Teams & Riders The "MVP" Mathieu Van der Poel Road Discussion Thread

[EddyMazzoleni]

Great race, unfortunately he was sleeping when Pogacar attacked. It was not a circuit were dropping people was so easy, so i think he may have hold on to him.

Also, i think with today he has a 24 top 10s out of 29 250 km + races. (24/28 if we don't count Wollongong)

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

where are the haters now... climbed better than many expected

Without the totally crazy Pogacar he could've even won on this course. He was better than Remco uphill.

 

[Ricco']

also no lombardy... gravel wc last race of the season

"Oh nice, Lombardia parcours is somewhat easier than the norm and may be a good opportunity for me to have a nice place there. Plus, I'm climbing better than ever! So great!"

"So, of course you'll ride it this year, right Mathieu? What you have to lose?"

"Hehe not this time, of course not, I'm all in for the mighty Gravel Worlds and deserving a nice big old period of rest after that."

 

[Krzysztof_O]

where are the haters now... climbed better than many expected

Without the totally crazy Pogacar he could've even won on this course. He was better than Remco uphill.

MVP was ready today. Strong performance, no doubts. Even in races less-suited to him he managed to get top3 this year (Liege, WC). Lombardy will be more difficult though. One-day races legend already and more is still to come.

 

[ChasingPotatoes]

I wonder if Mathieu would have gotten closer with a smaller / more select group with e.g. Remco, Skujins and Healy, than being in a bigger group with less cohesion.

He was win-worthy but everybody (and thus also Mathieu) who had a chance following Pogacar was sleeping with 100K to go, even if it was clear Novak was pulling, Pogacar was in position and Tratnik was in the front group so something was going to happen.

I think Mathieu would have been able to follow Pog, especially so as Pog didn't seem to be prepared to bridge solo to the front group (so he wouldn't have tried to drop riders at all cost).

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Ive said it before but very much can make a case he is ahead of Boonen and Fabian. Not that need to go into that but you have case for it the numbers im sure blow they out of the water but if you take into acount the amount of entries in those monument Mvdp has had and the wins its a case.

But nevermind indeed a very good race from him remove the outliner he was very strong and multiple hard efforts that last one was hard and people was barely hanging on for life there and if not Pog wasnt ahead he might have gone all in instead of gambling on the spurt which it seemed he settled on now.

I think MVP will end up ahead of those in terms of achievements. The title of the most accomplished one-day racer of this century may be difficult to reach though (Teddy is on a crazy pace in one-day races as well).

 

[Peyroteo94]

Don't tell me Remco would follow this MVP in Olympics. Remco would never match his acceleration. Like I always say, WVA is Remco's best domestique.

 

[Keldergoat]

His results in monuments and worlds keeps on being fenomenal. In the shadow of the cannibale Pogacar he's becoming one of the best one day race riders of this century:

- 7 wins (3 x RvV, 2 x PR, 1 MSR and WC)
- 13 podiums (Boonen and Cancellara had 14 and 16 respectively)

Really enjoyed his smart, calculated racing Today. Don't mistaken that with passive, I think he was very active in the last 75km but he always kept his composure and never blew up.

 

[Blanco]

So, is he the 2nd best rider of the year, or is it Remco?
As things stand now, I would say he is.

 

[Peyroteo94]

So, is he the 2nd best rider of the year, or is it Remco?
As things stand now, I would say he is.

Of course he is second.

 

[ArnaudVDL]

So, is he the 2nd best rider of the year, or is it Remco?
As things stand now, I would say he is.

Based on results absolutely. Roubaix and Rvv trumps 2 time trials and the olympic medal in my opinion. Based on level, it is a toss up, mostly because of Evenepoels level in the tour. But in general, I also would say that Van der Poel is the second-best rider this year.

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

Don't tell me Remco would follow this MVP in Olympics. Remco would never match his acceleration. Like I always say, WVA is Remco's best domestique.

i still remain convinced Remco would not have won olympics RR without wva

 

[Peyroteo94]

i still remain convinced Remco would not have won olympics RR without wva

Of course not but some folks like to say he won by sheer power. Pure BS, MVP would kill Remco in a mano a mano. There is only one guy who can drop MVP in his own terrain and that's Pogacar. WVA can follow him sometimes allowing Remco to take advantage of that.

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

Of course not but some folks like to say he won by sheer power. Pure BS, MVP would kill Remco in a mano a mano. There is only one guy who can drop MVP in his own terrain and that's Pogacar. WVA can follow him sometimes allowing Remco to take advantage of that.

Pogacar is of a surreal realm. He can kick the strongest version of VDP in Flanders.. I have no words of the insane level of that man

 

[mlescanojr]

So, is he the 2nd best rider of the year, or is it Remco?
As things stand now, I would say he is.

Imho, yes.

 

[Unterlenkerfahrend]

Great form but I feel he needs to learn how to coordinate a team around him (something Pogacar is really good at). Wasted his teammates numbers when there was still a chance to use them to reduce the gap to Pogacar and instead entered into a jump-stop-jump game with Remco and the rest. I also have no idea what Mollema was doing.
He excels when other teams are mapping out the race for him which has happened a lot over the years in the classics with UAE and Visma doing the job but is showing a bit that Alpecin are mostly assuming the underdog role and letting him do his thing on his own. He rarely is coordinating with teammates and should've done more so today.

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

Great form but I feel he needs to learn how to coordinate a team around him (something Pogacar is really good at). Wasted his teammates numbers when there was still a chance to use them to reduce the gap to Pogacar and instead entered into a jump-stop-jump game with Remco and the rest. I also have no idea what Mollema was doing.
He excels when other teams are mapping out the race for him which has happened a lot over the years in the classics with UAE and Visma doing the job but is showing a bit that Alpecin are mostly assuming the underdog role and letting him do his thing on his own. He rarely is coordinating with teammates and should've done more so today.

Van der Poel told Mollema to ride for his own chances.

Van der Poel said it's better to race with teammates covering moves then to ride on the front and then having to react to everything when said teammate is empty.
He also explicitly told Kelderman, Oomen and Mollema not to ride when the outsider group went (before Pogacar), because he felt it wasn't up to them and he wanted to make other favorites nervous. That kinda worked when Pogacar went early. VDP thought it was a suicide move and his plan worked. He just didn't calculate for Pogacar being THAT strong.

It does make sense. Van der Poel likes stop/start racing, so he can make use of his ability to go beyond treshold and then recover quickly. On a course like this if it's just hard pace all the time he suffers much more, that's more WVA style.

 

[Keldergoat]

I think he wanted to keep Mollema with him as long as possible, and give him some freedom to ride for his own chances, given that he saw how quickly Belgium burned all their matches. Also, Mollema played his role quite well after that stop and sprint period at 70km from the finish. When MvdP was up on the road with Onley and earlier with Simmons he shadowed both Evenepoel and Jorgensen quite neatly.

The rest of the Dutch team just isn't that great on a hilly circuit, I might have expected a bit more from Van den Broek, but Hoole, Riesenbeek, Bax or even Oomen just are nowhere near the level that Belgium can put to the table atm, and even they were completely destroyed with 75km to go.

 

[Wyndbrook]

Imho, yes.

Yes to a core cycling fan, but to the more general sports fans then those two big golds in Paris would give it to Remco.
Tour de France and Olympics is nether trumped in the wider sports world.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Yes to a core cycling fan, but to the more general sports fans then those two big golds in Paris would give it to Remco.
Tour de France and Olympics is nether trumped in the wider sports world.

MVP has won two monuments, Evenepoel has won Olympic RR (monument-like value at least) plus two TT golds (each of them probably less valuable than a monument but two is a different story).

Other important achievements: MVP has a WC bronze vs Evenepoel's Tour podium. Tour is the most important race so it's top places are more valuable in my book. You could add 3rd in Liege for MVP vs Remco runner up in PN (less valuable than podium in Liege though).

Remco's achievements are not worse than Van der Poels (IMO slightly better). An important factor to me is that Evenepoel was a force in all kind of races: stage-races, one-day races and time-trials. I definitely regard him as the second best cyclist of the year. A phenom of all terrains but overshadowed by an even better performer this year.

 

[Salvarani]

Don't tell me Remco would follow this MVP in Olympics. Remco would never match his acceleration. Like I always say, WVA is Remco's best domestique.

Wout dont really like that though.

Remco just uses him and gets ahead.

Then Wout cant chase. MVDP wont chase with Wout just sitting on the wheel.

It favors the guy infront being able to ride his own tempo. Especially a rider with the engine Remco has.

Wout in these races is also too hesitant. He is trying to conserve and has missed out on so many occasions. Dont know why he doesnt try to go on the offense like in the semi-classics or Tour-stages.

The pshycologial advantage that MVDP also has just seem to be too big for him to cope with when the stakes are higher.

 

[senna6541]

Too bad he won't give Lombardy a shot, but at least we get to see him on the gravel. 2025 needs to about the MTB after the Spring Classics.

 

[Peyroteo94]

Too bad he won't give Lombardy a shot, but at least we get to see him on the gravel. 2025 needs to about the MTB after the Spring Classics.

Lombardia is another beast. He can't handle 10 km climbs against UAE. He simply can't

 

[OlavEH]

2025 needs to about the MTB after the Spring Classics.

Needs to be. Why? I actually hope he would skip that entirely.

 

[Gigs_98]

He is really good at pacing himself in these kind of hilly one day races which is why he is consistently getting really good results at them. That said, I do think people would attack his climbing weakness harder if there wasn't always someone like Pogacar or Evenepoel another minute up the road. He is yet to win a serious one day race with climbs harder than in AGR and even that he only won with a strong dose of luck, but I still think this recipe might win him a LBL or a world championship on a course people thought was too hard for him.