Teams & Riders The Remco Evenepoel is the next Eddy Merckx thread

[spalco]

True but that’s also like saying it’s a no-no for Roglic and Vingegaard to win the Dauphine. Periodization is indeed important but if someone is dominating 3 weeks out from the Tour that’s not some sort of kiss of death.

I think you underestimate how tough a 3-week-race is on the human body. If somebody's dominating a few weeks before the Tour, there's a decent chance they are beyond their peak when it matters most.

Only Thomas, Froome and Wiggins have won both Dauphine and Tour in the same year in the last 20 years (and who knows wtf they were doing) and Bernal won Suisse and Tour. That's not a long list (and all-SKY).

 

[Red Rick]

Tr

True but that’s also like saying it’s a no-no for Roglic and Vingegaard to win the Dauphine. Periodization is indeed important but if someone is dominating 3 weeks out from the Tour that’s not some sort of kiss of death.

You mean riders who have known and been preparing to ride the Tour de France all season? There is nothing to win and anything to lose for Evenepoel at the Tour de France. The only good thing about the Tour is he could have excuses if it goes really badly.

 

[Nick2413]

Hmmn, maybe we’re on different trains of thought here. The issue isn’t the winning or not. The issue is a rider being at their absolute best in the Dauphine or Suisse but not being able to hold that form until the 3rd week of the Tour, when race is often decided. I assume Roglic, for instance, was able to win the Dauphine without being at 100%.

I’m not denying that logic, I just think it’s too much speculation to say that it’s ok for Rog or Vingo to win a prep race but not anyone else. If someone like Remco were to completely bury themselves to win a prep race while Rog looks comfy that’s probably a fair assessment, but generally if a rider wins a race within a few weeks of another race I think it’s getting out of hand to pull the periodization card on that.

 

[Nick2413]

You mean riders who have known and been preparing to ride the Tour de France all season? There is nothing to win and anything to lose for Evenepoel at the Tour de France. The only good thing about the Tour is he could have excuses if it goes really badly.

I wouldn’t ride it either if I were him, I’d stick with Vuelta for a variety of reasons. I just don’t think preparing for the Vuelta automatically makes it impossible to do well in the Tour. Sometimes you have to capitalize on good form and being able to adjust if things are really going well can be equally smart.

 

[Ilmaestro99]

Remco to the Tour lol. What are these people smoking? Is he now Jakobsen's lead out ?

 

[Andre]

some big names out already>>>

DNF	ARENSMAN Thymen	Team DSM				-
DNS	VINE Jay	Alpecin-Fenix				-
				-
DNS	ASGREEN Kasper

 

[Eddy Evenepoel]

Disagree. Many riders do TdS/Dauphine build-up to TdF. If he wins tdS then he is on track to TdF just as much as (if not more than) anyone else.

They do TdS/Dauphine as build-up to TDF because they have a well thought plan to use these races as build-up to the tour.

Remco has a well thought through plan that consist of him racing Swiss and then relax and start training for the Tour. Just changing the plan monumentally is never a good thing.

 

[Ripper]

I think you underestimate how tough a 3-week-race is on the human body. If somebody's dominating a few weeks before the Tour, there's a decent chance they are beyond their peak when it matters most.

Only Thomas, Froome and Wiggins have won both Dauphine and Tour in the same year in the last 20 years (and who knows wtf they were doing) and Bernal won Suisse and Tour. That's not a long list (and all-SKY).

LOL ... yuppers!

 

[Red Rick]

You need a really long block of volume before Dauphine probably. Evenepoel raced in Norway.

 

[red_flanders]

They do TdS/Dauphine as build-up to TDF because they have a well thought plan to use these races as build-up to the tour.

Remco has a well thought through plan that consist of him racing Swiss and then relax and start training for the Tour. Just changing the plan monumentally is never a good thing.

Yeah it's not good for him, and not good for the team, which is already organized around other goals than GC. Not that simple to change plans.

He's not Contador, you can't just pull him off the beach and run him into whatever GC.

 

[Red Rick]

Yeah it's not good for him, and not good for the team, which is already organized around other goals than GC. Not that simple to change plans.

He's not Contador, you can't just pull him off the beach and run him into whatever GC.

Contador had a very good reason too. He wasn't invited to the Tour. So he could squeeze a Giro in before the Vuelta, and even then he won that Giro while clearly not being his best.

 

[Extinction]

Tr

True but that’s also like saying it’s a no-no for Roglic and Vingegaard to win the Dauphine. Periodization is indeed important but if someone is dominating 3 weeks out from the Tour that’s not some sort of kiss of death.

Good point. I dunno, sometimes I think you need a crystal ball to see into the future.

 

[Andre]

I hope Stage 5 is the one where Remco surges ahead of his competitors.

 

[Big Doopie]

I hope Stage 5 is the one where Remco surges ahead of his competitors.

hmm. the question is whether he will think it worth it before the unknown of 6 & 7.

also, today he was very badly placed at the bottom of the last climb (team hurting?). And he did not reposition himself very fast. He then hung at the back of the lead group the whole way in. has he learned to truly save himself (economy of effort) or was he not feeling so great...?

 

[Extinction]

Yeah it's not good for him, and not good for the team, which is already organized around other goals than GC. Not that simple to change plans.

He's not Contador, you can't just pull him off the beach and run him into whatever GC.

That's right and I remember the beach ridden Contador encroaching on Bruseghin's winning time in the last tt, as it was happening, with the RAI journalist asking the donkey owning Bruseghin his thoughts on the proceedings: "Bruseghin, what are your thoughts?", Bruseghin: "Bisogna fermarlo (He must be stopped)!"... In the end Bruseghin won, Contador second, but he won that Giro.

 

[kingjr]

hmm. the question is whether he will think it worth it before the unknown of 6 & 7.

also, today he was very badly placed at the bottom of the last climb (team hurting?). And he did not reposition himself very fast. He then hung at the back of the lead group the whole way in. has he learned to truly save himself (economy of effort) or was he not feeling so great...?

Ideally, he's saving energy, worst case he's getting ill. We'll see x)

 

[Prim]

hmm. the question is whether he will think it worth it before the unknown of 6 & 7.

also, today he was very badly placed at the bottom of the last climb (team hurting?). And he did not reposition himself very fast. He then hung at the back of the lead group the whole way in. has he learned to truly save himself (economy of effort) or was he not feeling so great...?

I think he looked super-comfortable to be honest. Even thought to myself that he has learned to save energy and let things play out without him flailing about.

 

[Cookster15]

He's not Contador, you can't just pull him off the beach and run him into whatever GC.

Not this myth again. As if Contador wasn't training before the 2008 Giro. If he was that good he never have lost a race.

 

[red_flanders]

Not this myth again. As if Contador wasn't training before the 2008 Giro. If he was that good he never have lost a race.

Relax, Francis. You missed the smiley face?

 

[Cookster15]

I’m not denying that logic, I just think it’s too much speculation to say that it’s ok for Rog or Vingo to win a prep race but not anyone else. If someone like Remco were to completely bury themselves to win a prep race while Rog looks comfy that’s probably a fair assessment, but generally if a rider wins a race within a few weeks of another race I think it’s getting out of hand to pull the periodization card on that.

FYI, Roglic was returning from injury. His Dauphine performance was better than anyone could expect. Roglic will be much fresher and stronger for the TdF.

 

[Cookster15]

Relax, Francis. You missed the smiley face?

Sorry but the Contador 2008 Giro "sitting on a beach" claim has annoyed me for 14 years . Its not something I would joke about because some of his fanboys actually believed it. Alberto was a fantastic rider but is subject to the same rules of human physiology as everyone else.

 

[houtdffan]

Not this myth again. As if Contador wasn't training before the 2008 Giro. If he was that good he never have lost a race.

Conta was supposed to race the Dauphine and humiliate ASO that year. That was when ASO was all out against Bryuneel and refused to allow Bruyneel's team race.

He was a few weeks before reaching his peak when he raced that Giro

 

[Extinction]

Certainly riding for GC requires strategic weapons, as opposed to tactical weapons. Tactical weapons suit those alla MvDP, who can't compete for overall victory. By contrast, strategic weapons are applied by those who can. Thus only on stages in which destruction can be achieved for overall victory do those riders go on the attack. If, then, the course design does not afford deploynent of strategic weapons for too many stages, well then we end up with a boring race till the end. But this is not Remco's fault, but the race organizers.

 

[red_flanders]

Sorry but the Contador 2008 Giro "sitting on a beach" claim has annoyed me for 14 years . Its not something I would joke about because some of his fanboys actually believed it. Alberto was a fantastic rider but is subject to the same rules of human physiology as everyone else.

Astana was invited to the Giro a WEEK before it started. While he wasn't exactly devoid of racing (and hence the smiley face), he also certainly hadn't prepared specifically for the Giro. Not sure what about that it so annoying? Whether he actually was on the beach when he got the call no one but the team knows, but certainly it was impressive that he was able to win given his sub-optimal prep.

 

[Cookster15]

He was a few weeks before reaching his peak when he raced that Giro

Biased conjecture not reality. Alberto had plenty of base and form else he could not have won that Giro.