a Move! Just about everyone in the top group made an attack today except the guy in 2nd! Like I said he is white bread. This Tour he has put on some butter and jam, but it's time to show us the goods. Take It to Them, Go For It!
 
Aug 31, 2012
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Re: Re:

Psalmon said:
SeriousSam said:
What's with all the disapproval for TJ? He's doing the right figh to accomplish his objective of making it onto the podium of the Tour de France.
Because you don't get to be 2nd DURING the TdF that easily or often. Every year is different. Next year you miss out on a cross wind stage. You have a mechanical that loses you minutes. You may crash in May during preparation. You get ill, have a bad day... New talented riders come along. Older talented riders return/focus. The future is NOW.

But his goal is racing for third. That's our best from the USA now? That's who we are now? Not getting 3rd, RACING for 3rd. It's. Totally. Demoralizing. May I remind you (not the movie version, the real one):

"Americans love to fight. All real Americans love the sting and clash of battle. When you were kids, you all admired the champion marble shooter, the fastest runner, the big-league ball players and the toughest boxers. Americans love a winner and will not tolerate a loser. Americans play to win all the time. That's why Americans have never lost and will never lose a war. The very thought of losing is hateful to Americans." - Patton
There is nothing wrong with racing for third when you know your limitations. Getting third would be a huge success for him. Given that the chance he wins the Tour is less than 1%, it makes sense to target an objective that he could actually achieve.

That said, it's also not clear that Tejay doing one of those "attacks" that we saw Nibali or Contador do today makes him more likely to win the Tour. If anything, he might have blown up. Tejay can't do changes of pace as well as the others.

I get it, you want to see him attack. Most of all, many might want to see him do his part to bring down Froome.

But TJ riding as he does makes perfect sense given that he craves a Tour podium. All you guys are basically either saying "TJ, why aren't you 10 times stronger than you are! Bah" or "TJ, why don't you give up riding for the podium to entertain us? Bah!"
 
Re:

Carols said:
Tejay sure is hanging in there but dude you have to make a Move! Just about everyone in the top group made an attack today except the guy in 2nd! Like I said he is white bread. This Tour he has put on some butter and jam, but it's time to show us the goods. Take It to Them, Go For It!
I'm not sure about this line of thinking. He doesn't have the explosiveness of the others in the group, how on earth was he going to ride away from them in the wind today? Zero chance. May as well just tuck in and conserve. He'll get a chance at some point and I'm sure he'll give it a go, today wasn't the day. It could very well be that he's thinking the first 2 weeks are about conserving and managing, then give it a go in week 3. He was an outside chance for a podium at the start of the race, let's not be unreasonable about expectations here, he's still the same rider.
 
Re: Tejay Van Garderen

I don't see what Patton has to do with TJVG riding the TdF, on his bike busting his arse six hours a day (that's not a quote from Patton BTW), doing the best that he can. Yes, "winning is everything" (and winning at all cost, I may add) are deeply rooted in the American psyche. Doing the best you can with the cards you are dealt is also very American. That's what he does.
 
Re: Re:

Son of Amsterhammer said:
Carols said:
Tejay sure is hanging in there but dude you have to make a Move! Just about everyone in the top group made an attack today except the guy in 2nd! Like I said he is white bread. This Tour he has put on some butter and jam, but it's time to show us the goods. Take It to Them, Go For It!
I'm not sure about this line of thinking. He doesn't have the explosiveness of the others in the group, how on earth was he going to ride away from them in the wind today? Zero chance. May as well just tuck in and conserve. He'll get a chance at some point and I'm sure he'll give it a go, today wasn't the day. It could very well be that he's thinking the first 2 weeks are about conserving and managing, then give it a go in week 3. He was an outside chance for a podium at the start of the race, let's not be unreasonable about expectations here, he's still the same rider.
I'm tough on him because he is the best we have, sigh!
 
Re: Re:

SeriousSam said:
Psalmon said:
SeriousSam said:
What's with all the disapproval for TJ? He's doing the right figh to accomplish his objective of making it onto the podium of the Tour de France.
Because you don't get to be 2nd DURING the TdF that easily or often. Every year is different. Next year you miss out on a cross wind stage. You have a mechanical that loses you minutes. You may crash in May during preparation. You get ill, have a bad day... New talented riders come along. Older talented riders return/focus. The future is NOW.

But his goal is racing for third. That's our best from the USA now? That's who we are now? Not getting 3rd, RACING for 3rd. It's. Totally. Demoralizing. May I remind you (not the movie version, the real one):

"Americans love to fight. All real Americans love the sting and clash of battle. When you were kids, you all admired the champion marble shooter, the fastest runner, the big-league ball players and the toughest boxers. Americans love a winner and will not tolerate a loser. Americans play to win all the time. That's why Americans have never lost and will never lose a war. The very thought of losing is hateful to Americans." - Patton
There is nothing wrong with racing for third when you know your limitations. Getting third would be a huge success for him. Given that the chance he wins the Tour is less than 1%, it makes sense to target an objective that he could actually achieve.

That said, it's also not clear that Tejay doing one of those "attacks" that we saw Nibali or Contador do today makes him more likely to win the Tour. If anything, he might have blown up. Tejay can't do changes of pace as well as the others.

I get it, you want to see him attack. Most of all, many might want to see him do his part to bring down Froome.

But TJ riding as he does makes perfect sense given that he craves a Tour podium. All you guys are basically either saying "TJ, why aren't you 10 times stronger than you are! Bah" or "TJ, why don't you give up riding for the podium to entertain us? Bah!"
+1.
He knows his limitations. Once he makes it to the podium, next year could be another objective and different strategy. As for now he is set to ride like that.
 
Jul 1, 2009
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Re: Re:

Escarabajo said:
SeriousSam said:
Psalmon said:
SeriousSam said:
What's with all the disapproval for TJ? He's doing the right figh to accomplish his objective of making it onto the podium of the Tour de France.
+1.
He knows his limitations. Once he makes it to the podium, next year could be another objective and different strategy. As for now he is set to ride like that.
Like Pinot?
 
Why should he attack and risk losing his second place spot? Seeing as there are clearly plenty of other guys willing to attack, he might as well just wait and see if Froome cracks. I mean, Tejay looks reasonably strong, but if all the other guys attacking didn't work, he probably wouldn't have accomplished anything either today. I realize everyone wants to see the race get more animated, but really, the smart thing to do is just play it conservative, protect the podium spot, and if it so happens that one of the various other riders hurling attacks at Froome actually manages to succeed in isolating and cracking him, maybe Tejay can use that to his advantage and put time into Froome.
 
Re: Re:

Psalmon said:
Escarabajo said:
SeriousSam said:
Psalmon said:
SeriousSam said:
What's with all the disapproval for TJ? He's doing the right figh to accomplish his objective of making it onto the podium of the Tour de France.
+1.
He knows his limitations. Once he makes it to the podium, next year could be another objective and different strategy. As for now he is set to ride like that.
Like Pinot?
It could very well happen. Riders like Pinot and TJ could be of more fragile minds than Froome, Contador or even Quintana. But it does not stop them of shooting high.
 
Re: Re:

SeriousSam said:
There is nothing wrong with racing for third when you know your limitations. Getting third would be a huge success for him. Given that the chance he wins the Tour is less than 1%, it makes sense to target an objective that he could actually achieve.

That said, it's also not clear that Tejay doing one of those "attacks" that we saw Nibali or Contador do today makes him more likely to win the Tour. If anything, he might have blown up. Tejay can't do changes of pace as well as the others.

I get it, you want to see him attack. Most of all, many might want to see him do his part to bring down Froome.

But TJ riding as he does makes perfect sense given that he craves a Tour podium. All you guys are basically either saying "TJ, why aren't you 10 times stronger than you are! Bah" or "TJ, why don't you give up riding for the podium to entertain us? Bah!"
I agree, today it made sense for him to sit tight, but that won't be the case for all future stages. It wouldn't surprise if sitting tight is all he will do, even if he is sitting in 4th place in GC.
 
Re: Re:

Psalmon said:
Escarabajo said:
SeriousSam said:
Psalmon said:
SeriousSam said:
What's with all the disapproval for TJ? He's doing the right figh to accomplish his objective of making it onto the podium of the Tour de France.
+1.
He knows his limitations. Once he makes it to the podium, next year could be another objective and different strategy. As for now he is set to ride like that.
Like Pinot?
Oooch! That hurts! :eek:

Your argument could be used against you: maybe it's the best shot he'll ever get at a TdF podium. Why squander it?
 
He should continue the way he's riding. He's leading the other contenders and a podium would be a huge deal for him and would actually carry a good amount of cachet in the US. At this point he should ride for 2nd (or 3rd if Nairo proves too strong) and forget about Froome unless he shows serious signs of weakness. AC, Nairo, Bala, and Nibali are the ones that need to do the attacking right now.

And TJ does attack at times. I'm not sure why Leipheimer has been brought up as I've seen TJ attack several times (he's probably already attacked more than LL did in his entire pro career, and this is from someone who actually liked Levi :eek: ). Unfortunately TJ has a tendency to go too deep into the red and drop himself.

He's simply not been strong enough to put in a successful attack anyway these last few stages so he's been smart to follow wheels. It doesn't make sense for people to expect him to attack right now. He's not racing for Froome to lose, he's racing for the best result he can get. All these other guys are GT champs and he hasn't even podiumed one yet. He should protect his podium and only if he feels great in the Alps and sees a real opportunity to put time into his podium rivals should he attack. All that said, I'm a bigger AC and Valverde fan and would rather see Valverde on the podium. (A Tour podium won't mean much to AC).
 
Sooner or later he is surely going to have to attack, or at least force the pace to try and drop a few riders. Valverde is looking strong, as is Thomas and I think they could well drop him next week if he insist's on just hanging in there. Contador seems to be finding some improvement too and like Thomas is only 1 minute behind.
 

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