Teams & Riders The "MVP" Mathieu Van der Poel Road Discussion Thread

[JoãoRamos]

There is so much wrong with this. Pedersen was always the fastest in normal circumstances. And again, MVDP wasn’t at his best, he was sick the week before. Does that not compute for you?

I’m not particularly fond of excuses. Pogačar also crashed at Strade Bianche — we could easily say that affected his chances in MSR. But I prefer to accept defeat with grace.

And no, it doesn’t “compute” — because to me, that’s precisely the kind of reasoning that avoids acknowledging, plainly and irrefutably, that someone else is better. And right now, Pogačar is better. Even Van der Poel himself admitted today that he won’t break the Ronde record while Pogi is around. That speaks volumes.

 

[JoãoRamos]

Yes. He himself wanted to mention or highlight that he had been sick, therefore it seems more like an excuse. Agreed. He didnt have to say anything about it after the race.

Exactly.

Even his own parents seemed unwilling to accept the result, offering explanations instead of acknowledging a fair and undeniable defeat.

 

[kn0s]

Yes. He himself wanted to mention or highlight that he had been sick, therefore it seems more like an excuse. Agreed. He didnt have to say anything about it after the race.

He wasn't the one who said it to the media? Did he do that later?

 

[JoãoRamos]

Even his manager at Alpecin said, another sore loser.

Look at how Mads spoke: that’s grace in defeat. Simply acknowledging that someone was better, and that’s it.

When someone, immediately after losing, starts mentioning things like a cold, an ingrown nail, or any other minor setback, it takes away from the victory of the other person.

No one is concerned with such excuses, especially when the choice to race E3 was his own. There’s a time for explanations, but true sportsmanship is found in accepting the result with dignity.

 

[Berniece]

I’m not particularly fond of excuses. Pogačar also crashed at Strade Bianche — we could easily say that affected his chances in MSR. But I prefer to accept defeat with grace.

And no, it doesn’t “compute” — because to me, that’s precisely the kind of reasoning that avoids acknowledging, plainly and irrefutably, that someone else is better. And right now, Pogačar is better. Even Van der Poel himself admitted today that he won’t break the Ronde record while Pogi is around. That speaks volumes.

Strade impacted Pogacar indeed, but the race itself doesn’t suite Pogacar as much as MVDP.

But okay, being sick before the race doesn’t compute for you in not being able to deliver a higher performance. Now we know how you look at cycling. Results only, no context.

 

[AmRacer]

Results only, no context

Results only, no excuses.

 

[Barkintheeye]

Do you think RVV and PR would be the same with WVA there? Not this Wout but a Wout in his prime?

Wout in 2020 against MVDP at de Ronde was probably the best we have seen of him at least relative to the opposition. Unfortunately for him he lost the race by a few inches. Since then he hasn't been really close although this time he kept up with the second best racers.

 

[Didinho]

A shame we couldn’t see him battle with Pogi untill the end. He raced like when he would be 100%, but it got the better of him at some point. Better to try than to be sorry.

All these haters here would expect him to be with Stuyven the whole final? I’m a big Stuyven fan but a fully fit Mathieu is minutes better on this course, as we’ve seen plenty of times.

 

[AmRacer]

A shame we couldn’t see him battle with Pogi untill the end. He raced like when he would be 100%, but it got the better of him at some point. Better to try than to be sorry.

All these haters here would expect him to be with Stuyven the whole final? I’m a big Stuyven fan but a fully fit Mathieu is minutes better on this course, as we’ve seen plenty of times.

Hadn't Pogi raced, Mathieu would have dropped Stuyven and the rest.

 

[Didinho]

Hadn't Pogi raced, Mathieu would have dropped Stuyven and the rest.

He dropped them. Multiple times. But couldn’t hold his pace afterwards as in previous races. Don’t think without Pogi he could hold the others off alone yesterday, especially with the headwind.

 

[Unterlenkerfahrend]

MVDP has always had issues at times with terrible positioning, Kwaremont yesterday was bad but that wasn't deceisive.

He was way too focussed on the Visma/Trek guys, maybe his past rivalry with WVA played a role or he was still rattled by his crash. Visibly different to Pogacar tho who seemed at ease and in control the whole time, not bothered if someone comes back that he'll drop eventually anyway.
Irrespective if Pog was stronger yesterday or not, he needs to have the sections between the climbs as easy as possible to have a chance to stay with Pogacar. Pulling hard to keep Wout and others behind is not gonna help, if you drop them on every climb anyway what threat are they?

Hopefully he is not too badly hurt and the illness reports are exaggerated so that he'll be fit for Roubaix.

 

[Salvarani]

He dropped them. Multiple times. But couldn’t hold his pace afterwards as in previous races. Don’t think without Pogi he could hold the others off alone yesterday, especially with the headwind.

They would have gone slower on the bergs and MVDP would have had more in the tank to drop a wattbomb. He would have dropped the others and had more than enough to ride to the finish.

He was the only one following Pog for a long time on most of the bergs. He went over his limit, until he blew up. It was accumulated.

He had to follow and hope he would last. Being dropped earlier or riding within himself... Pog just ride away earlier and the others are stuck with second group syndrom.

 

[KenFiamingo]

A shame we couldn’t see him battle with Pogi untill the end. He raced like when he would be 100%, but it got the better of him at some point. Better to try than to be sorry.

Of course it's great to watch and if a cycling great drops another cycling great in Monument it's a legendary moment.

The question is whether it actually made sense for MVDP to blindly enter into a battle with Pogacar keeping in mind illness and the crash. I think the answer is no.

That said, MVDP not being MVDP and riding more conservatively and adding some tactical play to his game (especially with the 3 Visma's and 2 Trek's around) would feel weird. And likely, it wouldn't have changed the outcome at all.

 

[Didinho]

I’ve been using the same Whoop as Alpecin.

Here you can see my normal recoveries. Training hard when green, every week/month started to recover better after long efforts. I’m aiming for the Liege cyclo and a month later 3 Ballons cyclo.



Next month: all going wel. Trained harder but focusing on rest days when needed. Feeling fresh all the time.
Had my hardest week (the red and yellows in a row) before taking 7 days off to rest (the 5 greens in a row). But started getting sick and had to take antibiotics. Tried 1 ride but had to turn back after 30’. Now 10 days later and finally a low green and felt almost like myself again on the ride yesterday.



It’s almost as identical as Mathieu’s last weeks it seems. Just a representation of the energy level drop when sick. Hope he recovers better for next Sunday.

In other news: I will be ready for Roubaix!

 

[Keldergoat]

Of course it's great to watch and if a cycling great drops another cycling great in Monument it's a legendary moment.

The question is whether it actually made sense for MVDP to blindly enter into a battle with Pogacar keeping in mind illness and the crash. I think the answer is no.

That said, MVDP not being MVDP and riding more conservatively and adding some tactical play to his game (especially with the 3 Visma's and 2 Trek's around) would feel weird. And likely, it wouldn't have changed the outcome at all.

Fully agree with this post. It definitely was the 'weakest' MvdP I ever saw in Flanders. But still, in 7 editions of the RvV the worst result is still 4th in 2019, bagging 6 podiums in 7 appearances is almost as mind blowing as what Pogacar is doing out there. I genuinely hope he's back in top shape next week together with all the big guns because PR is promising even more than RvV.

 

[Axel Hangleck]

If he was ill as he said, and took antibiotics, then of course it will have affected him - it's not an excuse, it's entirely reasonable. I never understand why people get their knickers in a twist over something like this.......

 

[Peyroteo94]

If he was ill as he said, and took antibiotics, then of course it will have affected him - it's not an excuse, it's entirely reasonable. I never understand why people get their knickers in a twist over something like this.......

There are moments to say things like that. You don't say it right after losing your biggest goal in the season (I'm not saying it wasn't true). In my opinion it isn't elegant. If he wasn't ready to lose, he shouldn't have participated.

 

[Peyroteo94]

Fully agree with this post. It definitely was the 'weakest' MvdP I ever saw in Flanders. But still, in 7 editions of the RvV the worst result is still 4th in 2019, bagging 6 podiums in 7 appearances is almost as mind blowing as what Pogacar is doing out there. I genuinely hope he's back in top shape next week together with all the big guns because PR is promising even more than RvV.

Worst RVV? He was clearly the second strongest yesterday and would win without Pogacar in the race. In 2021 he lost to Asgreen and in 2019 he lost to Bettiol.

 

[Ricco']

In professional sports there are only two ways to communicate after an illness/injury:

If you're feeling ***, you must say that you've never felt better

If you're feeling great and ready to rock, you must say that you're feeling miserable

 

[Keldergoat]

Worst RVV? He was clearly the second strongest yesterday and would win without Pogacar in the race. In 2021 he lost to Asgreen and in 2019 he lost to Bettiol.

I mean it relatively, in 2019 it was his first pro season, he wasn't the big favourite yet, he had to come back from 1:30 on his own without team mates on a peloton that was going full speed and still got 4th. In 2021 he outrode everyone, did the forcing himself on the Kwaremont but was just trumped by an immensely strong Asgreen that day. I found both performances more impressive than yesterday's.

 

[AmRacer]

I mean it relatively, in 2019 it was his first pro season, he wasn't the big favourite yet, he had to come back from 1:30 on his own without team mates on a peloton that was going full speed and still got 4th. In 2021 he outrode everyone, did the forcing himself on the Kwaremont but was just trumped by an immensely strong Asgreen that day. I found both performances more impressive than yesterday's.

Mathieu was the only one who could join Pogi's attacks, until he couldn't. That's quite impressive.

 

[Peyroteo94]

I mean it relatively, in 2019 it was his first pro season, he wasn't the big favourite yet, he had to come back from 1:30 on his own without team mates on a peloton that was going full speed and still got 4th. In 2021 he outrode everyone, did the forcing himself on the Kwaremont but was just trumped by an immensely strong Asgreen that day. I found both performances more impressive than yesterday's.

How many times did he and Pogacar went alone in a berg? He just hit a wall trying to follow Pogacar all the time. For that reason he was completely cooked after Kwaremont.

 

[Keldergoat]

How many times did he and Pogacar went alone in a berg? He just hit a wall trying to follow Pogacar all the time. For that reason he was completely cooked after Kwaremont.

My initital post wasn't to downgrade his performance, I actually found him strong and at times impressive. It was more to showcase how utterly bizarre constant and strong his performances in RvV have been up until now.

 

[jono]

Sometimes, the wisest move is simply choosing silence — especially when the point being made rests on an assumed superiority that reality itself contradicted.

For someone supposedly on a superior level, losing the sprint to Mads — who was considered a tier below — makes that hierarchy look a bit less certain.

Mads is considered a tier below because he is. He is also by far the best sprinter out of that group. Same way that Wout got dusted by Philipsen at P-R 2023 in the sprint, despite Wout being a much stronger rider, on the day and generally. No need to re-shuffle any hierarchies.

 

[Blanco]

Sometimes, the wisest move is simply choosing silence — especially when the point being made rests on an assumed superiority that reality itself contradicted.

For someone supposedly on a superior level, losing the sprint to Mads — who was considered a tier below — makes that hierarchy look a bit less certain

Pogacar lost a sprint to both Van Der Poel and Ganna two weeks ago, so how that reflects on hierarchy?