The much needed UCI loller thread

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No it isn't hypocrisy, they simply can't do anything when there's no proof. In this case there is literal proof, cause on of the 2 actors has admitted doing it like the moron he is. I honestly do not understand what people want. What do you want the UCI to do here? Ignore it and give the message that it is completely fine to try to "bribe" riders from other teams (what EF does is worse than De Bondt "accepting" it)? It's completely unacceptable in any serious sport and for some reason in cycling fans are fine with it. Why?

The fact that De Bondt thought it was normal to just openly speak about it already says enough. It's a problem and they all think it's completely ok to do. At least the UCI makes a statement now that it is against the rules (like it should be hello?). Will it stop now? Of course not, but maybe some teams will think twice before doing it cause you never know if you're colluding with a complete utter moron who's gonna tell the press he's doing it.

Moral of the story is that De Bondt is a dumbass. He was a good enough rider to get a contract somewhere else without any problems but he now isn't just risking a punishment, but also has showed to teams that he's not trustworthy, which is definitely more harmful. That being said, enough decent teams who would beg for a rider like him in their team so he will still find a contract.
Is it a bribe if a gc rider tells a rider on another team he can have the stage win if he helps me gain on GC?
 
Is it a bribe if a gc rider tells a rider on another team he can have the stage win if he helps me gain on GC?

No cause you both ride for your own or teams best result that way. Not even remotely the same and you know it. Stop with the whataboutism. There's isn't a single precedent for this case. So don't start with Thomas-Cav or Ganna-Milan or whatever cause even these cases (even tho I'm not really a fan of it myself and technically that is also against the rules) aren't similar.

Nah, moral of the story is this is just another spoon feed for the mob. The main message IMHO is being presented as it's OK if you do it, just don't be "dumb" and say it out loud. And now the mob gets to say for the X times on how dumb somebody is, basically suggesting we, the mob, we would never say it out loud.

Anyway.

This is literally the case for EVERYTHING in life when someone breaks the rules or laws lmao. You can't do anything if there's no proof. How is that so hard to understand. What's worse for a sport, that people do it behind the scenes from time to time knowing it's actually the wrong thing to do or that everyone thinks it's completely fine to pay people off/being paid off and just says it publicly they pay people off or are being payed off and everyone thinks it's fine. What a joke of a sport it would be.
 
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Isn't it against the rules?

No. There are other cases that are technically against the rules (helping a friend for example), but even those aren't similar cause there is no reward promised (well not that we know off of course). Again not a single precedent of a rider being asked to help a different team in return for a potential contract and doing exactly that AND admitting to it. And people are expecting the UCI just looks the other way lmao. In any other sport both Vanmarcke (way worse) and De Bondt would be hated for something similar.
 
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The important point would be no case that you know of. Not that I can cite one either but I dont have an encyclopedic knowledge of every stage race ever, no one does, so you can't categorically state its never happened, just never happened that we know of.

As surely any rider in a break is helping another team to success and deals are made all the time between teams with uncontested sprints and stage wins handed to each other.

Just last week in the Dauphine stage 1, Buitrago was in the breakaway, helping the other teams, when the sprint came just sat up and rolled in 18th.
 
I didn't delve into it but this is on how i understand on what happened. A rider will get sacked by his current team and he started sending out his CV, trying to impress potential future employer, AFAIK not doing that at the expense of his current team. Now IMHO this happens all the time and hence the only "crime" here was a rider was honest about it.

So the main message sent here was don't be so honest.

On what would deserve a disciplinary action, IMHO, if there would be some sort of systematic bribing ongoing or involved, on where one team would have riders in the other team on their pay list, them doing them favours, that indeed would be rather nasty.

So in the end and the way i see it much ado about nothing. I won't blame a person for being honest. Landa rode for Kuss too, who cares, it's their prerogative.
 
The important point would be no case that you know of. Not that I can cite one either but I dont have an encyclopedic knowledge of every stage race ever, no one does, so you can't categorically state its never happened, just never happened that we know of.

As surely any rider in a break is helping another team to success and deals are made all the time between teams with uncontested sprints and stage wins handed to each other.

You are literally just saying what I'm saying. No, indeed, not one that we know off cause no one is stupid enough to go to the press and say what exactly happened. When there's no proof the UCI can't punish a clear breach of the rules, when someone gives them the proof, they can, and that's exactly what happened; The fact that it happens all the time behind closed doors, doesn't change the fact that Ken Vanmarcke and Dries De Bondt did something that's against the rules. And not just any rules, they colluded. Ken Vanmarcke offered De Bondt a potential monetary reward if he did something for them that he normally wouldn't do. In what world is that fine?

Would you and others have the same energy if UAE for example would just be paying or promising contracts to other riders to ride for Pogacar when he's finally in some throuble at some point in this Tour? I doubt it.

Just last week in the Dauphine stage 1, Buitrago was in the breakaway, helping the other teams, when the sprint came just sat up and rolled in 18th.

You can't seriously think this is a good example of somthing similar? Like what? At least use another example of someone clearly being promised something, there's plenty, no one is denying that.

Buitrago jumped towards that group and relayed cause he's a GC rider wanting to get some seconds on others or because he wants to get a good result. Absolutely nothing dodgy about that. The fact that he goes early to try to surprise others and as a result as the only one of that break gets caught by the peloton doesn't change anything.

I didn't delve into it but this is on how i understand on what happened. A rider will get sacked by his current team and he started sending out his CV, trying to impress potential future employer, AFAIK not doing that at the expense of his current team. Now IMHO this happens all the time and hence the only "crime" here was a rider was honest about it.

No dude, the crime is him being "bribed", not that he admits to it. If someone kills something and later admits to it his crime isn't admitting to it but the fact that he killed someone. Like what are we even doing here. The fact that people get away with something cause no one can prove it happens, doesn't mean something is ok and the UCI can just look the other way when there's proof.

I get what you're trying to say. If De Bondt kept his mouth shut no one would've cared and everyone would've forgot, but that doesn't mean the UCI can just let it slide when someone openly admits to colluding and being bribed. It would be a slippery slope with more and more riders and teams doing it cause the UCI has then sent the message that it is completely fine to do. Which would make a mockery out of this sport.

All the examples of riders working together in breaks are just not the same, at all. There's almost every time (yes not always) a normal reason why they would do it.
 
@Samamba

Bribed in what way. Did he get money for it or a job position, or something? To my knowledge he just sent out his CV and tried to impress potential future employee. I consider that to be rather normal, knowing you are getting sacked by your current employee, and not criminal behaviour.

Family in the end has to eat, UCI won't pay the bills?
 
@Samamba

Bribed in what way. Did he get money for it or a job position, or something? To my knowledge he just sent out his CV and tried to impress potential future employee. I consider that to be rather normal, knowing you are getting sacked by your current employee, and not criminal behaviour.

Family in the end has to eat, UCI won't pay the bills?

De Bondt indeed "sent his CV" to a lot of teams, but Ken Vanmarcke (EF DS) went to him before the start and said something along the lines of "if you help us, there could be in it for you" (I don't remeber the exact words anymore) and De Bondt said that's why he did what he did. That is simply against the rules (something being criminal or not doesn't even matter here)

Ok, but the whole family thing is just irrelevant. At that point we can just be fine with stealing too. Also De Bondt would've gotten 0 problems getting a pro contract for 2026, plenty of teams who would like to have a guy like him.

I am also not saying that I really blame De Bondt for doing it btw, I am not someone who acts his morally better than others. Maybe I would do the same, but that doesn't make it ok.
 
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@Samamba

Thanks for explaining it further. Verbal contracts are enforceable, i will keep an eye on transfers, De Bondt to EF, otherwise IMHO De Bondt can take legal actions. A gag order on UCI is IMHO warranted too, gutting such small fishes, perfect food for mob. Anyway, yesterdays news.

That's not a verbal contract haha, it's a DS who said it. It doesn't mean anything apart from some sort of "promise". He's definitely not going to EF, as he has thrown them under the bus. Ken Vanmarcke, the DS, is probably in even more trouble than De Bondt. Like I said, the UCI actually enforcing something for once isn't a bad thing, even tho a lot of cycling "fans" think it's ok to do apparently. And I feel bad for Vanmarcke cause I know he's not the only one doing it, but maybe this actually at least sends a message to other people in the sport that they maybe should be a bit more careful. Hey maybe, we see less of it, which to me would be a good thing.
 
That's not a verbal contract haha, it's a DS who said it. It doesn't mean anything apart from some sort of "promise". He's definitely not going to EF, as he has thrown them under the bus. Ken Vanmarcke, the DS, is probably in even more throuble than De Bondt.

Just deny it and say you were drunk, after sign the papers with the new employee. Anyway, talk to the lawyer, peanut case.
 
Just deny it and say you were drunk, after sign the papers with the new employee. Anyway, talk to the lawyer, peanut case.

Yeah Vanmarcke will probably deny, which would help in a court, but the UCI ethics commission isn't that. Anyways I don't think they will get punished so harshly.

ah, I wondered where this was discussed. Should obviously come with a severe penalty for both, and Vanmarcke having to leave the sport for a year or two.

That's a bit too harsh imo, and more importantly I don't think that's possible without actually getting an actual legal battle. Vanmarcke would just deny and say that De Bondt misinterpret his words or something. UCI will try to make a statement by punishing them, but not too hard so that they don't get a legal mess.
 

Riders do seem to understand that UCI is currently not taking their safety seriously and the measures taken are mostly smoke and mirrors.
Well tbf this one is for the race organizer's. Humiliating debuting a race at this level when amateurism pops up from the surface.
UCI could relegate this senseless sprint at near monument distance, but silence is apparently their sharpest "weapon".