- Jan 8, 2013
- 584
- 0
- 4,280
Re: Re:
I think what he meant (or at least, this is my opinion) is that he wasn't the protected rider here, he was supposed to be the safety and was supposed to be a domestique. It wasn't a targeted race therefore it becomes a prep race or a training race. Bernal is not close to 100% since he is TRAINING to get there, vs IMO KWAITO who is targeting the earlier rides this year, probably peaking for P-N and maybe the classics.
As for his biggest win, technically yes. It is bigger than Tour of California, Tour de Avenir, many of the 1 day races Bernal has won and obviously bigger than all the mountain bike races or Colombian nationals he has won. I would argue (again, my opinion) that his best performances were at the Tour so far.
TL;DR: biggest WT race win: yes, best WT performance: no, training ride: yes.
Blanco said:Cookster15 said:
Yeah, he won a load of similar races, isn't he
This is the biggest win of his career so far, not a damn training race!
I think what he meant (or at least, this is my opinion) is that he wasn't the protected rider here, he was supposed to be the safety and was supposed to be a domestique. It wasn't a targeted race therefore it becomes a prep race or a training race. Bernal is not close to 100% since he is TRAINING to get there, vs IMO KWAITO who is targeting the earlier rides this year, probably peaking for P-N and maybe the classics.
As for his biggest win, technically yes. It is bigger than Tour of California, Tour de Avenir, many of the 1 day races Bernal has won and obviously bigger than all the mountain bike races or Colombian nationals he has won. I would argue (again, my opinion) that his best performances were at the Tour so far.
TL;DR: biggest WT race win: yes, best WT performance: no, training ride: yes.
Re: Re:
Huh? A win is still a win? So, even more impressive that he won then... if it "wasnt so great".
He handled the crosswinds the best with help from Rowe. Put it in a big effort there. Great TT, as you said. Then could just be solid in the mountain stages and just make sure not to lose time, not having to attack at all to gain time. Relying on a very strong team in the last stage to control and not let others get too much space. Sound like the usual Sky tactics to me.
Sure it would have been a "greater win" had he out-climbed everybody on Turini or attacked and won the race like Soler on the last stage. Didnt have to though because he already pretty much had it in the bag. Having won PN is a good stat, no matter how it happened.
Blanco said:
Huh? A win is still a win? So, even more impressive that he won then... if it "wasnt so great".
He handled the crosswinds the best with help from Rowe. Put it in a big effort there. Great TT, as you said. Then could just be solid in the mountain stages and just make sure not to lose time, not having to attack at all to gain time. Relying on a very strong team in the last stage to control and not let others get too much space. Sound like the usual Sky tactics to me.
Sure it would have been a "greater win" had he out-climbed everybody on Turini or attacked and won the race like Soler on the last stage. Didnt have to though because he already pretty much had it in the bag. Having won PN is a good stat, no matter how it happened.
- Apr 6, 2015
- 828
- 1
- 4,985
I'm intrigued by Bernal's chances in the Giro. I still think it will be extremely difficult for him to overcome Dumoulin, Roglic, and Simon Yates, all of them probably at their best; but if his ITT at Paris-Nice isn't a mirage, he could make it interesting. An additional difficulty he will have to deal with is Sky's traditional lackluster performances in the Giro. And we can't expect Tao Geoghegan Hart and Sosa to all of a sudden mature into the likes of Poels, etc. All of the above considered, I think even a podium would be just short of a minor miracle.
- Apr 16, 2009
- 17,598
- 6,853
- 28,180
I am not worried about the TT. I am more worried about those very hard mountain stages. Anybody can collapse in any of those days. They look very hard, especially for a 22 year old.
Anybody's guess should not be solely focused on the TT only IMHO.
Anybody's guess should not be solely focused on the TT only IMHO.
- Apr 6, 2015
- 828
- 1
- 4,985
Re: Re:
I'm not sure how you can expect Bernal to be above Yates and just a tad below Dumoulin. Those expectations are not based on reality in my opinion.
This doesn't mean he can't podium, or even win the whole thing for that matter. It just means he shouldn't be a favorite, especially above those three riders.
Valv.Piti said:
I'm not sure how you can expect Bernal to be above Yates and just a tad below Dumoulin. Those expectations are not based on reality in my opinion.
This doesn't mean he can't podium, or even win the whole thing for that matter. It just means he shouldn't be a favorite, especially above those three riders.
- Aug 3, 2015
- 22,732
- 10,668
- 28,180
They are certainly based on reality. I have followed cycling for 15 years now and the only GT-riders I have seen close to his potential has to be Andy Schleck and Alberto Contador. Those riders performed at an incredibly high level early on in GTs at 22 and 23 respectively, If Im not mistaken - Andy 2nd in the Giro and Contador winning the Tour, both in 2007. Contador had some very promising results, including his Paris-Nice win and was therefore a dark horse for a Tour with Vinokourov and Valverde as the favourites on paper, but not much more at the time IMO. Bernal, to this day, has showed more than Contador did when he won the Tour. Schleck's 2nd came more out of the blue even though most knew he was super talented, very reminiscent of Ullrich's 2nd place at the same age in TdF 1996 - 22 years of age. Which is, of course, Bernal's age.
I don't think you are understating him or his talent to the extent that some other posters do with great talent, but still a bit. "Let him grow, he is still youn etc." Bernal's time is already now (as crazy as it is) and yes, he can win the Giro and yes, he is one of the favourites. Im calling it as I see it and at this point, I only see Roglic as a better bet for the overall win at the Giro d' Italia everything considered with Dumoulin at the same level as Bernal.
Edit: I have said this for a while now, so its not like its something heat of the moment hot take after his win yesterday.
I don't think you are understating him or his talent to the extent that some other posters do with great talent, but still a bit. "Let him grow, he is still youn etc." Bernal's time is already now (as crazy as it is) and yes, he can win the Giro and yes, he is one of the favourites. Im calling it as I see it and at this point, I only see Roglic as a better bet for the overall win at the Giro d' Italia everything considered with Dumoulin at the same level as Bernal.
Edit: I have said this for a while now, so its not like its something heat of the moment hot take after his win yesterday.
- Apr 16, 2009
- 17,598
- 6,853
- 28,180
- Nov 16, 2013
- 26,622
- 27,671
- 28,180
Re:
I agree with everything here, even if I'm not certain about my hierarchy for the Giro yet. Maybe Roglic, but there's also question marks over him (yesterday was not bad, but they were the first cracks he has displayed this season).
If pressed, I would say that Simon Yates is my biggest favourite for the Giro right now. But it's going to be incredibly interesting.
By the way, Schleck was still just 21 years when the Giro took place, and if we go 15 years back in time, we can also include Cunego on that list given that it's 14 years and 10 months since he won his Giro at 22 years of age.
It wouldn't surprise me if Bernal could surpass Merckx in terms of GT victories. But maybe there is a certain 19 year old Belgian who will have a say here, but it's still early days to assess if he can become as good as Bernal.
Valv.Piti said:
I agree with everything here, even if I'm not certain about my hierarchy for the Giro yet. Maybe Roglic, but there's also question marks over him (yesterday was not bad, but they were the first cracks he has displayed this season).
If pressed, I would say that Simon Yates is my biggest favourite for the Giro right now. But it's going to be incredibly interesting.
By the way, Schleck was still just 21 years when the Giro took place, and if we go 15 years back in time, we can also include Cunego on that list given that it's 14 years and 10 months since he won his Giro at 22 years of age.
It wouldn't surprise me if Bernal could surpass Merckx in terms of GT victories. But maybe there is a certain 19 year old Belgian who will have a say here, but it's still early days to assess if he can become as good as Bernal.
- Jun 7, 2011
- 20,899
- 20,208
- 28,180
I think Bernal is -overall- a better rider than Andy Schleck was. Maybe he can become as good as contador, but surpassing Merckx in terms of GT victories should not be a benchmark. Well, of course, in Merckx's day, you didn't have 3 possible shots to win a GT every year, since they overlapped IIRC. And it's not just Evenepoel, there is Mas, Sosa... and the current contenders (Dumoulin, Roglic, Yates, Lopez... ) aren't exactly retired yet either. And then there are crashes and team orders etc... Even Contador didn't manage that.
But i think it's safe to say Bernal will be a contender for the coming years. I'm hoping for him, it'll be one like Contador, and not like Quintana.
But i think it's safe to say Bernal will be a contender for the coming years. I'm hoping for him, it'll be one like Contador, and not like Quintana.
- Apr 16, 2009
- 17,598
- 6,853
- 28,180
Cookster15
Moderator
- May 14, 2011
- 6,107
- 6,615
- 23,180
Contador was 24 when he won the 2007 Tour. But maybe not helpful comparing Bernal with Andy so soon, Andy bloomed early but basically faded away after 2011 - at only 26. I think Egan will do better than Andy. Easy.
- Jun 9, 2011
- 2,926
- 9
- 11,495
Bernal seems to be a pretty complete rider, which is obviously great for GTs, he is almost always riding near the front in every race and he doesnt seem to have any main weaknesses. In my opinion there are four main favourites for the Giro Roglic, Yates, Dumoulin and Bernal. And I think despite being Sky probably being very young (Bernal, Sosa, Hart, Henao, Sivakov, Moscon) in the Giro, they will be strong, but there might be bad days for some of t he guys.
To the rumours of him possibly doing Giro - Tour I hope that is not true, would be a heavy schedule with Colombia - PN - TA - Alpes - Giro in the early season, hope he goes to the Vuelta.
To the rumours of him possibly doing Giro - Tour I hope that is not true, would be a heavy schedule with Colombia - PN - TA - Alpes - Giro in the early season, hope he goes to the Vuelta.
rick james
BANNED
- Sep 2, 2014
- 7,677
- 110
- 12,680
rick james
BANNED
- Sep 2, 2014
- 7,677
- 110
- 12,680
It will be poor from the team if Bernal goes to the tour after the Giro, he should be rested up
TRENDING THREADS
-
World Championship 2025: Men’s RR, September 28- Started by Berniece
- Replies: 2K
-
European Championship 2025: Men’s RR, October 5- Started by Berniece
- Replies: 855
-
Teams & Riders The Remco Evenepoel is the next Eddy Merckx thread- Started by DNP-Old
- Replies: 35K
-
World Championship 2025: Men’s ITT, September 21- Started by Berniece
- Replies: 942
-
Teams & Riders Tadej Pogačar discussion thread- Started by Lequack
- Replies: 40K
-
Il Lombardia 2025, monument, October 11- Started by Krzysztof_O
- Replies: 171
-
Tre Valli Varesine 2025, one day race, October 7- Started by Lequack
- Replies: 169
Facebook
Twitter
Instagram