The greatest classic rider of the 21st century

[CheckMyPecs]

Re: Re:

Including a rider as one-dimensional as Boonen here is a joke.

So one dimensional I agree. 7 cobbled monuments, a rainbow jersey won in a sprint and a Tour points jersey, along with 6 stages. God.

By highlighting the fact that 7 of his 8 major one-day wins came on the cobbles, you are proving my point.

That one-dimensional rider has the largest number of victories in big classics of all mentioned! I think that speaks enough...

Quantity and variety are two different concepts.

 

[Brullnux]

Re: Re:

Including a rider as one-dimensional as Boonen here is a joke.

So one dimensional I agree. 7 cobbled monuments, a rainbow jersey won in a sprint and a Tour points jersey, along with 6 stages. God.

By highlighting the fact that 7 of his 8 major one-day wins came on the cobbles, you are proving me right.

It's not like Cancellara or Gilbert have won a large range of one day races.

 

[Mr.White]

Re: Re:

Including a rider as one-dimensional as Boonen here is a joke.

So one dimensional I agree. 7 cobbled monuments, a rainbow jersey won in a sprint and a Tour points jersey, along with 6 stages. God.

By highlighting the fact that 7 of his 8 major one-day wins came on the cobbles, you are proving my point.

That one-dimensional rider has the largest number of victories in big classics of all mentioned! I think that speaks enough...

Quantity and variety are two different concepts.

Cancellara's 6 of 7 major wins are on the cobbles. Is he one-dimensional too?

Quantity of big wins = quality. We didn't speak of variety...

 

[CheckMyPecs]

Re: Re:

By highlighting the fact that 7 of his 8 major one-day wins came on the cobbles, you are proving me right.

It's not like Cancellara or Gilbert have won a large range of one day races.

Sure, Boonen is simply the most egregious case.

Cancellara's 6 of 7 major wins are on the cobbles. Is he one-dimensional too?

As a classics rider, yes he is.

 

[Dazed and Confused]

I don't think it makes sense seeing only the classics part when looking at the absolute top cyclists.

Voted Cancellara.

 

[El Pistolero]

Re:

I don't think it makes sense seeing only the classics part when looking at the absolute top cyclists.

Voted Cancellara.

Then you voted wrong. This is about one-day races which are a totally different beast all-together than time trials for example. In a time trial the strongest always wins, in classics you need a combination of wit, luck and strength. Therefor a classic win will always be more prestigious than a win in a time trial.

 

[May0maniac]

I voted for Bettini, you could also make a chase for Boonen and even for Cancellara, but I used to be a huge Bettini fan (seeing him leading the breakaway through my village while wearing the rainbow jersey on the 2007 Zocolan stage is one of my favourite cycling related memories), so I'm biased.

 

[El Pistolero]

Re:

Including a rider as one-dimensional as Boonen here is a joke.

Gent-Wevelgem, the Ronde van Vlaanderen and Paris-Roubaix are actually three very different races.

How many active riders have won these 3 classics in their career? Only one: Tom Boonen.

How many active riders have won the Ronde van Vlaanderen and Paris-Roubaix? Only two: Tom Boonen and Fabian Cancellara.

He was also on the podium twice in Milan-San Remo and once in Paris-Tours (after attacking on the hills, so he didn't even wait for a bunch sprint). He also won the Belgian Nats in the Ardennes beating none other than Philippe Gilbert.

 

[Dazed and Confused]

Re: Re:

I don't think it makes sense seeing only the classics part when looking at the absolute top cyclists.

Voted Cancellara.

Then you voted wrong. This is about one-day races which are a totally different beast all-together than time trials for example. In a time trial the strongest always wins, in classics you need a combination of wit, luck and strength. Therefor a classic win will always be more prestigious than a win in a time trial.

Don't want to "compare" the different wins. Rather I think its impossible to just extract a certain part of races when comparing riders. At this level that is. I view Cancellara above the others in the poll. also when is comes to classics.

 

[Flamin]

Re: Re:

Mindboggling that Boonen has more votes than Canc

That's because he won more (and bigger) one-day races than Cancellara.

Oh, so rides like Mendrisio, Ronde 2011 or MSR 2012 should be totally ignored because they didn't come with a result??

And what about quality? Should not be looked at either?

 

[El Pistolero]

Re: Re:

Mindboggling that Boonen has more votes than Canc

That's because he won more (and bigger) one-day races than Cancellara.

Oh, so rides like Mendrisio, Ronde 2011 or MSR 2012 should be totally ignored because they didn't come with a result??

And what about quality? Should not be looked at either?

Oh, so rides like Paris-Roubaix 2007, Ronde van Vlaanderen 2008 and Ronde van Vlaanderen 2009 should be totally ignored because they didn't come with a result??

Boonen has more quality wins than Cancellara when it comes to classics.

 

[Flamin]

Re: Re:

Mindboggling that Boonen has more votes than Canc

That's because he won more (and bigger) one-day races than Cancellara.

Oh, so rides like Mendrisio, Ronde 2011 or MSR 2012 should be totally ignored because they didn't come with a result??

And what about quality? Should not be looked at either?

Oh, so rides like Paris-Roubaix 2007, Ronde van Vlaanderen 2008 and Ronde van Vlaanderen 2009 should be totally ignored because they didn't come with a result??

Boonen has more quality wins than Cancellara when it comes to classics.

Really not sure if you're trolling now or if you're serious.

 

[Cannibal72]

Re: Re:

Including a rider as one-dimensional as Boonen here is a joke.

So one dimensional I agree. 7 cobbled monuments, a rainbow jersey won in a sprint and a Tour points jersey, along with 6 stages. God.

By highlighting the fact that 7 of his 8 major one-day wins came on the cobbles, you are proving my point.

That one-dimensional rider has the largest number of victories in big classics of all mentioned! I think that speaks enough...

Quantity and variety are two different concepts.

It's absurd to forget the level of specialisation in the modern peloton. There is no rider active - including Sagan - who can possibly win a variety of monuments.

 

[vredeling]

Just 2 times Gilbert? Most versatile of the named riders. And was incredible in his Ibarguren-year.

 

[Mr.White]

Re: Re:

Mindboggling that Boonen has more votes than Canc

That's because he won more (and bigger) one-day races than Cancellara.

Oh, so rides like Mendrisio, Ronde 2011 or MSR 2012 should be totally ignored because they didn't come with a result??

And what about quality? Should not be looked at either?

Oh, so rides like Paris-Roubaix 2007, Ronde van Vlaanderen 2008 and Ronde van Vlaanderen 2009 should be totally ignored because they didn't come with a result??

Boonen has more quality wins than Cancellara when it comes to classics.

Really not sure if you're trolling now or if you're serious.

Why wouldn't he be serious?! Boonen is better classics rider, he has more quality wins. And what about Mendrisio, San Remo? He rode how he rode, he get the result according to that. Classics are not strength contest, they include tactics, luck, team strength, brains and much more. That's why they are so interesting and significant

 

[Brullnux]

Re: Re:

Including a rider as one-dimensional as Boonen here is a joke.

So one dimensional I agree. 7 cobbled monuments, a rainbow jersey won in a sprint and a Tour points jersey, along with 6 stages. God.

By highlighting the fact that 7 of his 8 major one-day wins came on the cobbles, you are proving my point.

That one-dimensional rider has the largest number of victories in big classics of all mentioned! I think that speaks enough...

Quantity and variety are two different concepts.

It's absurd to forget the level of specialisation in the modern peloton. There is no rider active - including Sagan - who can possibly win a variety of monuments.

Moscon.



May as well make sure the hype train gathers steam in time for his Moser moment

 

[El Pistolero]

I'm really curious how those two Valverde voters can justify their choice.

He's easily the weakest on this list.

 

[Cannibal72]

Re: Re:

Including a rider as one-dimensional as Boonen here is a joke.

So one dimensional I agree. 7 cobbled monuments, a rainbow jersey won in a sprint and a Tour points jersey, along with 6 stages. God.

By highlighting the fact that 7 of his 8 major one-day wins came on the cobbles, you are proving my point.

That one-dimensional rider has the largest number of victories in big classics of all mentioned! I think that speaks enough...

Quantity and variety are two different concepts.

It's absurd to forget the level of specialisation in the modern peloton. There is no rider active - including Sagan - who can possibly win a variety of monuments.

Moscon.



May as well make sure the hype train gathers steam in time for his Moser moment

My boy Moscon doesn't count. He's not winning a variety, he's winning them all. More than once.

 

[Flamin]

Re: Re:

That's because he won more (and bigger) one-day races than Cancellara.

Oh, so rides like Mendrisio, Ronde 2011 or MSR 2012 should be totally ignored because they didn't come with a result??

And what about quality? Should not be looked at either?

Oh, so rides like Paris-Roubaix 2007, Ronde van Vlaanderen 2008 and Ronde van Vlaanderen 2009 should be totally ignored because they didn't come with a result??

Boonen has more quality wins than Cancellara when it comes to classics.

Really not sure if you're trolling now or if you're serious.

Why wouldn't he be serious?! Boonen is better classics rider, he has more quality wins. And what about Mendrisio, San Remo? He rode how he rode, he get the result according to that. Classics are not strength contest, they include tactics, luck, team strength, brains and much more. That's why they are so interesting and significant

Mendrisio is an example of Cancellara being able to handle tough hilly classics, unlike Boonen.

Cancellara won 5 of his monuments solo, after destroying everybody. He annihilated Boonen in prime shape on the Muur, then pulled of a 50k solo a week later against the same Boonen.

How exactly does Boonen have more quality wins?

 

[El Pistolero]

Re: Re:

Mendrisio is an example of Cancellara being able to handle tough hilly classics, unlike Boonen.

Cancellara won 5 of his monuments solo, after destroying everybody. He annihilated Boonen in prime shape on the Muur, then pulled of a 50k solo a week later against the same Boonen.

How exactly does Boonen have more quality wins?

And Boonen destroyed Cancellara from 2005 till 2009... Boonen won the Ronde van Vlaanderen solo in 2005 and Paris-Roubaix solo in 2009 and 2012... As if a solo win somehow makes it better anyway... A win is a win.

Oh and Cancellara won a grand total of zero tough hilly classics. He never attempted Liège-Bastogne-Liège or the Giro di Lombardia. So why bother bringing his ability in tough hilly classics up? He's never ridden them.

 

[Arredondo]

Re: Re:

Mendrisio is an example of Cancellara being able to handle tough hilly classics, unlike Boonen.

Cancellara won 5 of his monuments solo, after destroying everybody. He annihilated Boonen in prime shape on the Muur, then pulled of a 50k solo a week later against the same Boonen.

How exactly does Boonen have more quality wins?

And Boonen destroyed Cancellara from 2005 till 2009... Boonen won the Ronde van Vlaanderen solo in 2005 and Paris-Roubaix solo in 2009 and 2012... As if a solo win somehow makes it better anyway... A win is a win.

Oh and Cancellara won a grand total of zero tough hilly classics. He never attempted Liège-Bastogne-Liège or the Giro di Lombardia. So why bother bringing his ability in tough hilly classics up? He's never ridden them.

Well, winning PR after a 60 km solo and by a margin of 3 minutes, is surely more impressive then beating Leif Hoste in a sprint-a-deux in the Tour of Flanders. It also says something about supremacy and class.

 

[peloton]

For me, easy, Boonen

 

[El Pistolero]

Re: Re:

Mendrisio is an example of Cancellara being able to handle tough hilly classics, unlike Boonen.

Cancellara won 5 of his monuments solo, after destroying everybody. He annihilated Boonen in prime shape on the Muur, then pulled of a 50k solo a week later against the same Boonen.

How exactly does Boonen have more quality wins?

And Boonen destroyed Cancellara from 2005 till 2009... Boonen won the Ronde van Vlaanderen solo in 2005 and Paris-Roubaix solo in 2009 and 2012... As if a solo win somehow makes it better anyway... A win is a win.

Oh and Cancellara won a grand total of zero tough hilly classics. He never attempted Liège-Bastogne-Liège or the Giro di Lombardia. So why bother bringing his ability in tough hilly classics up? He's never ridden them.

Well, winning PR after a 60 km solo and by a margin of 3 minutes, is surely more impressive then beating Leif Hoste in a sprint-a-deux in the Tour of Flanders. It also says something about supremacy and class.

And You're a fan of Rodriguez, lol?

Because beating Sep Vanmarcke in a sprint at Roubaix is so impressive, amiright? You're just cherry picking examples... Boonen did a similar solo in 2012...

 

[Arredondo]

Re: Re:

Mendrisio is an example of Cancellara being able to handle tough hilly classics, unlike Boonen.

Cancellara won 5 of his monuments solo, after destroying everybody. He annihilated Boonen in prime shape on the Muur, then pulled of a 50k solo a week later against the same Boonen.

How exactly does Boonen have more quality wins?

And Boonen destroyed Cancellara from 2005 till 2009... Boonen won the Ronde van Vlaanderen solo in 2005 and Paris-Roubaix solo in 2009 and 2012... As if a solo win somehow makes it better anyway... A win is a win.

Oh and Cancellara won a grand total of zero tough hilly classics. He never attempted Liège-Bastogne-Liège or the Giro di Lombardia. So why bother bringing his ability in tough hilly classics up? He's never ridden them.

Well, winning PR after a 60 km solo and by a margin of 3 minutes, is surely more impressive then beating Leif Hoste in a sprint-a-deux in the Tour of Flanders. It also says something about supremacy and class.

And You're a fan of Rodriguez, lol?

Because beating Sep Vanmarcke in a sprint at Roubaix is so impressive, amiright? You're just cherry picking examples... Boonen did a similar solo in 2012...

I'm not saying winning a classic due to a sprint is a bad thing. Btw, Purito won his 2 Lombardia's solo

Boonen did a similar solo indeed, but without Cancellara in the race. And his biggest rival Pozzato crashed when he still had the chance to react on Boonen's attack (he was 20 seconds in front i think).

Cancellara did won monuments thanks to a great solo, with Boonen in the race, as his biggest rival: Paris-Roubaix 2006, Flanders 2010, Paris-Roubaix 2010. Boonen won PR in a sprint against Cancellara back in 2008. And he won solo in 2009, but Canc was in really bad shape that year.

But Cancellara also won MSR, so in my opinion he's the better classics rider. And for Boonen it was potentially easier to win La Primavera because he was (is) a way better sprinter.

 

[Flamin]

Re: Re:

Mendrisio is an example of Cancellara being able to handle tough hilly classics, unlike Boonen.

Cancellara won 5 of his monuments solo, after destroying everybody. He annihilated Boonen in prime shape on the Muur, then pulled of a 50k solo a week later against the same Boonen.

How exactly does Boonen have more quality wins?

And Boonen destroyed Cancellara from 2005 till 2009... Boonen won the Ronde van Vlaanderen solo in 2005 and Paris-Roubaix solo in 2009 and 2012... As if a solo win somehow makes it better anyway... A win is a win.

Oh and Cancellara won a grand total of zero tough hilly classics. He never attempted Liège-Bastogne-Liège or the Giro di Lombardia. So why bother bringing his ability in tough hilly classics up? He's never ridden them.

Not prime Cancellara. Of course it makes it better, don't be silly. So Copenhagen WCRR = Firenze, because a win is a win right?

So what if he didn't win a tough hilly classic? We are comparing Cancellara and Boonen. Canc obviously has the superior ability in them. He proved it in Peking, Mendrisio (and Strade Bianche). But again you find a way to completely ignore this by saying he never rode Liege or Lombardia.