- Nov 8, 2012
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- Aug 13, 2010
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If once you start down the dark path, forever will it dominate your destiny, consume you it will.Benotti69 said:
- Jan 24, 2012
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Scott SoCal said:
Absolutely great post. It is so obvious and yet people still don't get it. Come 2016 or so and Froome could easily be nearly forgotten and the entire discussion will be on some young French rider or someone else who knows. Maybe there will be a Romain Bardet thread with 100,000 posts by 2018!
- Apr 9, 2009
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Dirty Bertie is yesterday's news - we beat this old dead horse ad nauseum back during his clen-beef-erol case and before. Contador's been an obvious doper for a long time and this has been verified through "official" sanctions.
Froome is the new doper on the block and has yet to be busted so he will inherently receive more speculation. So far he and Sky show obvious parallels to Armstrong and US Postal. They look like obvious superchargers that may have UCI protection. And they are d-bags who chest thump about how clean they are and insinuating they'd win even more if their competition weren't so dirty.
In summary Froome draws ire due to outsize hypocrisy and ******baggery, just like one Mr. Armstrong. This certainly does not make Contador's doping okay, but it is another lesson in basic human nature - that is, being a major a-hole puts a big target on your back. Froome has brought this upon himself.
Froome is the new doper on the block and has yet to be busted so he will inherently receive more speculation. So far he and Sky show obvious parallels to Armstrong and US Postal. They look like obvious superchargers that may have UCI protection. And they are d-bags who chest thump about how clean they are and insinuating they'd win even more if their competition weren't so dirty.
In summary Froome draws ire due to outsize hypocrisy and ******baggery, just like one Mr. Armstrong. This certainly does not make Contador's doping okay, but it is another lesson in basic human nature - that is, being a major a-hole puts a big target on your back. Froome has brought this upon himself.
For as long as the same riders dominate TTs and climbs and have a team train how on earth can anyone with any knowledge of what the sport was like pre-EPO look at that and believe?
Never mind all the contradictory cr@p from Sky, Wiggins and Froome, Leinders etc.
Personal insults are uncalled for but he is the first rider since Lance to dominate like Lance, first team since USPS to dominate like USPS. Perhaps people vent their frustration at the last 25 years and at the UCI lack of change at Froome. To me he represents more of the same, no change since the Lance days. His story is uncannily like Lance's too which doesn't help him.
Personally I was delighted to to hear he was out, not at all because I was happy he crashed or got injured but because there was a chance that we would have a tour not dominated by a train, a tour more interesting than the last 2 years' borefests. And for me it already has been.
If contador/saxo or any other rider/team were dominating like Lance/USPS did, dominating climbs and TTs and claiming to be clean repeatedly, while beating rampant dopers' records they would be getting as much stick as Froome does.
Never mind all the contradictory cr@p from Sky, Wiggins and Froome, Leinders etc.
Personal insults are uncalled for but he is the first rider since Lance to dominate like Lance, first team since USPS to dominate like USPS. Perhaps people vent their frustration at the last 25 years and at the UCI lack of change at Froome. To me he represents more of the same, no change since the Lance days. His story is uncannily like Lance's too which doesn't help him.
Personally I was delighted to to hear he was out, not at all because I was happy he crashed or got injured but because there was a chance that we would have a tour not dominated by a train, a tour more interesting than the last 2 years' borefests. And for me it already has been.
If contador/saxo or any other rider/team were dominating like Lance/USPS did, dominating climbs and TTs and claiming to be clean repeatedly, while beating rampant dopers' records they would be getting as much stick as Froome does.
red_flanders
Moderator
- Apr 3, 2009
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TheSpud said:
Assuming this is true, and it's not unreasonable, the question seems to be, "Why is that?"
Any thoughts from the OP on that?
- Jul 21, 2012
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- Jul 1, 2013
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While the opening post is observably correct, I think it's fair and understandable the current Tour champion is foremost in the crosshairs of suspicion given the recent (and frankly now not so recent) history of the sport. You'd hope at the end of this race, that focus will adjust somewhat. If it doesn't, maybe it's less fair than I'm claiming
I only really get irritated when some of the comments are childishly personal or bitter, just seems needless to me and adds absolutely nothing to the debate
I only really get irritated when some of the comments are childishly personal or bitter, just seems needless to me and adds absolutely nothing to the debate
- Dec 7, 2010
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BradCantona said:
What about when an OP is childishly personal and bitter?
Can't imagine that reasoned debate will follow.
- Jul 1, 2013
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Big Doopie said:
Ok. And yet you are happy to support the amazing performances of riders who can beat him??
Dalakhani said:
How do you know this, has Contador ever ridden clean so that we can know his undoped ability?
It's a bit tricky trying to compare one rider's clean ability against another's when the general feeling is that all are doped, and have always been doped. Sort of saps away any feeling of wanting to watch pro cycling.
- Jun 14, 2010
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If the forum was "inherently" anti Froome then there would have been threads about Froome before he overnight turned himself into the most physiologically dominant cyclist that ever lived.
I think however that if you search for clinic references for Froome pre August 2011, you'll get as many hits as you'll find of Froome's references of Bilharzia before he decided he needed an excuse- 0
Same goes for Sky. You'll find a strong correlation between them lying through their teeth and their popularity in the clinic.
Which proves there's nothing inherently anti Sky or Froome here at all. Just anti lying and cheating.
It is true that some posters had a more positive reaction to Froome crashing out than Contador. That's just 1 or 2 posters though hardly the whole clinic.
Me I feel far worse about Contador crashing out cos I really wanted a verified doper to win the Tour just to laugh at the apologists and hypocrites trying to sing the "new era" song with a Contador win following the evans, froome and wiggins ones. It makes me really upset atm that a total fluke has robbed me of that, maybe for ever.
But I still was upset that Froome crashed out. I wanted to see his clearly doped performances go under scrutiny again.
I think however that if you search for clinic references for Froome pre August 2011, you'll get as many hits as you'll find of Froome's references of Bilharzia before he decided he needed an excuse- 0
Same goes for Sky. You'll find a strong correlation between them lying through their teeth and their popularity in the clinic.
Which proves there's nothing inherently anti Sky or Froome here at all. Just anti lying and cheating.
It is true that some posters had a more positive reaction to Froome crashing out than Contador. That's just 1 or 2 posters though hardly the whole clinic.
Me I feel far worse about Contador crashing out cos I really wanted a verified doper to win the Tour just to laugh at the apologists and hypocrites trying to sing the "new era" song with a Contador win following the evans, froome and wiggins ones. It makes me really upset atm that a total fluke has robbed me of that, maybe for ever.
But I still was upset that Froome crashed out. I wanted to see his clearly doped performances go under scrutiny again.
red_flanders
Moderator
- Apr 3, 2009
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The Hitch said:If the forum was "inherently" anti Froome then there would have been threads about Froome before he overnight turned himself into the most physiologically dominant cyclist that ever lived.
And again, someone with a brain nails it.
Pure gold, Jerry.
I vote that if you don't have a retort to this post–some kind of cogent reason why these verifiable facts aren't the case, you should be insta-banned for any form of whining/screaming/crying about "bias".
- Jun 15, 2009
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Yes Sir Admin, but imagine... it was in context with Hitchey post.
Edit: Ah, ok you deleted the relevant posts. Thx for playing god... Outta here.
Edit: Ah, ok you deleted the relevant posts. Thx for playing god... Outta here.
- Nov 12, 2010
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The clinic is against
1) Miracles
2) Great Performances
3) Jumps in performances
4) p/w > 6.2
5) Any association with doping
6) Any explanation of 1-4 above
It has been especially vitriolic about LA, Contador and Sky/Froome. LA needs no intro. Contador because of his max VAM in 2009 TDf and Clenbutarol case. Sky/Froome happen to be the current toppers but most of the vitriol is associated with their explanations especially with bilharzia and marginal gains. People here have been betrayed again and again and then presented such ridiculous explanations of why so that it stretches the imagination
1) Miracles
2) Great Performances
3) Jumps in performances
4) p/w > 6.2
5) Any association with doping
6) Any explanation of 1-4 above
It has been especially vitriolic about LA, Contador and Sky/Froome. LA needs no intro. Contador because of his max VAM in 2009 TDf and Clenbutarol case. Sky/Froome happen to be the current toppers but most of the vitriol is associated with their explanations especially with bilharzia and marginal gains. People here have been betrayed again and again and then presented such ridiculous explanations of why so that it stretches the imagination
- May 27, 2012
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- Jun 15, 2009
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- May 27, 2012
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Big Doopie
BANNED
- Oct 6, 2009
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purcell said:
Who would that be?
Bardet? Pinot? Rolland?
Um... I am not a froome supporter. Not one single post in support.
But I do believe the unbridled fandom that Clentadoppucci enjoys here at CN comes close to the LA crazies, particularly since we know for a FACT that his ENTIRE reputation and all his results are based on unapologetic fraud.
- Jul 18, 2013
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Yes, Dirty Bertie doesn't just have one strike against him (Clenbuterol), he has two (8-10 times normal levels of plasticiser in the urine).
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/widespread-plasticizer-clouds-doping-tests-cyclists/
The fact that he rides now at the same level as he did when he was caught back in 2010 indicates that nothing's changed. Doper.
http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/widespread-plasticizer-clouds-doping-tests-cyclists/
The fact that he rides now at the same level as he did when he was caught back in 2010 indicates that nothing's changed. Doper.
- May 27, 2012
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