The Climb (Froome's first autobiography)

[Benotti69]

Froome want to keep his distance from Henderson...

I’ve been head butted 3 times in my life, if my memory serves me correctly. Once by Greg Henderson, who now rides from Lotto-Belisol........

http://stevetilford.com/2014/06/20/pushing-headbutting-in-races/

 

[kingjr]

the Contador hate runs strong with you. Did he kick your puppy or something?

EDIT: I know it is off topic, so feel free to PM me. I'm just curious because it seems to go beyond he's a doper (maybe that's just it, dunno seems almost visceral with you (based on other comments)).

I think he's a Scleck-fan not sure though. Has been spewing BS about Contador in german forums as well.

 

[LaFlorecita]

All those people saying Contador doesn't play the "I'm clean" card have obviously not been paying attention. But maybe if it occurs in the Spanish media it never happened.

Oh I've read it. But he doesn't shove it in my face like Team Sky.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Id agree with parker here. I don't see any evidence that its a shot at Froome. There's no mention of Froome, he just posts a selfie like always does. That jesus hernandez retweets it, it means its a shot at Froome?

You don't think it's a little odd, that Hernandez, who normally always tweets in Spanish, replies to a Spanish tweet of Contador with: y coffee!!

Instead of simply - y café!! if he just wanted to say they also had a coffee?

 

[red_flanders]

All those people saying Contador doesn't play the "I'm clean" card have obviously not been paying attention. But maybe if it occurs in the Spanish media it never happened.

Maybe it would be helpful if you pointed out who is saying "Contador doesn't play the I'm clean card".

 

[LaFlorecita]

I disagree a bit. I thought it was a shot at Froome's reference - but more or less only in jest; don't think there was much malice in it. Contador can afford to joke the way 2014 is panning out.

Yea I agree with this

 

[LaFlorecita]

He didn't need to put any specific number of fingers in the air, whether 5 or 7. Flashing up 7 isn't far removed from Armstrong's rec room yellow jerseys tweet pic.

Have you not noticed he does this always? 2 fingers on the Champs in 2009, 3 in 2010, also 3 at (I think) Castilla y Leon

 

[Ripper]

You know what. Fair enough. You and I ain't that far apart on this.

snip ......

Your post sums up part of my reaction. There's a certain aloofness and haughtiness in the manner by which Sky and Froome communicate, especially their "we're clean, we're the cleanest, we're transparent (erm but not really)". Furthermore, with Froome, there is what appears to be an obvious immaturity and selfishness in his book (which is also apparent in some of his interviews). Add to all of this - the ridiculous signs of dopage, the over-the-top twitterings of his significant other, and the fact that he even wrote a biography at such a stage in his career.

Dirtie Bertie does not tend to have the same behaviours. He seems "more normal", at least insofar as he presents as neither aloof nor haughty. Bert has already been popped. Sure, that doesn't mean he is clean now ... but he has already paid a price. Gosh knows Tinkoff is an idiot, but he certainly does not say "we're the cleanest team" and then get caught in a lie.

And yes, Bert is more fun to watch race.

Who knows, should Froome get popped and get off the high horse, some folks might warm up to him!

 

[LaFlorecita]

I think he's a Scleck-fan not sure though. Has been spewing BS about Contador in german forums as well.

That would explain a lot. Wonder what he thinks of Andy's super peaks then?

 

[Weapons of @ss Destruction]

Have you not noticed he does this always? 2 fingers on the Champs in 2009, 3 in 2010, also 3 at (I think) Castilla y Leon

Yes, but he should know when to use some common sense in avoiding traps like indicating how many GTs (he thinks he) won.

 

[Ripper]

The more I read from Froome, the more he sounds like a younger Pharmstrong.

 

[The Hitch]

Have you not noticed he does this always? 2 fingers on the Champs in 2009, 3 in 2010, also 3 at (I think) Castilla y Leon

Cavendish also did it.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Yes, but he should know when to use some common sense in avoiding traps like indicating how many GTs (he thinks he) won.

Clearly he was making a statement there though.

 

[panache]

It is impossible to establish precisely who follows the established rules, who bends them, and who breaks them in this sport. To bear watching for other reasons, I choose other measures of "morality", against which I measure these riders. I would argue that a large group of us in the Clinic value authenticity and the absence of pretense as our measure.

I understand that being innocent until proven guilty has merit when establishing a system for punishment that is the most fair. But when deciding who I like and who I will support, my opinion of the rider's authenticity provides a clarity that helps me choose.

Froome will gain status with me when he overcomes true adversity (not manufactured Badzilla, Greg Henderson, Wiggans, Kenyan backwater, adversity) by way of his own inner strength. It could be a la Andy Schleck on the Galibier, Contador with Fuente de, Hinault in the 1980 LBL or even and Evans and Vino in the dramatic stage 7 of the 2010 Giro. Those highlighted the humans behind the drugs and the PR that allow respect to creep in despite the talk of PEDS. Froome is a Skybot to me. This book only reinforces that.

 

[SeriousSam]

Froome may be a doper, certainly. But the reasons for the Clinic hate are nowhere near as moral as disliking cheats.

This makes very little sense. In what sense are preferences moral?

There is certainly nothing unusual about disliking hypocrites. Dislike is an extremely common, culture transcending response to hypocrisy. If you don't share it, you probably don't believe the person in question is a hypocrite. Which in Froome's case amounts to not believing that he's a doper. Sky and Froome's hypocrisy is particularly aggravating because they pander to a certain .. unpalatable attitudes that exist among the more patriotically minded cycling fans.

 

[Gung Ho Gun]

I dislike dopers based on how hard I feel they insult my intelligence
That's why Froome is at the very top for me
Gilbert came pretty close with his Mur de Huy victory dance

 

[TourOfSardinia]

Thanks Dear Wiggo for joining these posts.

But that's just dumb - Contador never learns - making the same mistakes as last year - relaxing drinking coffee while Froome aches in pain.
Hope there's no false sense of security on either side.


IMO - the reason Froome has rushed out his autobiog now
is coz he wants to cash in before he gets caught.
He doesn't have to return the winnings he makes on the page.

 

[thehog]

And Henderson won a stage today!!

Must be sprinters day not climbers day

 

[The Hitch]

I dislike dopers based on how hard I feel they insult my intelligence
That's why Froome is at the very top for me
Gilbert came pretty close with his Mur de Huy victory dance

I listened to Walsh's joke interview with that irish radio from last november again recently.

Walsh saying that other teams might do a little bit of marginal gains "but no team" does it all like Sky does.

From a guy who 10 minutes earlier admits he got back into cycling a few months prior to that interview and has blatantly not interviewed every other team to see what they do.

Then he gives an appaling analogy about how shocked sky were, full with, for effect, whispering and nudging and sarcasm, about how David Millar was bathing in the sun during the Tour.

Apparently a veteran riding for fun, who is in on the sky lie to begin with, on a team that's going for the occasional breakway, , having a sunbathe is proof that all other gt contenders don't train properly like SKy.

You're damn right they insult our intelligence.

 

[martinvickers]

This makes very little sense. In what sense are preferences moral?

By openly admiring and supporting a doper because of the very performances that doping produced, one incentivises that doping. On some level one becomes accessory to it, and everything it entails. I prefer not to have that kind of blood on my hands. And yes, it's hard in this sport not to get some. But I try my best.

There is certainly nothing unusual about disliking hypocrites. Dislike is an extremely common, culture transcending response to hypocrisy. If you don't share it, you probably don't believe the person in question is a hypocrite. Which in Froome's case amounts to not believing that he's a doper. Sky and Froome's hypocrisy is particularly aggravating because they pander to a certain .. unpalatable attitudes that exist among the more patriotically minded cycling fans.

Which is a rather long winded way of saying Neo-fan Brits get up your nose, no?

More to the point, every rider who dopes and rides is a hypocrite. Every single one.

 

[the sceptic]

I listened to Walsh's joke interview with that irish radio from last november again recently.

Walsh saying that other teams might do a little bit of marginal gains "but no team" does it all like Sky does.

From a guy who 10 minutes earlier admits he got back into cycling a few months prior to that interview and has blatantly not interviewed every other team to see what they do.

Then he gives an appaling analogy about how shocked sky were, full with, for effect, whispering and nudging and sarcasm, about how David Millar was bathing in the sun during the Tour.

Apparently a veteran riding for fun, who is in on the sky lie to begin with, on a team that's going for the occasional breakway, , having a sunbathe is proof that all other gt contenders don't train properly like SKy.

You're damn right they insult our intelligence.

Walsh is like those women that fall in love with people on death row. Everyone keeps telling him its wrong, and deep down he knows he shouldnt do it. But he feels special and loved. He was the only one willing to give them a chance, and they fell in love with him too. Walsh is fighting for this relationship, even though any sane person can see it is doomed to fail.

 

[thehog]

I listened to Walsh's joke interview with that irish radio from last november again recently.

Walsh saying that other teams might do a little bit of marginal gains "but no team" does it all like Sky does.

From a guy who 10 minutes earlier admits he got back into cycling a few months prior to that interview and has blatantly not interviewed every other team to see what they do.

Then he gives an appaling analogy about how shocked sky were, full with, for effect, whispering and nudging and sarcasm, about how David Millar was bathing in the sun during the Tour.

Apparently a veteran riding for fun, who is in on the sky lie to begin with, on a team that's going for the occasional breakway, , having a sunbathe is proof that all other gt contenders don't train properly like SKy.

You're damn right they insult our intelligence.

Is the when mentions the Garmin guy having a beer and the Nutella incident?

Considering TUE and asthma-gate sounds like Walsh has locked himself in his bedroom and is listening to "Love Song from the 80's" whilst writing DW 4 CF all over his pencil case...

 

[Tinman]

It is impossible to establish precisely who follows the established rules, who bends them, and who breaks them in this sport. To bear watching for other reasons, I choose other measures of "morality", against which I measure these riders. I would argue that a large group of us in the Clinic value authenticity and the absence of pretense as our measure.

I understand that being innocent until proven guilty has merit when establishing a system for punishment that is the most fair. But when deciding who I like and who I will support, my opinion of the rider's authenticity provides a clarity that helps me choose.

Froome will gain status with me when he overcomes true adversity (not manufactured Badzilla, Greg Henderson, Wiggans, Kenyan backwater, adversity) by way of his own inner strength. It could be a la Andy Schleck on the Galibier, Contador with Fuente de, Hinault in the 1980 LBL or even and Evans and Vino in the dramatic stage 7 of the 2010 Giro. Those highlighted the humans behind the drugs and the PR that allow respect to creep in despite the talk of PEDS. Froome is a Skybot to me. This book only reinforces that.

Excellent post conceptually. But Froome and his girlfriend have done too much damage to his (their?) brand already.

 

[The Hitch]

Walsh is like those women that fall in love with people on death row. Everyone keeps telling him its wrong, and deep down he knows he shouldnt do it. But he feels special and loved. He was the only one willing to give them a chance, and they fell in love with him too. Walsh is fighting for this relationship, even though any sane person can see it is doomed to fail.

lol good analogy.

More to the point, every rider who dopes and rides is a hypocrite. Every single one

Im not sure you understand the meaning of the word hypocrisy, unless you are trying to say that refusing to confess to doping, while doing it, is hypocritical, which to me sounds like quite a stretch.
Of course no rider confesses to doping while doing it , it would defeat the purpose of the exercise to begin with.

But not saying anything at all on doping, or merely denying that one dopes, is not being a hypocrite. In the latter case, its being a liar. But being a liar is not the same as being a hypocrite. There's quite a big difference actually.
For example someone who openly believes lying is a perfectly acceptable part of human nature would not be a hypocrite, if they lied, but they would be a liar.

I prefer not to have that kind of blood on my hands.

Really?
Blood on your hands? For cheering for a rider who doped.

Even as a metaphor?

Dude

 

[The Hitch]

It is impossible to establish precisely who follows the established rules, who bends them, and who breaks them in this sport. To bear watching for other reasons, I choose other measures of "morality", against which I measure these riders. I would argue that a large group of us in the Clinic value authenticity and the absence of pretense as our measure.

I understand that being innocent until proven guilty has merit when establishing a system for punishment that is the most fair. But when deciding who I like and who I will support, my opinion of the rider's authenticity provides a clarity that helps me choose.

Froome will gain status with me when he overcomes true adversity (not manufactured Badzilla, Greg Henderson, Wiggans, Kenyan backwater, adversity) by way of his own inner strength. It could be a la Andy Schleck on the Galibier, Contador with Fuente de, Hinault in the 1980 LBL or even and Evans and Vino in the dramatic stage 7 of the 2010 Giro. Those highlighted the humans behind the drugs and the PR that allow respect to creep in despite the talk of PEDS. Froome is a Skybot to me. This book only reinforces that.

Good post. Very well put what many of us here feel, on some level.

Never saw Hinault but I certainly recognize Schleck on Galibier. Contador as well, though not Fuente de, for me that will always be telegraphe- Galibier, Alpe and to a lesser extent, Gap 3 days earlier. Heroic efforts in defeat are greater than ones in victory.