Teams & Riders The Remco Evenepoel is the next Eddy Merckx thread

[Oldermanish]

While he may be at his former level, maybe even a notch above already, it is still roughly an entire season that he lost in development. He wasn't a formed and full grown, well rounded athlete before his crash. That means a year of lost experiences (tactics, energy management, bike handling...) at the very least, especially considering he lacked a lot of those experiences, getting into cycling late, riding solo in the juniors and skipping the U23s. Only now that he appears to be fully back to his old level (physically), can he possibly further progress beyond his former level, as he would have, had he not crashed.

Again I agree with a reasonable expectation from a talented athlete. I get the sense that he now appreciates the effort so much more after LBL and the fight it took to get there. He is the only person that can grow from here.

 

[Blobs]

Evenepoel has been back at the level he had before his crash for a while lol.

He still hasn't climbed as well as he did in Burgos, since his crash, so no.

 

[peterfin]

In an article of Het Nieuwsblad, Remco gave more info about his weight: 66,5kg during Algarve/Valencia, 65kg during TA, 64kg Basque/LBL and a ~63kg target for the Vuelta. His weight was 60,5kg during the Giro last year. That's probably too low but the weight difference between the start of his 2021 season and 2022 season is 10%. That's huge! 63-64kg will be his target weight going forward, which will be similar to his weight during the summer of 2020.

 

[hayneplane]

Personally I don’t think we’ve seen him at his previous level until LBL. He looked imperious in Lombardia before the crash and had been so for some weeks. To my eye he’s just gotten back to that level.

Agree with that. We will never know but I felt at the time and still do that he was floating looking so light on the pedals in Lombardia and would have dropped them all with ease on the Civiglio climb and soloed home in similar style to his LBL win.

 

[GuntherL1]

Agree with that. We will never know but I felt at the time and still do that he was floating looking so light on the pedals in Lombardia and would have dropped them all with ease on the Civiglio climb and soloed home in similar style to his LBL win.

If his tactics are up to par as they were in LBL combined with patience to wait for the right opportunity, even better things are to come. The Tour of Norway (not to be underestimated) and Tour de Suisse should be right up his alley.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

In an article of Het Nieuwsblad, Remco gave more info about his weight: 66,5kg during Algarve/Valencia, 65kg during TA, 64kg Basque/LBL and a ~63kg target for the Vuelta. His weight was 60,5kg during the Giro last year. That's probably too low but the weight difference between the start of his 2021 season and 2022 season is 10%. That's huge! 63-64kg will be his target weight going forward, which will be similar to his weight during the summer of 2020.

Is that an assumption of yours, that he weighed 63-64 during the summer of 2020? I remember interviews with him, from during Algarve and Burgos 2020. He was supposed to ride the Giro right after Lombardia, and he was saying he weighed 4kg less in 2020 than he did in 2019. He also said that he wanted to lose more weight towards the 2020 Giro (which he eventually couldn't ride due to his injury) and he was targeting 60kg or less for that. So i find it hard to believe that his summer 2020 weight was 64kg. But he's been vague about how much he weighed before. One day he was below 60 before last year's Giro, and two days later he claimed he was between 60 and 61 kg. But unless he weighed 68kg in 2019 him being 64 in the summer of 2020 just doesn't add up.

 

[peterfin]

Is that an assumption of yours, that he weighed 63-64 during the summer of 2020?

In November 2020, when he was recovering and weighted 59-60kg he said that he weighted 4-5kg tmone year ago. So my assumption is that he was ~64kg during 2020, probably a bit less during the summer months. There was a significant physical difference between the 2020 season and his recovery/2021 season start (e.g. in his face) so that looks reasonable. He may have been closer to 68kg in early 2019. If he can start this season at 66,5kg, he probably had even more weight ("baby fat") when he started his pro career.

 

[Red Rick]

He still hasn't climbed as well as he did in Burgos, since his crash, so no.

That level wasn't that high in the first place. In the Vuelta they went faster in a headwind without trying too hard.

 

[GuntherL1]

According to Het Laatste Nieuws, Evenepoel is also working on his sprint ability. If he can make it semi-decent (let's say not an automatic loss in a small group), this will give him a lot of tactical flexibility.

 

[Red Rick]

According to Het Laatste Nieuws, Evenepoel is also working on his sprint ability. If he can make it semi-decent (let's say not an automatic loss in a small group), this will give him a lot of tactical flexibility.

So he's literally working on everything at the same time?

Working on short efforts makes sense if he's aiming to be a classics rider. Not if he's aiming for the Vuelta 4 months from now.

 

[TomBonnen2005]

So he's literally working on everything at the same time?

Working on short efforts makes sense if he's aiming to be a classics rider. Not if he's aiming for the Vuelta 4 months from now.

Yes to take boni seconds from Roglic since they will probably have the same level on ITT and mountain stages

 

[Blobs]

That level wasn't that high in the first place. In the Vuelta they went faster in a headwind without trying too hard.

That's besides the point.

It was the highest in that race, out of a fairly strong field, and higher than anything we've seen from him since his crash.

 

[Red Rick]

That's besides the point.

It was the highest in that race, out of a fairly strong field, and higher than anything we've seen from him since his crash.

I don't think it's up there with following Bernal on a Giro MTF. That's a GT, not a 2.1 race in the first race after lockdowns.

 

[GuntherL1]

So he's literally working on everything at the same time?

Working on short efforts makes sense if he's aiming to be a classics rider. Not if he's aiming for the Vuelta 4 months from now.

Good observation, but I don't know whether one excludes the other. There are many riders who combine these qualities. Pogacar, Roglic, Yates, Valverde, Higuita... Is it an onrealistic ambition?

 

[Red Rick]

Good observation, but I don't know whether one excludes the other. There are many riders who combine these qualities. Pogacar, Roglic, Yates, Valverde, Higuita... Is it an onrealistic ambition?

Sprints especially are largely down to fast twitch fibers. To have a combination of great sprint and great climbing, you do need a genetic predisposition for both. Now once you have a certain genetic predisposition, typically training sprints comes at the costs of your endurance.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

In November 2020, when he was recovering and weighted 59-60kg he said that he weighted 4-5kg tmone year ago. So my assumption is that he was ~64kg during 2020, probably a bit less during the summer months. There was a significant physical difference between the 2020 season and his recovery/2021 season start (e.g. in his face) so that looks reasonable. He may have been closer to 68kg in early 2019. If he can start this season at 66,5kg, he probably had even more weight ("baby fat") when he started his pro career.

He said he weighed 64 in November 2019, so you assume he weighed 64 during the summer of 2020? Your assumption is completely wrong unless he had been flat out lying to the press every time it was brought up in 2020.

 

[spalco]

Sprints especially are largely down to fast twitch fibers. To have a combination of great sprint and great climbing, you do need a genetic predisposition for both. Now once you have a certain genetic predisposition, typically training sprints comes at the costs of your endurance.

Largely I agree, it's probably futile for Remco to put much time in this. But I suppose to some degree skill plays a role in sprinting too - when to shift, choosing the right line, choosing the right wheel to follow, timing, etc. It's not impossible he could improve to mostly useless in sprints from totally useless, especially at the end of a hard race.

 

[Berflamand]

Largely I agree, it's probably futile for Remco to put much time in this. But I suppose to some degree skill plays a role in sprinting too - when to shift, choosing the right line, choosing the right wheel to follow, timing, etc. It's not impossible he could improve to mostly useless in sprints from totally useless, especially at the end of a hard race.

He supposedly pushes 250 watts more in a sprint now compared with his first year as a pro.

But yeah, in the article mentioned Tom Steels explained that he can't keep progressing his pure speed but that right now the focus is more on tactical insight, technique, feeling and intuition in a sprint.

 

[Breh]

In November 2020, when he was recovering and weighted 59-60kg he said that he weighted 4-5kg tmone year ago. So my assumption is that he was ~64kg during 2020, probably a bit less during the summer months. There was a significant physical difference between the 2020 season and his recovery/2021 season start (e.g. in his face) so that looks reasonable. He may have been closer to 68kg in early 2019. If he can start this season at 66,5kg, he probably had even more weight ("baby fat") when he started his pro career.

All this talk about his weight reminds me of the Contador thread in between seasons.

 

[Red Rick]

All this talk about his weight reminds me of the Contador thread in between seasons.

Spoiler

Guess which one was 2 minutes faster than the other on Arrate

 

[Andre]

I knew weight was important...but I had no idea it was this important. Learning a lot from this forum.

 

[peterfin]

He said he weighed 64 in November 2019, so you assume he weighed 64 during the summer of 2020? Your assumption is completely wrong unless he had been flat out lying to the press every time it was brought up in 2020.

He didn't tell how much he weighted during that period so you can only make a reasonable guess. If you believe it was 60-61kg then his crash and recovery had no real impact. Maybe it was 62kg. Whatever ... My point is that he had rather big changes in weight during his pro career sofar. This obviously has an impact on performance. It looks like he now know what to aim for.

 

[peterfin]

I knew weight was important...but I had no idea it was this important. Learning a lot from this forum.

It's not that important, unless we are talking about outstanding climbing ability of a cyclist. In that case weight has a huge impact. Half of the posts here are about his climbing capabilities so ...

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

He didn't tell how much he weighted during that period so you can only make a reasonable guess. If you believe it was 60-61kg then his crash and recovery had no real impact. Maybe it was 62kg. Whatever ... My point is that he had rather big changes in weight during his pro career sofar. This obviously has an impact on performance. It looks like he now know what to aim for.

Like i said, he said at the beginning of 2020 (Algarve) he weighed between 61 and 62 and wanted to lose more weight before the Giro (summer 2020). That seems more relevant than him weighing 64 in november (off-season) 2019 when trying to determine what his summer weight was. At the team presentation early 2020 he already said he weighed 4kg less than the same time the year before.

I agree he has shifted a lot in weight. I also don't understand how they determine how heavy he should be. GC riders his size are all a lot lighter. Obviously he is no pure climber but even compared to Roglic (who seems to be somewhat comparable as type of rider) who is also taller, 63-64 seems like ''plenty''. I'm especially scratching my head because for both Giro 2020 and 2021 they determined his best weight for a GT should be around 60kg. Now, suddenly it is supposed to be 63. So i'm wondering based on what they have now said he should be 3kg heavier going into the Vuelta than what the plan was for both Giro's. Do they really think he failed at the Giro because he was too skinny? Or did Pelgrim suddenly have an epiphany?

 

[Netserk]

Somewhat similar weight as Porte and Leipheimer (EDIT: and Evans too). Just because he is short doesn't mean that his ideal weight is lower, he is not built like Purito and Rujano. When fully trimmed and in great form, losing an additional kg means less power.

For the first (second, but first optimal) try for GT GC, I think it makes sense for his development to lean a bit in the heavy direction. Rather 63 kg than 62 kg, even if it won't make much of a difference. If anything, I think Pogi shows that power matters far more than being trimmed as much as possible.