Teams & Riders The Remco Evenepoel is the next Eddy Merckx thread

[Sciatic]

remco needs to abandon everything else,but long climbing.forget every 1 day race and stage racing for ayear.only way.

Please no, dont abandon all the things you’re great at just to have a chance to maybe be good (but not great) at another.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

remco needs to abandon everything else,but long climbing.forget every 1 day race and stage racing for ayear.only way.

Remco needs to level up like Pog did from 2023 to 2024. I would seriously have liked to see how Evenepoel would have compared to pre-2024 Pog last year in the Tour and this year during WCC/ECC.

 

[VayaVayaVaya]

Yeah, I actually don't know if I agree. I think it's totally fine for him to continue prioritizing along his current relative strengths, which IMO are: 1) ITT, 2) Hilly classics + championships, 3) Stage races. This is still the most interesting path and potentially most rewarding for him and his fans, and he can still win across disciplines, though it will be tougher (outside of ITT, where he reigns supreme).

However, if he is not satisfied with where he fits in the hierarchy in stage races and/or classics, I'd recommend he pick one or the other of Hilly classics OR stage races to 100% focus on. I think he could still win or at least contend for wins in the other, but if he wants to be the best in classics or stage races in a world with Pogacar, Vingegaard, and MVDP, I think he should pick a primary focus area and let the other should be a byproduct.

IMO, his easiest path is to go all in on classics, in which case he has a realistic chance of competing with Pogacar in LBL, IL, and WCRR and a decent chance at developing into a contender at MSR and RVV. P-R wouldn't be impossible but nothing he has done so far indicates he could win that race. He could still probably do OK in some stage races, though not realistically target a GT win in this scenario. I'd love to see what he can do in a classics focused calendar. I think this fits better with his natural talents.

Alternate scenario is a little less interesting IMO. That scenario involves relentless focus on weight, watts/kg, long climbs while maintaining but not focusing on his ITT skills. Classics should take a backseat to a calendar full of stage races. IMO, I'd target a win or two in a one week stage race, plus would do the Giro + Vuelta next year. After a year of laser focus on stage racing, I'd take stock and go all in on a Froome style calendar focused on the Tour in 2027.

Just my two cents.

 

[Berniece]

what you mean... did he have to ? you dont think Pog can drop Remco on 2km 10% climb ? If Pogacar wanted to make his life easy he would just drop everybody on last climb and I am 100% he could.

1.5km at 10% is a different effort than 7km’s. Doesn’t take as long. He barely went faster than Evenepoel when both of them were solo on the climbs. Nothing showed he would’ve dropped Evenepoel on such a short effort.

 

[AmRacer]

1.5km at 10% is a different effort than 7km’s. Doesn’t take as long. He barely went faster than Evenepoel when both of them were solo on the climbs. Nothing showed he would’ve dropped Evenepoel on such a short effort.

Of course Pogi didn't went full gas. He can easily drop Remco whenever he wants.

 

[chickenlips]

So many imaginary scenarios where Remco could beat Pog, but in reality he would be better avoiding him.

 

[dobrien]

Pogacar almost always stays at the front and monitors who attacks though. That’s why he’s not caught in the back with Evenepoel or MVDP when stuff starts to kick off. Nor has he not had any qualms of following an attack on the flat.

Beat me to it! Unlike Remco (who I'm regularly yelling at on the TV) I honestly cannot remember the last time I've seen Pog out of position. That's one of the biggest problems Remco has trying to compete with Pog; Tadej is far more than just a watt monster. He has great positional and tactical sense, great bike handler and descender, etc etc. Imho, outside of dedicated TT's he currently seems better than Remco in just about every aspect of cycling which matters; until Pog starts his decline he's going to be a very very difficult nut for the kid to crack.

And I say this all as a big Remco fan, so please hold the flames (I realize this is probably a futile request! )

 

[Berniece]

So many imaginary scenarios where Remco could beat Pog, but in reality he would be better avoiding him.

Avoid him? If Evenepoel needs to start avoiding him, then no one needs to ride against Pogacar anymore. You guys really are desperate to see him reach the amount of wins Merckx had.

 

[dobrien]

Please no, dont abandon all the things you’re great at just to have a chance to maybe be good (but not great) at another.

This times about a million.

 

[peterfin]

Of course Pogi didn't went full gas. He can easily drop Remco whenever he wants.

Even if he could, the gap might not be big enough. Remco would have a clear target in the decent. Maybe Pogacar could go all in to keep him at distance during the last pass over the climb but earlier it would be difficult and tactically better to join forces.

 

[The fridge in the blue trees]

Remco already has a spectacular palmares himself and outside of MvP the only one really willing to take it to Pog.

Ah, that's the new narrative I see. Remco the only one trying. Mathieu too, but since it's only in 3 races really, hardly counts. Remco is the man. Pogacar's equal when it comes to mentality! Vingegaard of course never ever tries to beat Pogacar, no winning mentality. Nobody tries but Remco! Complete BS. Remco is just the only one that at this point can somehow hope to beat Pogacar in a certain type of 1 day races. It's not lack of trying in the case of let's say Lipowitz and Van Gils. It's lack of legs. Remco is not above the rest in mentality, just in legs. Except Vingegaard in GTs. Possibly Almeida by now, but ok, he never tries to beat Pogacar, that's true.

 

[SHAD0W93]

Avoid him? If Evenepoel needs to start avoiding him, then no one needs to ride against Pogacar anymore. You guys really are desperate to see him reach the amount of wins Merckx had.

What has Evenepoel stopped Pogacar winning besides AGR this year, two Tour TT stages, and a bronze WC TT medal? It hasn’t been like Evenepoel beat Pogacar like MVDP or Vingegaard directly stopping additional monument, Tour, and stage wins.

 

[peterfin]

Yeah, I actually don't know if I agree. I think it's totally fine for him to continue prioritizing along his current relative strengths, which IMO are: 1) ITT, 2) Hilly classics + championships, 3) Stage races. This is still the most interesting path and potentially most rewarding for him and his fans, and he can still win across disciplines, though it will be tougher (outside of ITT, where he reigns supreme).

However, if he is not satisfied with where he fits in the hierarchy in stage races and/or classics, I'd recommend he pick one or the other of Hilly classics OR stage races to 100% focus on. I think he could still win or at least contend for wins in the other, but if he wants to be the best in classics or stage races in a world with Pogacar, Vingegaard, and MVDP, I think he should pick a primary focus area and let the other should be a byproduct.

IMO, his easiest path is to go all in on classics, in which case he has a realistic chance of competing with Pogacar in LBL, IL, and WCRR and a decent chance at developing into a contender at MSR and RVV. P-R wouldn't be impossible but nothing he has done so far indicates he could win that race. He could still probably do OK in some stage races, though not realistically target a GT win in this scenario. I'd love to see what he can do in a classics focused calendar. I think this fits better with his natural talents.

Alternate scenario is a little less interesting IMO. That scenario involves relentless focus on weight, watts/kg, long climbs while maintaining but not focusing on his ITT skills. Classics should take a backseat to a calendar full of stage races. IMO, I'd target a win or two in a one week stage race, plus would do the Giro + Vuelta next year. After a year of laser focus on stage racing, I'd take stock and go all in on a Froome style calendar focused on the Tour in 2027.

Just my two cents.

He shouldn't give up his TdF dream but he obviously has the biggest chance to challenge him in the classics and WC RR. The gap between him and the rest is huge too so it is a matter of minimizing the damage on the climbs to have a chance in the races with hard climbs.

I think he has the qualities to go for the 5 classics. Even P-R seems doable. His low weight makes it hard but his endurance is only challenged by Pogacar and MVDP.

 

[Skalman]

Has he ever done P-R? If not isn't now the perfect time to try something new, I imagine he can hang with Pog, MVDP and Mads for a good while

 

[red_flanders]

Has he ever done P-R? If not isn't now the perfect time to try something new, I imagine he can hang with Pog, MVDP and Mads for a good while

I don't have the impression that bashing himself over the cobbles is anything he's particularly interested in or frankly, suited for.

 

[Shortcut]

Has he ever done P-R? If not isn't now the perfect time to try something new, I imagine he can hang with Pog, MVDP and Mads for a good while

No he can't. Cobbles in a peloton with a Remco's history of injuries and his terrible positioning that would be really bad. Almost same goes for Flanders. Remco should do T-A (better for him than P-N), Amstel, LBL and Giro. After that TdF-WC-EC-GdL.

 

[Shortcut]

Avoid him? If Evenepoel needs to start avoiding him, then no one needs to ride against Pogacar anymore. You guys really are desperate to see him reach the amount of wins Merckx had.

I am also not fan of Remco avoiding Pogacar but when was he really a problem for Pogacar in terms of "reach the amount of wins Merckx had"?. He won 2 LBL because Pogacar DNF. Other than that he is not really Pogacar's problem. "Avoiding" is only in disscusion because of Remco. He is clear number two in hilly classics, so why always losing against Pogacar if he can easily win some classics like San Sebastian, Amstel if Pogacar is not there. The only real problem for Pogacar is MvDP and only he is the only one who should never avoid Pogacar.

 

[dobrien]

No he can't. Cobbles in a peloton with a Remco's history of injuries and his terrible positioning that would be really bad. Almost same goes for Flanders. Remco should do T-A (better for him than P-N), Amstel, LBL and Giro. After that TdF-WC-EC-GdL.

Agreed; he isn't remotely the rider he needs to be, in either positioning or bike handling, for PR or De Ronde.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

He won 2 LBL because Pogacar DNF.

No need to rewrite history. Reality is bad enough as it is. Evenepoel won LBL in 2022 and 2023. Those years Pogacar was very much beatable. He had to sprint against Mas in Lombardia 2022, he lost Emilia to Mas, he was nowhere in Wollongong, 4th in Flanders, 12th in Fleche, lost the Tour. In 2023 he lost Emilia to Roglic, needed the race director to save him from Healy in Amstel, wasn't able to drop a dozen riders in Tre Valli and became 5th, lost Worlds to Van der Poel, lost the Tour... That was a completely different Pogacar.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

I think he has the qualities to go for the 5 classics. Even P-R seems doable. His low weight makes it hard but his endurance is only challenged by Pogacar and MVDP.

His endurance is not challenged by MvdP, not even remotely.

Has he ever done P-R? If not isn't now the perfect time to try something new, I imagine he can hang with Pog, MVDP and Mads for a good while

He did at the juniors. Was leading the race until his handlebars broke, had to change bikes, rejoined the front of the race and then punctured both front and back tires, had to walk the entire Carrefour de l'Arbre sector and finally finished OTL. When he first became pro, he gave an interview that he hated cobbles and didn't want to ride Roubaix ever again. Of course, since then he did very well in the 2021 WCC which had plenty of cobbles and he won Brabantse Pijl as well. Not exactly Roubaix, but perhaps his stance towards the race has softened a bit. But i doubt it fits in his plans anytime soon.

 

[topt]

1.5km at 10% is a different effort than 7km’s. Doesn’t take as long. He barely went faster than Evenepoel when both of them were solo on the climbs. Nothing showed he would’ve dropped Evenepoel on such a short effort.

after all we know about this 2 riders you are still going with this take..... OK

 

[AmRacer]

No need to rewrite history. Reality is bad enough as it is. Evenepoel won LBL in 2022 and 2023. Those years Pogacar was very much beatable. He had to sprint against Mas in Lombardia 2022, he lost Emilia to Mas, he was nowhere in Wollongong, 4th in Flanders, 12th in Fleche, lost the Tour. In 2023 he lost Emilia to Roglic, needed the race director to save him from Healy in Amstel, wasn't able to drop a dozen riders in Tre Valli and became 5th, lost Worlds to Van der Poel, lost the Tour... That was a completely different Pogacar.

Now you are rewriting history

 

[Oldman]

1.5km at 10% is a different effort than 7km’s. Doesn’t take as long. He barely went faster than Evenepoel when both of them were solo on the climbs. Nothing showed he would’ve dropped Evenepoel on such a short effort.

The ghosts of Fleche Wallonne and Liege would suggest you are wrong. At Fleche, Remco was on Pogacar's wheel when he accelerated....

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

The ghosts of Fleche Wallonne and Liege would suggest you are wrong. At Fleche, Remco was on Pogacar's wheel when he accelerated....

You mean this year? After it was already clear he was getting worse every day because what happened in the winter? With a complete implosion following mere days later at LBL? And Dauphiné and Tour as extra evidence?

While i agree Pog would likely have been able to drop Evenepoel on one of those murs, bringing up this year's Fleche, and even worse, Liège, isn't exactly the argument you are hoping it to be.

 

[Shortcut]

No need to rewrite history. Reality is bad enough as it is. Evenepoel won LBL in 2022 and 2023. Those years Pogacar was very much beatable. He had to sprint against Mas in Lombardia 2022, he lost Emilia to Mas, he was nowhere in Wollongong, 4th in Flanders, 12th in Fleche, lost the Tour. In 2023 he lost Emilia to Roglic, needed the race director to save him from Healy in Amstel, wasn't able to drop a dozen riders in Tre Valli and became 5th, lost Worlds to Van der Poel, lost the Tour... That was a completely different Pogacar.

Uff, i can't believe somebody could put it like that. In 2022 he was 4th at Flanders but because he really f.ked up finish. He was already there with MvDP. Also he won Lombardia. Those preparation races when he lost (that is all what they are for him) are totally irelevant. Reality is he was already second best st Flanders in 2022 and then best in 2023. He won both years GdL. And LBL would be the same. Quebec, Montreal, Emilia, Tree Valli, E3, Amstel, FW are just preparation races for him, yes he still wins most of them because he wants to win them all at least one time, but they are not his big goals.