The Tour is way too hard after the Giro to make any sense for him this year. Won’t do the Tour.
The Tour is way too hard after the Giro to make any sense for him this year. Won’t do the Tour.
That’s what they said about Alberto Contador after he crushed the 2011 Giro (“soft pedalled”). Contador started that Tour as overwhelming favourite. But the fatigue of the Giro was evident in his legs even though he showed flashes of his brilliance in July. We will see how Remco copes. First he needs to focus on the Giro and put the TdF out of his mind.I'd wait and see how the giro goes. If he leads by 6 minutes after the second TT and soft peddles the rest of the giro, then send him to the tour. If it is a stress filled giro down to the final MTT, then hell no
Why would ASO see a business opportunity in designing a Remco friendly course? Britain was an unconquered market with Wiggins. Not so Belgium.Remco is young, already has a GT in his bag, this '24 Tour is not for him but ASO will soon feel the pressure to design a course for him like they did with the Brits, smell where the money is and Wiggo benefited from it.
Time is on Remco's side. He needs to take care of business in '23 tho'.
Doubtless this is the case, however, going into it in 2024 with no experience of the race might lead to a lackluster result. When Pog unexpectedly won on his first attempt in 2020 still aged 21, he "shocked the world." However, that year the Tour was effectively in an interregnum period, with the Sky era over and a more open race that Jumbo-Visma could not yet take by the horns. Opportunity was thus there to pull off a heist (which is what effectively happened against Roglic). By contrast when Remco goes presumably next year, he will face not one, but two powerhouse teams with incredibly strong and experienced leaders. Teams and proven leaders that know how to win or take second at the Tour on more than one occasion. So not only Remco, but QS will have some serious catching up to do, with no experience of going for GC as the goal from the outset. This is why I think he and his team should go sooner than later to initiate that process. And then the pressure will be even greater in 2024. But, yes, having decided upon the Giro this season, which is actually better for me, makes a Tour debut all but impossible now.The Tour is way too hard after the Giro to make any sense for him this year. Won’t do the Tour.
That’s what they said about Alberto Contador after he crushed the 2011 Giro (“soft pedalled”). Contador started that Tour as overwhelming favourite. But the fatigue of the Giro was evident in his legs even though he showed flashes of his brilliance in July. We will see how Remco copes. First he needs to focus on the Giro and put the TdF out of his mind.
Well the 2011 Giro was a super tough parcours, with high mountains in the cold, etc. And then Alberto was still in a weird position with the Clen affair, which I think affected him at that Tour, during which in any case he fell hard early on and any brilliance he may have started with lost its luster from that point forward.That’s what they said about Alberto Contador after he crushed the 2011 Giro (“soft pedalled”). Contador started that Tour as overwhelming favourite. But the fatigue of the Giro was evident in his legs even though he showed flashes of his brilliance in July. We will see how Remco copes. First he needs to focus on the Giro and put the TdF out of his mind.
Why would ASO see a business opportunity in designing a Remco friendly course? Britain was an unconquered market with Wiggins. Not so Belgium.
Totally agree. It will be about QS support as much as Remco and the Giro gives them a good chance to identify needed support. It can also be pointlessly too hard for fan satisfaction.Doubtless this is the case, however, going into it in 2024 with no experience of the race might lead to a lackluster result. When Pog unexpectedly won on his first attempt in 2020 still aged 21, he "shocked the world." However, that year the Tour was effectively in an interregnum period, with the Sky era over and a more open race that Jumbo-Visma could not yet take by the horns. Opportunity was thus there to pull off a heist (which is what effectively happened against Roglic). By contrast when Remco goes presumably next year, he will face not one, but two powerhouse teams with incredibly strong and experienced leaders. Teams and proven leaders that know how to win or take second at the Tour on more than one occasion. So not only Remco, but QS will have some serious catching up to do, with no experience of going for GC as the goal from the outset. This is why I think he and his team should go sooner than later to initiate that process. And then the pressure will be even greater in 2024. But, yes, having decided upon the Giro this season, which is actually better for me, makes a Tour debut all but impossible now.
Right, but the thing is Pog and Vingo will have 3, 4 years of experience, with teams to back them up, to Remco's 0 next year. At any rate, I'll enjoy the Giro and then the Tour, because the rivalry between Pog and Vingo, after that of Remco and Primoz shall be fun to watch. After all, that's what drives fans, the big showdowns between those at the top of the sport, which makes cycling so dramatic throughout the year. Because every major race when the sport's big guns line up, is a Superbowl, a World Cup finals.Totally agree. It will be about QS support as much as Remco and the Giro gives them a good chance to identify needed support. It can also be pointlessly too hard for fan satisfaction.
Actually I meant that some of the Giro climbing stages are so hard as to only appeal to fans that want to be able to walk alongside their heroes instead of running. That will kill your legs for another GT if you're not absolutely timing your form correctly.Right, but the thing is Pog and Vingo will have 3, 4 years of experience, with teams to back them up, to Remco's 0 next year. At any rate, I'll enjoy the Giro and then the Tour, because the rivalry between Pog and Vingo, after that of Remco and Primoz shall be fun to watch. After all, that's what drives fans, the big showdowns between those at the top of the sport, which makes cycling so dramatic throughout the year. Because every major race when the sport's big guns line up, is a Superbowl, a World Cup finals.
By "pointlessly too hard," I take it you mean the Giro-Tour double. Yea, it's like that, although it would be a shame if the current level, and perhaps the image of the sport, will prevent serious attempts to win both during a season in the future.
I'd say he's taking an upgrade from riding in a wind blown desert.It appears we won't see a showdown...Tadej is backing out of UAE
I think it's unfair to say that Remco would have 0 experience next year. Sure he won't have ridden the Tour then, but he might have already won 2 GT's which is more important. And yes TDF is a different beast, but I don't think the racing itself will be different, it's more the environment around it. But that won't have an impact on him I think.Right, but the thing is Pog and Vingo will have 3, 4 years of experience, with teams to back them up, to Remco's 0 next year. At any rate, I'll enjoy the Giro and then the Tour, because the rivalry between Pog and Vingo, after that of Remco and Primoz shall be fun to watch. After all, that's what drives fans, the big showdowns between those at the top of the sport, which makes cycling so dramatic throughout the year. Because every major race when the sport's big guns line up, is a Superbowl, a World Cup finals.
By "pointlessly too hard," I take it you mean the Giro-Tour double. Yea, it's like that, although it would be a shame if the current level, and perhaps the image of the sport, will prevent serious attempts to win both during a season in the future.
Ah, but the Giro climbs are also the beauty of the race. Merckx won Blockhaus and Tre Cime di Lavaredo, saying the later was his greatest exploit in the mountains of his entire career. I thus don't think they only appeal to fans wanting to walk alongside their heroes, but rightly give the Giro it's mystique (who could forget a young Pantani charging up the Mortirolo like a raging bull in 94, dropping a certain Indurain by some 3 and a half minutes?).Actually I meant that some of the Giro climbing stages are so hard as to only appeal to fans that want to be able to walk alongside their heroes instead of running. That will kill your legs for another GT if you're not absolutely timing your form correctly.
Every pro says the Tour is the Tour, while winning the Vuelta and Giro doesn't compare to the French race. Now going up next year against seasoned guys like Pog and Vingo, I'm thinking Remco will need to gain experience before he is able to make a solid bid for overall victory. In other words, not only does the race come with more pressure, but his foes will be seasoned veterans with wins to their names, just as he will be learning the ropes on the biggest stage of the sport.I think it's unfair to say that Remco would have 0 experience next year. Sure he won't have ridden the Tour then, but he might have already won 2 GT's which is more important. And yes TDF is a different beast, but I don't think the racing itself will be different, it's more the environment around it. But that won't have an impact on him I think.
I don’t think being a seasoned veteran is as important these days as it used to be. Pog and Vingo were both Tour newbies when they won and took 2nd place in their first TdF respectively, as domestiques nonetheless. Then they dominated again the next years.Every pro says the Tour is the Tour, while winning the Vuelta and Giro doesn't compare to the French race. Now going up next year against seasoned guys like Pog and Vingo, I'm thinking Remco will need to gain experience before he is able to make a solid bis for overall victory. In other words, not only does the race come with more pressure, but his foes will be seasoned veterans with wins to the, just as he will be learning the ropes on the biggest stage of the sport.
soft pedals the rest of the giroI'd wait and see how the giro goes. If he leads by 6 minutes after the second TT and soft peddles the rest of the giro, then send him to the tour. If it is a stress filled giro down to the final MTT, then hell no
To the first bolded, precisely because it's those two, prodigous talents to be sure, who came good so young, we're talking about exceptions. And in theory they should be hitting their stride over the next several seasons. This means they will be even stronger than what allowed them to reach the top of the Tour so precosciously. Pog's first Tour victory was surprising, only because we didn't yet know him to be capable of such things so soon. Vingo's win was no less sensational, because he actually toppled Pog, even though he was a strong runner up the previous year. Thus not only will Remco be going into the race for the first time, but he will be facing two formitable foes, the likes of which the sport, as himself, has not scene in a several decades. Lemond in 84 was only third to Fignon and Hinault in his first Tour, over 10 minutes back from the maillot jaune. Sure, those were vastly different times, and Greg was not the team leader, but arguably as far as the Tour is concerned, Hinault and Fignon were to him, what Pog and Vingo will be to Evenepoel in his first Grand Bouclé. Experience I think in this case will thus matter. It's only a question of how much vs. how good Remco will be.I don’t think being a seasoned veteran is as important these days as it used to be. Pog and Vingo were both Tour newbies when they won and took 2nd place in their first TdF respectively, as domestiques nonetheless. Then they dominated again the next years.
Remco has as much experience and better palmares as either of them did at the time, even if you exclude the Giro he didn’t have time to prepare for. I’m not even an outright Remco fan but the fact he is new to the Tour means nothing based on real world results of everyone around him in this era.
Although he won't be leasing Roglic by 6 minutes after the second TT.I'd wait and see how the giro goes. If he leads by 6 minutes after the second TT and soft peddles the rest of the giro, then send him to the tour. If it is a stress filled giro down to the final MTT, then hell no
Every pro says the Tour is the Tour, while winning the Vuelta and Giro doesn't compare to the French race. Now going up next year against seasoned guys like Pog and Vingo, I'm thinking Remco will need to gain experience before he is able to make a solid bid for overall victory. In other words, not only does the race come with more pressure, but his foes will be seasoned veterans with wins to their names, just as he will be learning the ropes on the biggest stage of the sport.